The Rays Have An Offensive Outburst and Beat the Braves 10-4
by BenDuronio on Jun 16, 2010 2:18 AM EDT
in Braves Game Recaps
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Nothing went right for the Braves on Tuesday night. Kenshin Kawakami and Chris Resop both had rough outings, although Kawakami was plagued by poor defense behind him. The defense committed a total of four errors throughout the contest, including a big first inning throwing error by Yunel Escobar. The Rays scored four in the first inning alone. The offense amassed 13 total hits but they only converted four runs. The left on base total for the night was 14.
Kawakami allowed nine base runners in five innings. He did strike out six and three of the runs he allowed were unearned. It wasn't a great night for Kenshin but he settled down as the game progressed.
David Price didn't pitch particularly well and was rather inefficient over the course of his outing. He only threw five innings and allowed ten total base runners. He was fortunate that the Braves had trouble converting in big situations and that his offense was absolutely destroying everything the Braves' pitchers had to offer.
Evan Longoria had a big night as he went 2-5 with a home run (12), a double, and three RBI. The rest of the Rays lineup had a field day as well. The Rays had six extra base hits to the Braves' two. In addition, Sean Rodriguez, Carl Crawford, Longoria, and Carlos Pena all had two-out RBI whereas Melky Cabrera was the only Brave to come through with two outs.
On a day filled with talks about Chipper Jones potentially impending retirement, the future Hall-of-Famer had both of the Braves extra base hits. Unfortunately, they both came in two of his lower stress at bats rather than the pressure spots he came up in when the game was semi-close. Chipper struck out with two outs and men on the corners in the bottom of the fourth. At the time, the game was 5-2. Chipper came up again while the game was 7-3 but the Braves had put the first two batters of the inning on base and if they were going to make a come back, this was the time to do it. Chipper hit the ball well but flew out to left. His double earlier in the game lead to the Braves' second run and his home run (4) in the bottom of the eighth was the last run scored for either team.
Chris Resop's re-entry into the big leagues did not go nearly as well as hoped. The right hander who saw a great deal of success at Gwinnett pitched two innings and allowed five hits, three walks, and five runs while striking out two.
Tomorrow, Tommy Hanson (6-3) faces off against Wade Davis (5-6) at 7:10 EST.
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To be honest
this was one of the worst games all season.
"Sharks have a week dedicated to Jason Heyward."
Yep
Suckage, all around.
I think they might have gotten back into it eventually, even with all of the missed opportunities early, if Resop had done much of anything. AAAA.
It didn’t make the difference and I think if affected both sides but jeez louise did Dreckman suck a donkey’s balls tonight. When Troy Glaus is furious at you, you’re wrong. Period.
HUMANS AT WEBADDRESS FANGRAPHS & BASEBALLPROSPECTS PERHAPS WILL SPEAK ILL OF PERFORMANCE TONIGHT DUE TO MAGICAL MEANINGLESS "WHIP"
the defense behind kawakami didnt struggle
he was the one struggle on defense, at least one of those errors was on an errant pickoff throw and he bobbled a sac bunt that shouldve been at least an out at first. I know Kawakmai isnt a bad ptcher given his stats, but the guy is just not a winner, and he just cant pitch to the situation, whenever we dont need him to be that sharp he pitches brilliantly, but when we need him to pitch well or in tight situations he almost always pitches terribly. I really dont see KK or care to see him in a Braves uniform next year. Lets just hope he can salvage this season by helping in the bullpen where he will undoubtedly be after tonight and Medlen’s latest game
Also, the Rays leadoff man is John Jaso, not John Jason
HUMAN TEAMMATE HEYWARD JASON FOR FRANCHISE MVP AFTER TAKING MATTERS INTO OWN HANDS AND REMOVING MCLOUTH NATE FROM LINEUP
Indeed, that's the third time I've naturally typed Jason today
I blame Heyward.
Twitter: @Ben_Duronio
Talking Chop had one of it's busiest days of the season on Tuesday
I can only think of Opening Day and Brooks Conrad’s GS day having more visitors and/or page views. Kinda odd.
"Sharks have a week dedicated to Jason Heyward."
Maybe Bobby will start calling Heyward “Jaso”
HUMANS AT WEBADDRESS FANGRAPHS & BASEBALLPROSPECTS PERHAPS WILL SPEAK ILL OF PERFORMANCE TONIGHT DUE TO MAGICAL MEANINGLESS "WHIP"
He already does, doesn’t he?
And shit…I’m gonna miss the “come on kid!” from Bobby in the dugout next year. I’m gonna miss it a lot.
"Sharks have a week dedicated to Jason Heyward."
by Scott Coleman on Jun 16, 2010 3:22 AM EDT up reply actions
He usually just adds “-ey” to your name.
