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Braves Top-4 Minor League Shortstop Prospects

Matt Lipka led a crop of talented shortstops who joined the Braves organization in 2010.

1. Matt Lipka - B/T: R/R, Born: 4/15/1992, Ht: 6'1", Wt: 188 - After signing Billy Wagner to be their closer, the Braves didn't have a pick in the first round of the 2010 draft, bu they feel like they had gained a first round talent when they selected Lipka 35th overall. He signed quickly for $800,000 and dominated the Gulf Coast League as an 18 year old, hitting .302 with a .758 OPS, 8 doubles, 4 triples, a homer, 24 RBI, and 20 stolen bases in 210 plate appearances. He earned a late season promtion to Danville, where he went 2-16 with a RBI and a stolen base in 4 games. Lipka's calling card is his speed and hustle, and he showed plenty of both in his debut season, still running out grounders hard in September, when most players are mentally packing for the offseason. He's a line drive hitter, and he has a thick, strong body, but he doesn't utilize it enough in his swing. If he can put more of his body behind the ball he can become a very dynamic hitter, combining above average pop with well above average speed. Even if his power doesn't develop, his swing and approach are solid and he should develop into a fine top of the order hitter. Lipka made 11 errors in 42 games at shortstop, but most players with his youth and athleticism pile up the errors early in their careers. He has good instincts at shortstop and his arm is adequate enough for the position, but, from a physical standpoint, he isn't the protoypical shortstop. His body is a bit thick and looks capable of muscle, and if it did a move to second base would be more appropriate. Alternately, the Braves may decide to make use of his speed and hustle in centerfield, a position that would allow him to both use his atheticism and add muscle. No matter where he ends up on the diamond, Lipka has a bright future and the determination and work ethic to become successful. He'll move up to Rome in 2011 for his first full season.

2. Edward Salcedo - B/T: R/R, Born: 7/30/1991, Ht: 6'3", Wt: 195 - The Braves made a big splash in February when they signed Edward Salcedo for 1.6 million dollars, the most they'd ever given a foreign born amateur free agent. In 2007, the Indians nearly signed him to a contract worth over 3 million dollars, but questions about the validity of his birthdate arose. MLB finally determined that July 30th, 1991, the date Salcedo had presented from the start, was his actual birthdate, but only after he'd missed out on two years of development and millions of dollars. Regardless of how he came to them, the Braves were thrilled to add him to the organization and planned to get him acclimated to the pro game through Extended Spring Training, then send him to Rome in early June. That plan was derailed when Salcedo ran into visa problems after returning to the Dominican Republic following Spring Training to be with an ill relative. He ended up stuck in his native country, but was able to make his professional debut with the DSL Braves, hitting .297 with a .885 OPS, 5 doubles, a homer, 11 RBI, and 8 steals in 95 plate appearences. He was finally able to return to the US and join Rome in early July, hitting .197 with a .534 OPS, 5 doubles, 4 triples, 2 home runs, 16 RBI, and 6 stolen bases in 209 plate appearances. He also made 27 errors at shortstop in just 52 games for Rome. Statistically, Salcedo's debut season was a bust, but numbers don't tell the whole story. While MLB was keeping him in limbo the last two years, he wasn't able to take part in any high level, organized baseball, meaning that when he came to Rome as an 18 year old, already an aggressive assignment by the Braves, the only "real" baseball he'd played was a few weeks of Spring Training and 23 games in the Dominican Summer League. While the numbers weren't pretty, the Braves themselves couldn't have been more happy with how Salcedo performed, both on and off the field. He is the protoypical five-tool player, and while 2010 is proof that he's going to need some seasoning to develop, there's little doubt he can turn himself into an every day Major Leaguer. He made a ton of errors, causing some to question his defense. Rust led to some of the errors, but mostly they were just the growing pains that all young, incredibly athletic players deal with. He gets to balls that other, less talented players simply can't get to, and occasionally he makes an error on those plays, something that he will grow out of as he becomes more experienced. Salcedo's size has also been an issue, causing some to wonder if he'll eventually need to shift to third base. But, for now he's still lean, and exactly the same size that the top shortstops in the National League, Troy Tulowitzki and Hanley Ramirez, were at 19. Salcedo will return to Rome in 2011, with a promotion to High A Lynchburg possible based on his performance. It will be interesting to see how the Braves find at bats for both Salcedo and Lipka on the same team.

The rest of the list after the jump:

Star-divide

3. Andrelton Simmons - B/T: R/R, Born: 9/4/1989, Ht: 6'2", Wt: 170 - When the Braves selected Simmons in the second round of this year's draft they actually announced him as a pitcher. It made sense that the team would want to put him on the mound as a professional, he posesses a 98 mph fastball. But, Simmons wanted to hit, and the only way the Braves could bring him into the organization was if they signed him as a shortstop and gave him every chance to succeed as a hitter before trying him out on the mound. He was surprisingly good in his debut with Danville, hitting .276 with a .695 OPS, 11 doubles, 2 home runs, 26 RBI, and 18 stolen bases in 269 plate appearances. Still, those numbers aren't exactly great for a player with college experience, and with Matt Lipka and Edward Salcedo both slotted in at shortstop at Rome in 2011, Simmons may be forced to jump to High A Lynchburg. That jump might be too much and could derail his chances as a position player. He's incredibly thin, so there's reason to question whether or not he'd be able to drive the ball at the higher levels. If Simmons can't make it as a position player it will be a shame, because his defense if Major League caliber already. His arm is an 80 on the 20 to 80 scouting scale, and his long lean frame and nearly unmatched athleticism allow him to reach everything hit even remotely close to him.