HUMANS AT WEBADDRESS FANGRAPHS & BASEBALLPROSPECTS PERHAPS WILL SPEAK ILL OF PERFORMANCE TONIGHT DUE TO MAGICAL MEANINGLESS "WHIP"
Jasoney? Heywardey?
I don’t think so…
"Sharks have a week dedicated to Jason Heyward."
by Scott Coleman on Jun 16, 2010 4:16 AM EDT via mobile up reply actions
Nor: Pradoey, Infanteey, Chipperey, Hinskeey, Escobarey, Cabrerraey/Melkyey… LOL
I believe there ought to be a constitutional amendment outlawing Astroturf and the designated hitter. ~ Crash Davis
by Old Braves' Fan on Jun 16, 2010 10:20 AM EDT up reply actions
"Kid"
Is the other go-to thing. I swear, I think he called Glaus that last night.
HUMANS AT WEBADDRESS FANGRAPHS & BASEBALLPROSPECTS PERHAPS WILL SPEAK ILL OF PERFORMANCE TONIGHT DUE TO MAGICAL MEANINGLESS "WHIP"
Yup
He even called Chipper that on Wednesday night. Then again, at Bobby’s age there aren’t too many people on the field he can’t logically call, “Kid!” lol
I believe there ought to be a constitutional amendment outlawing Astroturf and the designated hitter. ~ Crash Davis
by Old Braves' Fan on Jun 17, 2010 3:06 PM EDT up reply actions
It's either...
Jaso or Jace….
"It breaks your heart. It is designed to break your heart. The game begins in the spring, when everything else begins again, and it blossoms in the summer, filling the afternoons and evenings, and then as soon as the chill rains come, it stops and leaves you to face the fall alone." A. Bartlett Giamatti
I think
this loss feels so terrible because of:
A) The long delay
B) The way weve been playing
C) No Bob Wickman jokes.
The base paths belonged to me, the runner. The rules gave me the right. I always went into a bag full speed, feet first. I had sharp spikes on my shoes. If the baseman stood where he had no business to be and got hurt, that was his fault. -Ty Cobb
Bob Wickman jokes, FTW
"I have plus plus typing speed. You just have plus typing speed."
by GeneParmesan on Jun 16, 2010 9:57 AM EDT up reply actions
+1
I can’t stand Ernie Johnson, Jr.
I believe there ought to be a constitutional amendment outlawing Astroturf and the designated hitter. ~ Crash Davis
by Old Braves' Fan on Jun 16, 2010 10:21 AM EDT up reply actions
This was just a sloppy game all the way around. the LOB and hits with RISP is starting to get a little worrisome but i dont really know how to feel about it. We know we can hit cuz were gettin on base, a lot of times were just not getting that big hit to bring them around.
I think when JJ gets back KK should go to the bullpen for a stint just to regain some confindence. 0-9 is tough
i’m ready to get back to our normal type schedule (one that doesn’t involve extended west coast trips and tough interleague opponents)
sweet jesus
THIS…FUCK INTERLEAGUE PLAY
by SouthernPanther on Jun 16, 2010 6:39 AM EDT up reply actions
Happy to hear someone that agrees with me. I can’t stand inerleague play. It’s novelty doesn’t justify how unbalanced it is, plus I love the factor of the two World Seires contenders never having faced each other during the season. Hell, I don’t even like how teams now play play their divisional rivals so many more times that other teams in the same league, though that’s not as bad as interleague play. Put it right up there with the ASG deciding homefield advantage in the WS.
I believe there ought to be a constitutional amendment outlawing Astroturf and the designated hitter. ~ Crash Davis
by Old Braves' Fan on Jun 16, 2010 10:25 AM EDT up reply actions
And the Mets are on fire
Five in a row and half a game out!
Politicians are like diapers. They both need changing regularly and for the same reason.
That's because
They are playing LL teams. Their schedule get more realistic after they are done with the Indians.
"If it weren't for baseball, many kids wouldn't know what a millionaire looks like." - Phyllis Diller
Good points. I still hate that the Mets are this close to taking the division lead.
Politicians are like diapers. They both need changing regularly and for the same reason.
The Mets have been ahead of us in the division earlier in the year, and the bottom too. Give it time. As Smoltz so hilariously put it, “The Chutes and Ladders Division.”
I believe there ought to be a constitutional amendment outlawing Astroturf and the designated hitter. ~ Crash Davis
by Old Braves' Fan on Jun 16, 2010 10:27 AM EDT up reply actions
The Mets schedule gets considerably tougher after their little Orioles/Indians run.
Check it out. First off: the Yankees
"It looks like The Hound of the Baskervilles out there." - Steve Stone
"...I'm reminded of Wuthering Heights." - Harry Caray
~
"i’m going to keep stats on you for as long as it humors me….target is unclear" - BMacAttack (Hohn's queef)
by Chief Noc-A-Homa on Jun 16, 2010 10:29 AM EDT up reply actions
Mets did take 2 of 3 from the Yankees already
Plus, haven’t the Braves already faced the Astros, Dbacks (6 times) and the Pirates (6 times)? One could easily argue the Braves have had a much easier schedule. Even when you’re playing bad teams, you have to take care of business. Give the Mets some credit, they are padding their record just as the Braves did against the dregs of the NL.
Not sure that cancels out
that the Braves have played almost 1/3 of their schedule vs. the Pirates (7), Dbacks (6) and Astros.
Massive failures with RISP from just about everyone on the team, except Melky, oddly enough. Give some credit to Price, he made some nasty pitches when he had to, but he shouldn’t get all the credit. Just a ugly team loss. KK was just dreadful in that first inning, and the two errors, ugh. Pretty sure this now 0-9 record is getting to him. I was surprised Glaus wasn’t ejected. He seemed to suffer from the portable strike zone more than most. I also hope this tempers everyones expectations of Chris Resop being the svaior of the bullpen. He’ll probably have a hard time getting out of Bobby’s doghouse with last night’s performance.
Silver linings? Chipper had some good swings, and we got Hanson and Huddy going the next two games. I like our chances. Hopefully this ugly ass game tonight kicks their butts in gear.
"Matt Diaz is a baseball player."-Joe Simpson
WTF ?
Why Are we Running this no good, sorry, half ass ……….I am sorry………but KK’s gotta go !!! He’s a double A pitcher at best !!!
by ggotch on Jun 16, 2010 8:24 AM EDT reply actions 6 recs
Rec'd
We have traded away great players for less than nothing and let Texierra walk away, and much much more so pray that Hayward is sent from God and that his energy can ignite the veterans and cause the younger players to hustle more and play winning baseball...
What a very thoughtful and wonderfully construed comment.
by dunnytwogloves on Jun 16, 2010 9:51 AM EDT up reply actions
I liked the random capitalizations….
"It breaks your heart. It is designed to break your heart. The game begins in the spring, when everything else begins again, and it blossoms in the summer, filling the afternoons and evenings, and then as soon as the chill rains come, it stops and leaves you to face the fall alone." A. Bartlett Giamatti
question for anyone who went
How was Big Boi’s 7th inning stretch performance?
"Matt Diaz is a baseball player."-Joe Simpson
Where to start
Well i am glad we found a new shitty reliever who can come into a cloe game and make it not as close anymore. We got rid of that guy but i guess we called him right back up.
Jesse Chavez > Chris Resop, yea pretty sad
WTF we had runners on 1+2 and sometimes more with less than 2 outs about 6-7 innings and only scored 2 of those runs, pathetic
I’m glad bobby didn’t pinch hit for KK with 0 outs and bases loaded, oh wait no i am pissed he didn’t pinch hit
This was by far the worst game of the season for me because we pitched like shit and couldn’t hit with RISP
Can you guys cut the I feel bad for KK crap? You feel bad for him because he pitched 4IP and 5 runs? Alright its no one elses fault he was leaving the ball up to get smashed other than his. I feel like KK is better than this but i am certainly not even remotly sad cause he can’t pitch better. If he wants his 1st win then he should pitch better and longer into games
And finally we gotta win these next 2 games against TB or the Muts will have 1st place, and i want nothing less than that to happen
OJ didn't do it
that's what happens when you put KK on the mound
HE NEEDS TO GO!
...in dixie land i'll take my stand to root for Atlanta
no thats what happens when you got 1-10000 with RISP
by TCfromDubVee on Jun 16, 2010 8:48 AM EDT up reply actions
no KK hates the Braves and won't pitch good for 'em
...in dixie land i'll take my stand to root for Atlanta
Ok, so, every 5th day we're going to lose the game.
Fact: Upon JJ’s return, he needs to replace KK (if we’re really serious about making a run at this thing)
Let’s win the next 4 in a row!!!!!!!!!!!
"It looks like The Hound of the Baskervilles out there." - Steve Stone
"...I'm reminded of Wuthering Heights." - Harry Caray
~
"i’m going to keep stats on you for as long as it humors me….target is unclear" - BMacAttack (Hohn's queef)
by Chief Noc-A-Homa on Jun 16, 2010 9:00 AM EDT reply actions
Hopefully KK > KC
"It looks like The Hound of the Baskervilles out there." - Steve Stone
"...I'm reminded of Wuthering Heights." - Harry Caray
~
"i’m going to keep stats on you for as long as it humors me….target is unclear" - BMacAttack (Hohn's queef)
by Chief Noc-A-Homa on Jun 16, 2010 10:26 AM EDT up reply actions
This morning I have a KK/ Resop/RISP Fail/Rain Delay hangover after that game.