4. Tyler Pastornicky - B/T: R/R, Born: 12/13/1989, Ht: 5'11", Wt: 170 - When the Braves traded away Yunel Escobar, they not only acquired their current shortstop in Alex Gonzalez, but possibly their next one in Pastornicky. Drafted in the fifth round of the 2008 draft, he hit .258 with a .724 OPS, 16 doubles, 6 home runs, 35 RBI, and 24 stolen bases in 331 plate appearances for Toronto's High A Dunedin affiliate before the trade. The Braves were aggressive after he came to the organization, promoting him to AA Mississippi, where he hit .254 with a .699 OPS, 5 doubles, 2 triples, 2 homers, 15 RBI, and 11 steals in 160 plate appearances. After the season, he played in the Arizona Fall League, where he hit .278 with a .649 OPS in 54 at bats. Pastornicky is a slap and grind hitter. His smallish frame isn't likely to generate much power, but he knows this and has focused on becoming a better contact hitter. If he can improve his average out of the .250 range it will help his on base percentage and allow him to become a top of the order hitter, which is where his skill set profles best. He's a solid fielder who uses his speed well and makes intelligent decisions. He's played some second base, a position that may suit him better in the long term. Pastornicky will return to Mississippi to start 2011, with a promotion to AAA Gwinnett likely at some point in the year.

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I’m adding a bonus review, because I think he’s worth folks knowing about.

Alejandro Sanchez – B/T: R/R, Born: 6/15/1992, Ht: 6’0", Wt: 183 – Out of the handful of players the Braves have signed out of their academy in Tenerife, Spain, Sanchez is the best. The native of Spain made his professional debut in 2010 and it was a trying experience, as his body simply wasn’t ready to handle the rigors of playing the game every day. A series of nagging injuries limited him to just 13 games in the Gulf Coast League, where he hit .174 with a .501 OPS and 2 stolen bases in just 25 plate appearances. Because of the presence of Matt Lipka, he was also forced to move off his natural shortstop position, playing 8 games at second base and a game at first base. Because of the lack of high level competition in Europe, Sanchez will take longer to develop than most prospects, but the Braves are willing to be patient because they believe in his natural ability. He’s an above average athlete with solid baseball instincts and his lack of experience means he hasn’t picked up any bad habits. Sanchez will spend the offseason working on his conditioning, adding strength and learning the ins and outs of the game, so that when the Gulf Coast season starts up in 2011 he’ll be able to compete at a professional level.

I wrote a novel, it's about baseball, you should buy it:
http://www.amazon.com/Four-C-B-Wilkins/dp/1449578454/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1257720610&sr=1-1
www.dropoutproductions.com

by cbwilk on Dec 1, 2010 5:31 AM EST reply actions  

Good stuff cb, and thanks for the bonus...

love hearing more about fellow Sanchezes.

And I agree on being excited by what the Spaniard might bring. Unlike the other Tenerife signings, the two Cs, Galvan, and Rihjkoff, Sanchez had his development accelerated being in the GCL instead of DSL. To me, that means the organizations thinks pretty highly of his potential.

http://sportsandgrits.blogspot.com/

by Mr. Sanchez on Dec 1, 2010 9:39 AM EST up reply actions  

Thanks for the extra info, cbwilk. The Tenerife prospects don’t seem to get a lot of coverage so it’s good to hear a little more. At 18 years old Sanchez certainly has time on his side to learn to be a good pro.

by Zontar on Dec 1, 2010 10:28 AM EST up reply actions  

This is why

you’re the man.

"That guy mvhsbball is really an insufferable schmuck." - FuquaManuel

by Scott Coleman on Dec 1, 2010 12:39 PM EST up reply actions   1 recs

It will certainly be interesting to watch how the Braves handleand move around Lipka, Salcedo and Simmons, all of whom seem to have great upside and to be at an almost identical point of the development curve.

also: Another great post, cb. Thanks.

by fandave on Dec 1, 2010 6:06 AM EST reply actions  

I wish there was a way we could do a weird loan arrangement with another organization- send one of our prospects to their minors to learn SS, while they sent a prospect to our system in a spot where we have no real prospects. Keep the players, but get them playing time in another org.

Or send them to Japan on a loan even, though I don’t know if they’re good enough for that level- kinda like what soccer teams do with their prospect players.

by Broccoman on Dec 1, 2010 10:15 AM EST up reply actions  

Teams can absolutely work out loans with other organizations. It’s happened plenty of times. It doesn’t happen often, but it’s absolutely in the realm of possibility. I’d almost guarantee it won’t happen, but it could.

I wrote a novel, it's about baseball, you should buy it:
http://www.amazon.com/Four-C-B-Wilkins/dp/1449578454/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1257720610&sr=1-1
www.dropoutproductions.com

by cbwilk on Dec 1, 2010 10:30 AM EST up reply actions  

you are clearly losing it…re-read that sentence….its happened plenty of times but it doesnt happen often….i guarantee it won’t happen, but it could….

you have clearly written too much this month already and your brain is fried.

"No. Lonely people mixing with one another? Breeding? Creating an even lonelier generation? You're not even allowing natural selection do its work. Pssh. You're like the guy who invented the seat belt."