And I didn’t drink a drop of alcohol.
Anyone got a cure?
.
And It was beyond great to see Chipper with a double and a home run last night.
"Curve: The loveliest distance between two points." ~ Mae West
either that or alcohol and her husband/boyfriend/significant other.
I believe there ought to be a constitutional amendment outlawing Astroturf and the designated hitter. ~ Crash Davis
by Old Braves' Fan on Jun 16, 2010 10:31 AM EDT up reply actions
I Logged In....
Just to read the excuses people were coming up with for why Kawakrappy loss again last night.
The defense was poor? Really?
It never fails – when is a loss actually going to be pinned on Kawakami??? and not the offense or the defense or Bobby Cox or bad luck or the fans or the weather….or the moon or sun
Fact it.
He got fucking rocked.
Kawakami is not absolute shit, but he isn’t any good either.
by Nova Scotia Steve on Jun 16, 2010 9:28 AM EDT reply actions
Thank you!!!!!!!!
people try to make excuses for why they feel bad for him, i dont maybe he shouldnt give up 5 runs in 4 innings
OJ didn't do it
No one should ever feel bad
for a guy that makes between $6-$7 million dollars a year and has recorded a victory in 2010. Hell I could manage that.
Kawakami is not absolute shit, but he isn’t any good either.
by Nova Scotia Steve on Jun 16, 2010 10:28 AM EDT up reply actions
*hasn't
Kawakami is not absolute shit, but he isn’t any good either.
by Nova Scotia Steve on Jun 16, 2010 10:36 AM EDT up reply actions
So I must ask...
Why did he lose the game he pitched in Arizona? Please explain.
"It breaks your heart. It is designed to break your heart. The game begins in the spring, when everything else begins again, and it blossoms in the summer, filling the afternoons and evenings, and then as soon as the chill rains come, it stops and leaves you to face the fall alone." A. Bartlett Giamatti
Duh. He’s supposed to allow negative runs in his starts.
by dunnytwogloves on Jun 16, 2010 12:27 PM EDT up reply actions
Your pissing and moaning is beyond old. We’ve had enough. If you have nothing good to say (and you rarely do), perhaps you should find another site to piss and moan about. Maybe the Braves MLB.com fan message board.
"Jason Heyward was a Greek philosopher reincarnated as a baseball player." - Don Sutton
Laughing my AZZ off !!!
Kawakrummy !!! lol !!! Now that’s a good one !!!
What’s an azz?
"It breaks your heart. It is designed to break your heart. The game begins in the spring, when everything else begins again, and it blossoms in the summer, filling the afternoons and evenings, and then as soon as the chill rains come, it stops and leaves you to face the fall alone." A. Bartlett Giamatti
isn’t it an axe/hoe-like tool? Oh, wait…that’s and adze! ;-)
/sarcasm
I believe there ought to be a constitutional amendment outlawing Astroturf and the designated hitter. ~ Crash Davis
by Old Braves' Fan on Jun 16, 2010 10:37 AM EDT up reply actions
*an adze.
I believe there ought to be a constitutional amendment outlawing Astroturf and the designated hitter. ~ Crash Davis
by Old Braves' Fan on Jun 16, 2010 10:38 AM EDT up reply actions
PS
I realize Atlanta had four errors (two of them KK’s)…but both teams had to play in last night’s conditions…not just one side.
In the franchise’s more than 100-year history in Boston, Milwaukee and Atlanta, no starter had ever begun a season 0-9. Now one has – But let’s remember NONE of it is his fault.
I hope this will now open some eyes…Ohhh but wait…i’m going to check his BABIP and WHIP and BS first before i come to any major decision.
I just glad most people i know still don’t know who Kawakami is or the fact he’s 0-9…(oooohhh i forgot…W-L’s records don’t matter – give me a break)
Let the dude rot in the bullpen for all i care.
Kawakami is not absolute shit, but he isn’t any good either.
by Nova Scotia Steve on Jun 16, 2010 9:46 AM EDT reply actions
So you’re just gonna ignore the 6 inning scoreless outing in Arizona i presume.
No one is saying he pitched great last night, he was awful in the first inning. But that game was perfectly winnable if the offense had made any impact with runners in scoring position.
"Matt Diaz is a baseball player."-Joe Simpson
No one said "NONE of it is his fault"...
he accepts blame when he does bad. But the 0-9 record is misleading, and he’s performed more than well enough to be say 3-6, 4-5, 5-4.
by Mr. Sanchez on Jun 16, 2010 10:29 AM EDT up reply actions
Well there certainly seems to be an excuse
Every single time he’s pitched this year. I’m just tired of it.
Kawakami is not absolute shit, but he isn’t any good either.
by Nova Scotia Steve on Jun 16, 2010 10:44 AM EDT up reply actions
It may seem that way...
but not true. There’s been 4-6 times where he pitched poorly and took a legit loss, even KK has admitted that much. People just get tired of the “He’s 0-9, he must be horrible” cry from so many. There’s a lot more to it than just that, and while as I say elsewhere, he hasn’t pitched like Hudson or Hanson to be sure, the guy has pitched well enough to earn a handful of wins our offense couldn’t give him, and isn’t what Jeff Schultz tries to make him out to be. He’s a slightly overpaid (although not really when you look at some with similar or higher salaries) back end starter. No more, no less. He’s not a Cy Young type, but every team in the league would take him in their rotation. I mean compare him to say Kei Igawa, who the Yankees signed for similar money and the guy can’t even produce in AAA. KK is probably our 6th best starter, and considering the first 5, that’s not a bad thing.
by Mr. Sanchez on Jun 16, 2010 10:49 AM EDT up reply actions
Does that matter?
he signed a guaranteed deal, and that’s what the team owes. I doubt’t they want to pay McLouth his millions, or Lowe his 15, but that’s what the contract they signed says.
And more specifically to answer your question, depends on the “3-6 pitcher”. Zack Greinke is 2-8, would you pay him $7m? Roy Oswalt is 4-8, and he gets I think $16m. Ben Sheets is 2-6 for his 8 figure salary. Carlos Zambrano has given the Cubs 2-5 for his $18m. Felix Hernandez is 4-5, and there isn’t a team in the league that wouldn’t pay $7m for his services. Better yet, the Yankees paid over $26 m just for the rights, in addition to a 5 yr/$20m deal to Kei Igawa (so combined 5yrs, $46m or around $9m per). And he can’t even even do well in AAA.
Your "analysis"
and dismissal of statistics other than W-L render your commentary useless and easy to ignore.
In other words, when you say stuff like that, most people realize you don’t know what you’re talking about.
"It breaks your heart. It is designed to break your heart. The game begins in the spring, when everything else begins again, and it blossoms in the summer, filling the afternoons and evenings, and then as soon as the chill rains come, it stops and leaves you to face the fall alone." A. Bartlett Giamatti
by sddbaker on Jun 16, 2010 10:38 AM EDT up reply actions 6 recs
well put and rec'd
tired of these ignorant comments.
by Andy Braves Fan on Jun 16, 2010 11:11 AM EDT up reply actions
Hey !!
Just a thought ……….Maybe we could package Kawakrummy and Resop together to KC Royals……for……..a bag of old balls and some broken bats !!!
What!
we could easily get Grienke and Butler, and Eric Hosmer, and Mike Moustakas if we gave KC that deal
OJ didn't do it
mmm…Moustakas
"I have plus plus typing speed. You just have plus typing speed."
by GeneParmesan on Jun 16, 2010 11:54 AM EDT up reply actions
Facts
Over their last six starts our starters have the following ERAs:
Hudson: 2.20
Kawakami: 3.00
Medlen: 3.66
Lowe: 3.76
Hanson: 5.45
Now please continue the irrational KK bashing…
Jason Heyward wins at baseball.
Sometimes, it goes beyond numbers. Kind of like how the Cubs haven’t won a Series in over 100 years. Extremely bad luck? Goats? Bartman? Cursed.
In a few weeks, hopefully it will be this simple: JJ can get us some W’s. Wins are always nice, and I have no confidence in KK getting Wins, regardless of where whomever wants to place the blame.
It can’t get any worse than 0-9. Oh wait……0-10.
"It looks like The Hound of the Baskervilles out there." - Steve Stone
"...I'm reminded of Wuthering Heights." - Harry Caray
~
"i’m going to keep stats on you for as long as it humors me….target is unclear" - BMacAttack (Hohn's queef)
by Chief Noc-A-Homa on Jun 16, 2010 9:59 AM EDT up reply actions
So Bobby Cox is supposed to manage his team based on karma levels?? Since you’re basically saying numbers don’t matter…
by dunnytwogloves on Jun 16, 2010 10:07 AM EDT up reply actions
No, bbxxj is the one that’s essentially saying that numbers don’t matter (because his ERA in last 6 starts is better than Meds, Lowe, and Hanson.) I’m saying, maybe they do or maybe they don’t matter. But I know that JJ needs to replace KK.
It’s that simple.
"It looks like The Hound of the Baskervilles out there." - Steve Stone
"...I'm reminded of Wuthering Heights." - Harry Caray
~
"i’m going to keep stats on you for as long as it humors me….target is unclear" - BMacAttack (Hohn's queef)
by Chief Noc-A-Homa on Jun 16, 2010 10:11 AM EDT up reply actions
Because you prefer pitchers who allow more runs to score? I’ll take Kawakami because I understand there is a difference between corelation and causation. Because he is allowing fewer runs to score he has a greater chance for the random amount of run support to be greater than the runs he allows.