Dwight Schrute

by Swo12bv on Dec 1, 2010 10:33 AM EST up reply actions  

But really, it all makes sense. I guess I should say it doesn’t happen often anymore and I guarantee it won’t happen, but my guarantees aren’t worth anything.

I wrote a novel, it's about baseball, you should buy it:
http://www.amazon.com/Four-C-B-Wilkins/dp/1449578454/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1257720610&sr=1-1
www.dropoutproductions.com

by cbwilk on Dec 1, 2010 10:43 AM EST up reply actions  

Like your guarantee that the mea culpa is coming...

eventually. Lazy bastard.

http://sportsandgrits.blogspot.com/

by Mr. Sanchez on Dec 1, 2010 11:03 AM EST up reply actions  

I know it makes sense..I just have higher standards for you

"No. Lonely people mixing with one another? Breeding? Creating an even lonelier generation? You're not even allowing natural selection do its work. Pssh. You're like the guy who invented the seat belt."

Dwight Schrute

by Swo12bv on Dec 1, 2010 12:29 PM EST up reply actions  

Lipka kind of strikes me as a Dustin Pedroia/Ian Kinsler type

The combo of line-drive power and speed is always a good thing.

60% of the time, it works every time

by ATLandUNC on Dec 1, 2010 6:57 AM EST reply actions  

comps

a 2-3-4-5 of Lipka-Heyward-Freeman-Salcedo would be like Pedroia-God-AGon-Tulo?

by apoxonbothyourhouses on Dec 1, 2010 1:11 PM EST up reply actions   1 recs

Bonus coverage?

Freaking awesome. Thanks. Great post as always. I’m really excited about Salcedo and Lipka. Shoot, I’m really excited about our whole minor league system. 2011 is going to be a great year when it comes around….

by Braves24 on Dec 1, 2010 7:00 AM EST via mobile reply actions  

Random Question

Why did Lipka fall to the 35th round? Usually, “first-round talent” falls that far because they are asking for a ton of money that people dont want to pay or teams think they will be hard to sign. But Lipka signed quickly for only $800k. What gives?

"If I have asthma, they won't let me scuba. And if I can’t scuba, then what’s this all been about?? What am I working toward??"

"You look like you should be married to one of the San Diego Padres."

by Doghnut on Dec 1, 2010 7:37 AM EST reply actions  

Not , 35th Round he was the 35th Pick in the 1st round.

The draft has more picks per round than teams because of teams not signing the previous years players, as well as the compensation picks between rounds for losing free agents.

by Rocky1013 on Dec 1, 2010 7:57 AM EST up reply actions  

Thanks

Completely misread it. Thought it said 35th round.

"If I have asthma, they won't let me scuba. And if I can’t scuba, then what’s this all been about?? What am I working toward??"

"You look like you should be married to one of the San Diego Padres."

by Doghnut on Dec 1, 2010 8:36 AM EST up reply actions  

Good write up

and always dig the material. But was wondering if you might break up the Salcedo part into a few pieces. It’s pretty difficult to read.

by YakuzaFro on Dec 1, 2010 8:03 AM EST reply actions  

Wow, what a difference a year makes..

This time last year, Brandon Hicks was our best SS prospect..

"Check out this bitchin' homemade tesla coil!"

by bwellnjonesco on Dec 1, 2010 8:34 AM EST reply actions  

The Braves FO has shown one thing in regards to scouting...

they immediately look to fill in the weaker spots in the system.

$5 says we get an outfielder with one of our first two picks next year.

"That guy mvhsbball is really an insufferable schmuck." - FuquaManuel

by Scott Coleman on Dec 1, 2010 12:37 PM EST up reply actions  

Double or nothing it's...

2 of our top 5, 3 of our top 10, and 5 of our top 20, in the least.

http://sportsandgrits.blogspot.com/

by Mr. Sanchez on Dec 1, 2010 3:06 PM EST up reply actions  

Yep.

That’s probably more like. We don’t mess around.

"That guy mvhsbball is really an insufferable schmuck." - FuquaManuel

by Scott Coleman on Dec 1, 2010 3:53 PM EST up reply actions  

They are ridiculously good at plugging holes. At one point our catching depth was JC Boscan, then within 2 seasons they had Brian McCann, Jarrod Saltalamaccia, Brayan Pena, Max Ramirez, and Clint Sammons.

I wrote a novel, it's about baseball, you should buy it:
http://www.amazon.com/Four-C-B-Wilkins/dp/1449578454/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1257720610&sr=1-1
www.dropoutproductions.com

by cbwilk on Dec 1, 2010 5:29 PM EST up reply actions  

and we still have Boscan…or did he leave?

"No. Lonely people mixing with one another? Breeding? Creating an even lonelier generation? You're not even allowing natural selection do its work. Pssh. You're like the guy who invented the seat belt."

Dwight Schrute

by Swo12bv on Dec 1, 2010 6:04 PM EST up reply actions  

No, he’s coming back. He’s a ST invitee.

I wrote a novel, it's about baseball, you should buy it:
http://www.amazon.com/Four-C-B-Wilkins/dp/1449578454/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1257720610&sr=1-1
www.dropoutproductions.com

by cbwilk on Dec 1, 2010 6:43 PM EST up reply actions  

You can’t let go of a guy with a career Major league OBP of 1.000.

Coming soon: winningugly visits Atlanta, takes dump in royhobbs’ Braves hat.

by 10-4 on Dec 2, 2010 2:37 PM EST up reply actions  

Isn't it infinite?