Jason Heyward wins at baseball.
by bbxxj on Jun 16, 2010 10:26 AM EDT via mobile up reply actions
FACTS
Kawakami’s major league record – 7-21.
But that’s not his fault. Let’s blame everyone else.
Kawakami is not absolute shit, but he isn’t any good either.
by Nova Scotia Steve on Jun 16, 2010 9:55 AM EDT reply actions 1 recs
This
You can’t look at it any deeper than that. Whether the offense responds to Lowe or not, the man at least wins games. That record is terrible. That’s all that should matter. He needs to go, somewhere, anywhere, just out of the starting rotation when JJ comes back.
by michaelcooksey on Jun 16, 2010 10:07 AM EDT up reply actions
Actually
If you have an more than an elementary understanding of baeball, you can and should look at it deeper than that.
Why let things like reality confuse the issue when it’s clearly being run by people who don’t seem to understand that wins and losses do not a pitcher make.
Hell, when I saw KK come out of the Braves dugout Friday night, I wanted to jump on the field and give him a hug. No one should be forced to endure what he’s had to with this team.
"Jason Heyward was a Greek philosopher reincarnated as a baseball player." - Don Sutton
The record is a reflection of his team...
so no, that isn’t his fault. He hasn’t been Hanson or Hudson, but the guy has pitched well for his spot in the rotation. And with our average runs scored over that stretch instead of the crap support he gets, the record should probably be around 14-14. Not good, but not bad either.
by Mr. Sanchez on Jun 16, 2010 10:31 AM EDT up reply actions
50% worse, actually
But Mr. Sanchez’s point , I believe, is that with decent run support, KK’s record would be a lot better and that the won-loss record is partially due to factors outside of his control.
STFU ALREADY!!!!!
OMFG have you ever seen a pitcher actually PITCH when there’s a lead? Or a commanding lead? Or at LEAST a FUCKING RUN on the board??
This entire, entire argument, has been based on KK’s lack of run support and how a few timely hits here and there changes his WHOLE record.
This needs to end for real.
Well, its good to see all the trolls that had disappeared since we took over first place have returned. It was getting way too warm and fuzzy around here.
Shouldn't Brent Clevlen get a shot in LF before...awww, forget it!
Well if i'm a troll
At least i’m a consistent troll
Kawakami is not absolute shit, but he isn’t any good either.
by Nova Scotia Steve on Jun 16, 2010 10:19 AM EDT up reply actions
You either:
A. Are a troll.
or
B. Have extremely little understanding of how to use statistics to evaulate a player and even less about their predictive value.
Jason Heyward wins at baseball.
by bbxxj on Jun 16, 2010 10:29 AM EDT via mobile up reply actions
Actually I have a pretty good understand of statistics
and they tell me Kris Medlen has pitched well enough to take Kawakrappy place in the rotation
Kawakami is not absolute shit, but he isn’t any good either.
by Nova Scotia Steve on Jun 16, 2010 10:39 AM EDT up reply actions
It's always the same people that call everyone else trolls, too
everyone copes with loss differently, I guess
"It looks like The Hound of the Baskervilles out there." - Steve Stone
"...I'm reminded of Wuthering Heights." - Harry Caray
~
"i’m going to keep stats on you for as long as it humors me….target is unclear" - BMacAttack (Hohn's queef)
by Chief Noc-A-Homa on Jun 16, 2010 10:48 AM EDT up reply actions
I Noticed That As Well
Thanks Chief
Kawakami is not absolute shit, but he isn’t any good either.
by Nova Scotia Steve on Jun 16, 2010 10:50 AM EDT up reply actions
And the KK haters are quick to call everyone else KK-apologists.
KK didn’t pitch well last night, and everyone will admit that. He got pretty well rocked in the first inning. But the error was definitely was a contributing factor, since three of those runs were unearned. And over the next four innings, he allowed only one run, despite a couple of errors of his own. So when you look at the whole outing, it’s not quite as bad as it seemed when the game was starting.
What bugs me is that there are a ton of people who barely post for four games, then when KK’s start comes up, they start screaming at the first sign of trouble. There’s seemingly a much higher comment count in KK’s starts than other games.
We get it, KK is the worst starter we have. Fans of 20 other teams would love have a pitcher as solid as KK as their 5th starter. He’d easily be the third man in some rotations. We can’t have perfect players up and down the roster.
The 0-9 record is not all-encompassing. The run support argument isn’t just hot air. Off the 144 qualified starting pitchers in all of MLB, KK is getting the 9th worst run support while he’s in the game. Of the men ahead of, FIVE come from the league’s two worst offenses, Baltimore and Pittsburgh. Nobody else in the bottom 30 of worst run support plays for an offense nearly as good as the Braves’. So he’s been unreasonably, unsustainably unlucky.
What bugs me is that there are a ton of people who barely post for four games, then when KK’s start comes up, they start screaming at the first sign of trouble. There’s seemingly a much higher comment count in KK’s starts than other games.
I’ll expand on that and say that there are a ton people who you never hear a peep out of until the Braves lose ugly in a game, or lose 2 in a row, or drop a series. Other than good ol’ British Columbia Bob, who we’ve learned this season we can always count on to come out from under his bridge when things go bad, I don’t recognize the names of any of the other “ZOMG the sky is falling, KK sux!” posters in this thread.
All we need now is a jerryclore sighting, and this thread will be so full of fail that it may just implode and destroy the universe in the process.
Shouldn't Brent Clevlen get a shot in LF before...awww, forget it!
by Rhyno18 on Jun 16, 2010 2:30 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
But his workload tells you different, if you actually understood the stats...
KK has had some decent outings of late. Last night wasn’t one, but the rain probably didn’t help (I know Hudson dealt with it just fine a few weeks ago, but KK ain’t Huddy). When JJ comes back, I’d still like Medlen to the bullpen. He can work long relief on games KK, JJ, or another struggle. He can work in pressure situations reducing the load on Moylan, Venters, EOF and Saito. And if in a month KK still hasn’t turned it around, or if someone else goes down, we can put him back in the rotation and not worry about giving him a HUGE jump in innings that his arm has never had to deal with before. Remember, the guy had around 100 innings last year, and has never gone over 120. It might be a good idea to not risk blowing out the arm of one of our best young pitchers.
by Mr. Sanchez on Jun 16, 2010 10:54 AM EDT up reply actions
Do you think a 6 man rotation would work when JJ comes back?
"Tony Gwynn made sacrifices. Cal Ripken made sacrifices. I'm not sure Derek Jeter made sacrifices given the ungodly deep pockets the Yankees have." - Chipper Jones
by MBL1 on Jun 16, 2010 12:12 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
you make interesssssting proposeetion
"I have plus plus typing speed. You just have plus typing speed."
by GeneParmesan on Jun 16, 2010 12:13 PM EDT up reply actions
Yes.
I think it would work. You could keep Medlen and KK in the otation. Also, it would give JJ some extra rest between starts. You could skip KK or Meds if there is an off day and your starters would be fresh down the stretch. You keep all 6 stretched out in case of an emergency. BTW, the Japanese leagues use a 6 man rotation. That being said, I don’t think it will happen. Either KK or Medlen will go to the bullpen.
7 man rotation
Sundays: Crabs Medallion
Mondays: D-Lo
Tuesday: KK
Wednesday: JJ
Thursday: The Towel(Resop, for all the newbs in this thread)
Friday: Huddy
Saturday: Hanson
Shouldn't Brent Clevlen get a shot in LF before...awww, forget it!
Check that, make D-Lo the Tuesday pitcher and KK the Monday pitcher. Off days are Mondays and Thursdays, so KK and Resop occasionally get skipped.
The starters have to understand though, with this much time between starts, they are going to have to go 7 every time out.
Shouldn't Brent Clevlen get a shot in LF before...awww, forget it!
Just like day-of-the-week panties!
"It breaks your heart. It is designed to break your heart. The game begins in the spring, when everything else begins again, and it blossoms in the summer, filling the afternoons and evenings, and then as soon as the chill rains come, it stops and leaves you to face the fall alone." A. Bartlett Giamatti
Day of the Week???
When did they come out with those? I do have a set of Month of the Year, which I change every 1st , whether they need it or not. :-)
preach it!!
"It looks like The Hound of the Baskervilles out there." - Steve Stone
"...I'm reminded of Wuthering Heights." - Harry Caray
~
"i’m going to keep stats on you for as long as it humors me….target is unclear" - BMacAttack (Hohn's queef)
by Chief Noc-A-Homa on Jun 16, 2010 10:19 AM EDT up reply actions
As someone we all know and love once asked....
Who handed out laptops on the short bus?
"It breaks your heart. It is designed to break your heart. The game begins in the spring, when everything else begins again, and it blossoms in the summer, filling the afternoons and evenings, and then as soon as the chill rains come, it stops and leaves you to face the fall alone." A. Bartlett Giamatti
Wasn't that you?
"It looks like The Hound of the Baskervilles out there." - Steve Stone
"...I'm reminded of Wuthering Heights." - Harry Caray
~
"i’m going to keep stats on you for as long as it humors me….target is unclear" - BMacAttack (Hohn's queef)
by Chief Noc-A-Homa on Jun 16, 2010 10:45 AM EDT up reply actions
I hate it that we had the day off on Monday.