1 base, 0 at bats.

http://sportsandgrits.blogspot.com/

by Mr. Sanchez on Dec 2, 2010 3:17 PM EST up reply actions  

OBP is by plate appearances.

I wrote a novel, it's about baseball, you should buy it:
http://www.amazon.com/Four-C-B-Wilkins/dp/1449578454/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1257720610&sr=1-1
www.dropoutproductions.com

by cbwilk on Dec 2, 2010 5:37 PM EST up reply actions  

Totally stacked at SS

and an athletic and versatile group! Outside of pitcher/catcher…a SS prospect is the easiest to convert to another position right?

by TBuzz on Dec 1, 2010 9:05 AM EST via mobile reply actions  

My belief? That Lipka ends up in CF, not because he can’t play SS, but because we have an organizational need there and his skillset plays as good, if not better there.

by yondaime4 on Dec 1, 2010 9:37 AM EST reply actions  

I'd guess...

they let the trio keep playing there through instructs and spring, hoping things somehow work themselves out naturally, by one of the 3 outplaying the others, or by Simmons bat proving he should move to the mound, or by natural growth in the maturing bodies of Lipka and Salcedo, or what have you.

http://sportsandgrits.blogspot.com/

by Mr. Sanchez on Dec 1, 2010 9:42 AM EST up reply actions  

I’d like to see Lipka get a shot in center an see what he can do there, we’ve got shortstops coming up, and if Salcedo isn’t ready next year, an extreme long shot, hopefully Pastornicky will be, Lipka will hopefully be ready in a couple of years as a CF, Salcedo as a SS with Pastornicky as a Super-Ute.

by MO'toole on Dec 1, 2010 9:51 AM EST up reply actions  

If he is eventually destined for CF...

I’d like to see Lipka moved there soon, so he can learn the nuances of CF, getting reads off bats and such, asap.

http://sportsandgrits.blogspot.com/

by Mr. Sanchez on Dec 1, 2010 10:05 AM EST up reply actions  

wouldn't be a bad move...

but if the Braves move a top infield prospect to the outfield it’s probably going to be Mycal Jones. His speed and B.J. Upton like skill set, combined with an outstanding attitude and work ethic make him the best CF switch candidate in my opinion.

by MWhitexx on Dec 1, 2010 10:29 AM EST up reply actions  

maybe another reason he ends up there

is to get ABs while the other short stops are playing

by willlinn on Dec 1, 2010 1:29 PM EST up reply actions  

Question...

who has the higher ceiling: Lipka or Salcedo? My vote would be for Salcedo.

by dunnytwogloves on Dec 1, 2010 9:43 AM EST reply actions  

That's no knock on Lipka

Salcedo has really been jerked around through all of the investigation into his age and not being able to have consistent play against higher competition until he hit the US and got to Rome. I initially thought that the Braves were being very aggressive with him and it proved true….HOWEVER….I got to watch 10-15 Rome games and Salcedo four times. He oozes four tools easily and the speed is above average in my opinion which means to me as he gets older and “thicker” he will be a good baserunner, not a road-runner. Of the at-bats I saw, pitch recognition is where he needs work (he murders fastballs)…

I like Lipka a lot, but I think his profile is more beneficial in CF. Ideally thinking far off..Salcedo at 3B, Simmons at SS (DO NOT underestimate this kid), and Lipka in CF.

"Just because we fall from a different tree,
doesn't mean we're not created equally"

by deester11 on Dec 1, 2010 9:51 AM EST up reply actions  

Just from what has been reported here, I’m just not that sold on Simmons, he might surprise me, and from what I’ve read, it’d be a very welcome surprise, he’s supposed to be lights out at short…

by MO'toole on Dec 1, 2010 9:53 AM EST up reply actions  

That’s the point with Simmons. If he shows .270 potential at SS, he’s going to be a good SS. (I haven’t seen him yet), but he sounds Andrus-esque. He was the best defensive SS in the draft.

"Just because we fall from a different tree,
doesn't mean we're not created equally"

by deester11 on Dec 1, 2010 9:54 AM EST up reply actions  

+1

If we could get great defense, about .270-.280 w/ a good OBP and plenty steal that’d be perfect.

by Jay212033 on Dec 1, 2010 10:10 AM EST up reply actions  

Plus his nickname is The Wizard! If he can do back flips on the field then I’m sold on this kid.

http://www.baseball-reference.com/bullpen/Andrelton_Simmons

by vooodooo on Dec 1, 2010 10:20 AM EST up reply actions  

My vote is for Salcedo.

I wrote a novel, it's about baseball, you should buy it:
http://www.amazon.com/Four-C-B-Wilkins/dp/1449578454/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1257720610&sr=1-1
www.dropoutproductions.com

by cbwilk on Dec 1, 2010 10:31 AM EST up reply actions  

Salcedo...

Everything I’ve read projects Salcedo to move to 3B. Anyone seen something that suggests he’ll stick at SS?

by charlestonbrave on Dec 1, 2010 10:59 AM EST up reply actions  

cbwik...

Says he’ll stay at SS, so I’m inclined to believe it. He pisses minor league prospect knowledge excellence.

If he can play great defense and swing a Tulo/HRam-like bat, I’m all for leaving him there. 3B can be filled by any number of players from other positions. If the Salcedo projections are correct, his bat would be above-average at 3B but elite at SS.

-C

It’s rough to sit through these games and not have someone that can’t hit a Ball?

by cthabeerman on Dec 1, 2010 12:02 PM EST up reply actions  

Salcedo could be a legit superstar one day,

but that’s not to say Lipka couldn’t be very good himself.

"That guy mvhsbball is really an insufferable schmuck." - FuquaManuel

by Scott Coleman on Dec 1, 2010 12:38 PM EST up reply actions  

Salcedo is the moat talented position prospect in the system

by yondaime4 on Dec 1, 2010 1:04 PM EST via mobile up reply actions  

Simmons

I really hope his bat improves cause his defense may be the best in the minors plus he has tremendous speed. Honestly if he could hit .270-.280/.350-.360/.400-.410 w/ 30-40 steal in the ML i’d be super happy. Also he doesn’t K much and has a good BB rate so he’d be a good LO/2nd hitter. I really rooting for him to stick at SS.

by Jay212033 on Dec 1, 2010 9:55 AM EST reply actions  

We;ll never see .400-.410 slg it seems...

but if the guy can get upwards of .350 obp, with his defense and speed, that’ll be good enough.

http://sportsandgrits.blogspot.com/

by Mr. Sanchez on Dec 1, 2010 10:07 AM EST up reply actions  

How can you say we'll never see a .400+ slg?

He did it in college and the dude is rail thin and has plenty room to grow. He also hit very well in college and hit very well towards the end of this season as well so he’s capable.

by Jay212033 on Dec 1, 2010 10:19 AM EST up reply actions  

Fine, I shouldn't say never...

but reports make it extremely unlikely.

http://sportsandgrits.blogspot.com/

by Mr. Sanchez on Dec 1, 2010 10:37 AM EST up reply actions  

and is only 21 and has only been in the U.S. for a few short years. before that, his nutrition, access to weight training, etc., all have to be viewed with some doubt.

by fandave on Dec 1, 2010 11:26 AM EST up reply actions  

Exactly Jay. In his first 220 at bats, he struck out 12 times and had stolen 18 bases in 22 tries. If we have other hitters who develop some power and hold their own, a .270 BA, good plate discipline and GG defense would be good enough to place in our future lineup

"Just because we fall from a different tree,
doesn't mean we're not created equally"

by deester11 on Dec 1, 2010 10:01 AM EST reply actions  

Great stuff CB, thanks

I’m enough of an idiot to not be able to understand Simmons being rated higher than Pastornicky when Pastornicky is being looked at as a possibility for 2012 and Simmons might be a pitcher, but then hearing about Simmons stud defense I guess it makes sense.

I had no idea that Salcedo was pretty much out of organized ball for so long, it might take him a minute to get everything together.

So, we have a surplus of pitchers and a surplus of SS’s in a few years, I hope Wren gets us a surplus of OF’s in next years draft!

Free Matt Young!

by bighop on Dec 1, 2010 10:35 AM EST reply actions  

I agree about the age between Simmons and Pastornicky. I didn’t understand it either, but that’s part of creating the list with three other people. My personal SS list was Salcedo, Lipka, Sanchez, Pastornicky, and Simmons.

I wrote a novel, it's about baseball, you should buy it:
http://www.amazon.com/Four-C-B-Wilkins/dp/1449578454/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1257720610&sr=1-1
www.dropoutproductions.com

by cbwilk on Dec 1, 2010 10:44 AM EST up reply actions  

Wow

Sanchez at third, he must really be a player. Looking forward to hearing more about him. Thanks again.

Free Matt Young!

by bighop on Dec 1, 2010 10:46 AM EST up reply actions  

You think Sanchez’s baseball instincts are that good?

"Check out this bitchin' homemade tesla coil!"

by bwellnjonesco on Dec 1, 2010 11:22 AM EST up reply actions  

I tend to overrate the unknown international guys, if only to get them on the radar, but I like what I’ve heard about him. I had Christian Bethancourt way up the list before anyone knew how good he was (of course I’d actually seen him). I like taking a chance with those young guys. Of course, sometimes I’ll be dead wrong, but that’s the gamble.

I wrote a novel, it's about baseball, you should buy it:
http://www.amazon.com/Four-C-B-Wilkins/dp/1449578454/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1257720610&sr=1-1
www.dropoutproductions.com

by cbwilk on Dec 1, 2010 5:32 PM EST up reply actions  

Shortstop had the most discord between the lists as well. It was the only position where we weren’t unanimous on at least the top spot with 2 guys choosing Lipka and two guys choosing Salcedo.

by yondaime4 on Dec 1, 2010 1:52 PM EST up reply actions  

i want to look at a list of SS 2b and 3b

because I know we have a lot of SS, but isnt that the position that will feed our 3b and 2b?

When are we looking at those prospects?
At some point we are going to have to think about them together.

by willlinn on Dec 1, 2010 1:37 PM EST up reply actions  

The second basemen were last week, the third basemen were a few days ago.

I wrote a novel, it's about baseball, you should buy it:
http://www.amazon.com/Four-C-B-Wilkins/dp/1449578454/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1257720610&sr=1-1
www.dropoutproductions.com

by cbwilk on Dec 1, 2010 5:31 PM EST up reply actions  

third basemen are friday

by yondaime4 on Dec 1, 2010 6:01 PM EST up reply actions  

You know, when I was typing it I’m sure that’s what I said, but damned if it didn’t come out completely different.