I know the guys needed a break… but we were playing well and the timing of the break sucked.
Especially when it is followed with a game against the AL’s best team and NOT the frickin Double-AA Orioles.
HOPEFULLY we will get back on our horse and WIN this series and send a strong message to the AL that the Braves are on the warpath this year!
I think you’re being generous by calling the Orioles Double-A.
Shouldn't Brent Clevlen get a shot in LF before...awww, forget it!
He/she called them Double AA. So they’re AAAA.
"Tony Gwynn made sacrifices. Cal Ripken made sacrifices. I'm not sure Derek Jeter made sacrifices given the ungodly deep pockets the Yankees have." - Chipper Jones
by MBL1 on Jun 16, 2010 12:13 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
I demand that Chipper, Glaus and Heyward hit 3 grand slams each tonight and Tommy pitches a perfect game. If not we must send Chipper, Glaus, Heyward and Tommy down to Myrtle Beach.
"Tony Gwynn made sacrifices. Cal Ripken made sacrifices. I'm not sure Derek Jeter made sacrifices given the ungodly deep pockets the Yankees have." - Chipper Jones
by MBL1 on Jun 16, 2010 12:05 PM EDT via mobile reply actions
Tough game
KK didn’t pitched good and left some balls up in the middle of the plate. He settled down and finished with six strikeouts and two earned runs. We had 13 hits and only scored four runs. That’s not good, especially when you are playing a great team. We had tons of LOB including situations where we had runners in scoring position with less than two outs.
seeing both sides of the coin
K.K. is a better pitcher than what his record shows but the truth is K.K. is also a better pitcher than what he showed last night. I think we’re seeing an evolution of a guy who is losing his confidence & rightfully so. I think all of us would be a little rattled if he were in his shoes. For that reason I’m not going to kick a guy while he’s down but I’m also not going to deny that there is a legitimate concern when K.K. takes the mound. For whatever reason the Braves don’t win when he’s on the mound.
Meds seems to have the hot arm right now. When J.J. comes back I think Meds & K.K.‘s roles should be reversed. Meds in the rotation. K.K. in the pen. I know for what K.K. is getting paid you’d want to get the most bang for your buck & have him in a starter role but what’s good for the team as well as K.K. is just as valid of a consideration.
The one question I have, is whether or not KK’s record is weighing on his mind and altering his approach. Dude has to have absolutely no confidence in our lineup when he pitches.
Just speculation, really.
And I don’t think it would auger well for Meds to spend the rest of the year in the rotation when his arm is not used to the workload yet.
"Jason Heyward was a Greek philosopher reincarnated as a baseball player." - Don Sutton
Why wouldn't he
the guy has 0 room for error. If the other team scores 1 run, he is screwed.
by Andy Braves Fan on Jun 16, 2010 1:49 PM EDT up reply actions
He's the Bizarro-Ubaldo
The second the Rockies score a run, you expect Ubaldo’s picking up a win. The second KK gives one up, you figure it’s a loss.
I do think there is a genuine concern that every pitch of his must be perfect or he’s going to lose. I think if we can get him just one solid lead to start a game, we’ll see an entirely different pitcher on the mound.
I don’t foresee Medlen being able to throw every fifth day all season long. Not enough innings yet. So we’re going to need KK down the stretch.
I agree UMDBHIK
That there is a concern about the workload on Meds arm but while the guy is hot why not play him. Watch his pitch count & see how things progress. When (& if) he starts showing signs of fatigue then make the switch & bring KK back into the rotation. Maybe by this time KK has some time to work out his issues & comes back as the pitcher that we all believe he is capable of being.
(Fellow posters,before I get hammered, when I say KK has some issues to work out please don’t construe that to mean that all this is on him. We all know that it’s a mixed bag which includes lack of run support.)
. . .
If the stupid fits….
;-)
.
"Curve: The loveliest distance between two points." ~ Mae West
by NCChopper on Jun 16, 2010 2:23 PM EDT reply actions 4 recs
lol
"Tony Gwynn made sacrifices. Cal Ripken made sacrifices. I'm not sure Derek Jeter made sacrifices given the ungodly deep pockets the Yankees have." - Chipper Jones
by MBL1 on Jun 16, 2010 2:37 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
This so This!
:)
Chipper: "It has never been about money for me, and it never will be about money. It has always been about winning, comfort and playing for Bobby Cox."
Cheer up!
There is a lot of downers on this site tonight/today. It feels like we lost 5 in a row or something. This is just one of the few bad games the Braves have played in the past two months. Plz no more KK sucks. He is our SP and we should support no matter what. Buck up and lets take two from the Rays. Go Bravos!
by romone_braves91 on Jun 16, 2010 3:41 PM EDT via mobile reply actions
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