I wrote a novel, it's about baseball, you should buy it:
http://www.amazon.com/Four-C-B-Wilkins/dp/1449578454/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1257720610&sr=1-1
www.dropoutproductions.com

by cbwilk on Dec 1, 2010 6:44 PM EST up reply actions  

lazy typing previewing there

by fandave on Dec 1, 2010 7:26 PM EST up reply actions  

What the hell is previewing?

I wrote a novel, it's about baseball, you should buy it:
http://www.amazon.com/Four-C-B-Wilkins/dp/1449578454/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1257720610&sr=1-1
www.dropoutproductions.com

by cbwilk on Dec 1, 2010 7:33 PM EST up reply actions  

I love that none of these guys was with the organization a year ago.

Kudos to Wren for improving our SS depth, even if half these guys probably have to move to another position eventually.

Personally, I think Rome is a bit too aggressive for both Lipka and Salcedo at this point. I’d like to see both of them prove themselves at Danville first. Obviously, that’s not really feasible, but given the fact that they both can’t play every day at SS at the same level, it wouldn’t be a bad idea to start one of them at Danville. Then, if in June, the one in Danville has shown he’s ready, we can worry about the glut at that point.

"Yeah, and I have an enchanted jock strap." -- Karl Karlson

by Jacob Peterson on Dec 1, 2010 11:24 AM EST reply actions  

By Wren’s own account, Salcedo did very well in the Instructional League. Considering the praise he got as “flourishing again,” Salcedo will repeat Rome. I think the Braves feel he’s advanced and with a full year at Rome, we should see the real Salcedo. His development should be fine.

"Just because we fall from a different tree,
doesn't mean we're not created equally"

by deester11 on Dec 1, 2010 11:46 AM EST up reply actions  

I don’t think either one of them need Danville at all. Advanced players have no problem going from the GCL to Low A, and Lipka is certainly advanced. It will be something to find out how the Braves do handle things, but I definitely don’t think either of them need to waste a full season waiting to go to Danville in June.

Also, this doesn’t make sense:

it wouldn’t be a bad idea to start one of them at Danville. Then, if in June, the one in Danville has shown he’s ready, we can worry about the glut at that point.

Danville’s season doesn’t start until about the 20th of June.

I wrote a novel, it's about baseball, you should buy it:
http://www.amazon.com/Four-C-B-Wilkins/dp/1449578454/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1257720610&sr=1-1
www.dropoutproductions.com

by cbwilk on Dec 1, 2010 5:35 PM EST up reply actions  

Hmm.

Our top SS prospect will probably not be a SS by the time he is done developing and making his MLB debut. That’s ok. We could use a centerfielder who hates it when baseballs get all up in his personal space.

Our #2 prospect is two years behind the curve already, and may end up being a third baseman unless the FO can steer him away from beef and MuscleFuel™.

Our #3 prospect? Should be pitching. But he wants to hit, so…

Leaving Pastornicky, who looks to be the closest thing we have to a sights-on SS we have in the farm. No complaints here; I think your shortstop should be a contact hitter with good on-base skills and quickness, not really a masher.

Of course, why have a Top 4 when you can reach down the barrel a-ways and have ourselves a Top 5? I hope Sanchez pans out, though. I don’t usually think of Europe as a place where we go to find prospects – I honestly thought Tenerife was in Aruba or some other Dutch Caribbean holding. It would be nice to grow the sport in the Old World.

SOCIALMEDIA:"FACEBOOK" DOWN, MUST FIND NEW WAYS TO DEEPSTALK AREA FEMALES FOR HUMAN GANT RON TO SEX AKA DONG AFTER BRAVES ATL LOSSES --CyborgHanson48

by Chopaholic on Dec 1, 2010 12:06 PM EST reply actions  

5 young, good short stops

God I love having a problem like that. Reminds me of a team with a pitching glut I heard about once. But pitchers can just be starters or relievers. These cats can be SS, 3B, 2B, CF and a pitcher! Hell, they could nearly be a whole team.

Free Matt Young!

by bighop on Dec 1, 2010 12:19 PM EST up reply actions  

Tenerife

is in the Canary Islands. At least we weren’t like the Pirates and signed two dudes from India who won a reality show contest…

by TBuzz on Dec 1, 2010 12:55 PM EST via mobile up reply actions  

there was a show called the "million dollar arm"...

in India where they took cricket bowlers and tried to teach them how to pitch the guy who throws the fastest won the equivalent of $100,000, the winner and runner up ended up signing with the Pirates. The guy who won is a a lefty named Rinku Singh he’s still in the organization as far as I know, the runner up a righty named DInesh Patel just got released a few weeks ago.

Singh is playing winter ball in Australia right now.

by MWhitexx on Dec 1, 2010 1:55 PM EST up reply actions  

wow

how fast did they go?

how professional were the bowlers?

by willlinn on Dec 1, 2010 2:22 PM EST up reply actions  

bowlers are FAST

but aren’t allowed to curve the ball in the traditional sense. see, curves and sliders are based on quick wrist movements (snaps, as it were), bowlers only throw straight and rely on pressure differental of the fingers to get spin. great pitchers do both, wrist snap and finger pressure. it would, by logic, be easy to teach the wrist snap.

if the team wasn’t Pittsburg.

by apoxonbothyourhouses on Dec 1, 2010 3:19 PM EST up reply actions  

they weren’t pros, and were only 19 and 20 at the time of the show. Singh throws a baseball about 91-94 and Patel 90-92 no idea how fast they bowled. It’s hard to say because the ball is lighter and depending on how you throw you might be able to throw it harder or maybe not as hard.

by MWhitexx on Dec 1, 2010 8:46 PM EST up reply actions  

You do know, of course, that we have signed a Russian LH pitcher?

by fandave on Dec 1, 2010 4:01 PM EST up reply actions  

another reason why i wouldnt be a fan of extending Uggla

It looks to me like our future infield could be

Freeman 1B
Lipka 2B
Pastornicky SS
Salcedo 3B

Granted we wont see any of these guys till probably 2013 extending Uggla would create a log jam. After next season Nate will be gone and I’m pretty sure we will have a long term solution in CF by that time whether its Schafer or someone else. Same goes for LF so there is no place for Lipka in the OF.

Plus we could use that extension money on Uggla for new McCann, Hanson, or Heyward contracts

by drumzalicious on Dec 1, 2010 12:48 PM EST via mobile reply actions  

No way.

Salcedo and Lipka wouldn’t be ready until 2013 at the very earliest, and I’m guessing that if/when they are ready to play every day, it won’t be until 2014. And let’s not forget these guys are both like 18; there’s absolutely no guarantee they make the big leagues.

Uggla is only 31. He’s not going to age well, but he’s playing just as well as he ever has. As long as he’s gone by the time he’s 34 or so (which would be 2014 — when Salcedo/Lipka would probably be ready), we would be fine.

I still vote we keep Uggla through 2013 or 2014. Neither of these guys are close to be sure things, while Uggla is a proven stud.

"That guy mvhsbball is really an insufferable schmuck." - FuquaManuel

by Scott Coleman on Dec 1, 2010 12:57 PM EST up reply actions  

I doubt he takes a 3 year extension and even then I don’t want him

by drumzalicious on Dec 1, 2010 1:29 PM EST via mobile up reply actions  

Why?

"That guy mvhsbball is really an insufferable schmuck." - FuquaManuel

by Scott Coleman on Dec 1, 2010 1:51 PM EST up reply actions  

bc a 3 year extension puts him at 34, and he would presumably be unable to get a comparable contract at that time…he will be past his prime and in his decline phase (presumably). This is his one shot at a big FA contract…he will like most players do attempt to get the biggest deal he can find. it is my guess he won’t sign for anything less than 5y and 60M, but thats just a guess…tough to know if such a market is out there…but he will ultimately sign more than a 3 year deal, assuredly…it wouldnt be prudent for him to do otherwise.

"No. Lonely people mixing with one another? Breeding? Creating an even lonelier generation? You're not even allowing natural selection do its work. Pssh. You're like the guy who invented the seat belt."

Dwight Schrute

by Swo12bv on Dec 1, 2010 2:06 PM EST up reply actions  

If we can keep him until he’s 34 or so, I’d be all for it. If he wants a bigger deal than that, we should forget about it. I know he wanted a 5-year deal with the Marlins, but this isn’t Florida. I have a feeling he would rather be happy, closer to home, and playing for one of the top franchises in baseball instead of going somewhere else for a few million dollars extra.

"That guy mvhsbball is really an insufferable schmuck." - FuquaManuel

by Scott Coleman on Dec 1, 2010 2:13 PM EST up reply actions  

I agree

Once he sees what the Braves organization is really like, added to the close to home part, I think he will drop the 5 year demand. I think that was more his way to insure getting out of Florida and away from H Ramirez.

Free Matt Young!

by bighop on Dec 1, 2010 2:19 PM EST up reply actions  

I have a feeling he would rather be happy, closer to home, and playing for one of the top franchises in baseball instead of going somewhere else for a few million dollars extra.

Other than Chipper Jones, who else has that EVER applied to? We can assume McCann once his arb years have run, but why do we keep saying this foolish phrase?

Also, it’s not a few million dollars extra. It’s probably significant 8 figures over multiple years that you are talking about his giving up, just to play for a “great organization”. It doesn’t work like that. At his age, he’ll want 4-5 guaranteed. He might take a few less dollars for Atlanta, but it won’t be more than a couple, and he’ll still demand 4-5 years. We won’t get a discount on the number of years, and they’ll all cost 8 figures (likely 12-15 per).

http://sportsandgrits.blogspot.com/

by Mr. Sanchez on Dec 1, 2010 3:21 PM EST up reply actions  

it is important to note…to my knowledge…there is absolutely no evidence CHipper ever took a reduction in pay…he says he took a reduction, but without market forces we have no clue what his worth is to the market…all he did was restructure his contracts and move money around which helped the team in theshort run, but resulted in us paying a 39 y old 3B 13M this year (in the FA market he wouldn’t make more than 6-7M).

Don’t get me wrong, I’m not complaining about what Chipper has done, many players wouldnt even restructure deals…and it may be true that he took less than he would have gotten from other teams…but we really don’t know as Chipper has never tested FA waters…we just assume he got less than he was worth (although our valuation of Chipper is probably way off, seeing as we are huge Chipper fans).

there has been a fair amount of writing to this point, no players give home town discounts…it isnt prudent for them or for players in general. If someone like McCann takes a huge discount, it completely ruins the pay scale for all the other Catchers, bc few teams will pay their catcher more than McCann gets in a FA contract. The union puts a fair amount of pressure on all players to get all they can so that all players benefit…there are a ton of considerations

"No. Lonely people mixing with one another? Breeding? Creating an even lonelier generation? You're not even allowing natural selection do its work. Pssh. You're like the guy who invented the seat belt."

Dwight Schrute

by Swo12bv on Dec 1, 2010 3:43 PM EST up reply actions  

Hudson’s deal was considered a discount too, going from $15M per to $9M per. Because he wanted to stay in Atlanta, close to home. Two years ago, Chipper was making $9M per, as a player in his prime, winning a batting title, and making roughly $20M per less than ARod.

Free Matt Young!

by bighop on Dec 1, 2010 3:50 PM EST up reply actions  

he was making 9M which was a discount, now he is making 13M which is higher than he is worth at this point…like i said all he did was move money around…13M would have been appropriate for a 37 year old 3B how is pretty darn good…just like 9M would be close to appropriate for a 39y 3B coming off a knee injury.

like i said he is a great player and I love him, but he didnt take that big of a discount, if any at all.

Hudson is exactly the same…if there was a discount it was like 3-4M over the life of the contract…which is pretty insignificant ….just bc he made 15M the year before isnt an indication of what he is worth in the FA market when he signed the latest contract…he pitched great in 2010, but when he signed the deal he was in his 30s and just coming off TJ surgery…he would have gotten a handsome sum of money, but he wouldn’t have gotten 15M, presumably. maybe I’m wrong…its certainly possible…

"No. Lonely people mixing with one another? Breeding? Creating an even lonelier generation? You're not even allowing natural selection do its work. Pssh. You're like the guy who invented the seat belt."

Dwight Schrute

by Swo12bv on Dec 1, 2010 6:09 PM EST up reply actions  

$3-4M is not insignificant.

by fandave on Dec 1, 2010 7:30 PM EST up reply actions  

over three years it is 1M a year…which is pretty insignificant in regards to the payroll of the Braves and the bank account of Chipper or Timmy

"No. Lonely people mixing with one another? Breeding? Creating an even lonelier generation? You're not even allowing natural selection do its work. Pssh. You're like the guy who invented the seat belt."

Dwight Schrute

by Swo12bv on Dec 1, 2010 9:06 PM EST up reply actions  

Johnny Damon made 8 last year...

and considering Chipper is probably a better defender, at a more valuable defensive position, and a little better bat, I don’t think his current salary is too far off from what it would be on the open market. And see Jeter getting offered $15 per, demanding over $20 per, and I’d consider Chipper a similar still solid, but aging and well past their prime, face of a franchise.

http://sportsandgrits.blogspot.com/

by Mr. Sanchez on Dec 2, 2010 9:09 AM EST up reply actions  

While I agree with your point, didn’t Smoltzie take a few million less to stay with us over the Yanks several years back?

by get swoll yunel on Dec 1, 2010 9:18 PM EST up reply actions  

Why is everyone assuming that as soon as Uggla turns 34 his body is just going to wither away to dust Indiana Jones style? Make a compromise and give him a 4 year deal, maybe a bit more front-loaded. How bad could he possibly be at 35, 18-20 HRs?

by king of games on Dec 1, 2010 4:48 PM EST up reply actions  

statistics and numerous studies have shown that players bdoies begin to break down after they reach 31, they begin to break down even faster around their mid 30s…this is especially true of players who have TTO skills. uggla is such a player he has prodigious power, and relies on a good eye. when his bat slows he loses power and only has a good eye. since is not a great defender as he ages he is worht less and less and drops off relatively quickly…this is the general rule of players…although there are certainly exceptions.

"No. Lonely people mixing with one another? Breeding? Creating an even lonelier generation? You're not even allowing natural selection do its work. Pssh. You're like the guy who invented the seat belt."

Dwight Schrute

by Swo12bv on Dec 1, 2010 6:11 PM EST up reply actions  

It’s not like he’s a fatty like Prince Firlder though, and he’s not hitting 50 homers per year. Plus he’s been known as a hard worker. If he gives us 15-20 homers in the last year of a 4 year extension and 25-30ish for the other three, I’ll take it.

by king of games on Dec 1, 2010 8:47 PM EST up reply actions  

This is ridiculous

Everyone knows that in Raiders of the Lost Ark they were melted, not turned into dust.

Don't kiss an ass if it's in the process of shitting on you.

"…aren’t worthy enough to hold his (Pujols) ass cheeks apart while Playboy models wipe him with thousand dollar bills after he craps out the cure to whatever previously-incurable disease." by royhobbs 1/7/09

by buzzdeadwax on Dec 1, 2010 8:03 PM EST up reply actions  

lots of people dying weird ways in those films.

by MWhitexx on Dec 1, 2010 8:48 PM EST up reply actions  

Wait

Was that after they drank from the wrong cup? If so, my apologies. I didn’t see that one as many times as ROTLA.

Don't kiss an ass if it's in the process of shitting on you.

"…aren’t worthy enough to hold his (Pujols) ass cheeks apart while Playboy models wipe him with thousand dollar bills after he craps out the cure to whatever previously-incurable disease." by royhobbs 1/7/09

by buzzdeadwax on Dec 2, 2010 1:48 PM EST up reply actions  

Correct..

“he chose, poorly”.

http://sportsandgrits.blogspot.com/

by Mr. Sanchez on Dec 2, 2010 3:18 PM EST up reply actions  

its pretty easy to figure out which cup it is…its the one with Jesus’s name on it

"No. Lonely people mixing with one another? Breeding? Creating an even lonelier generation? You're not even allowing natural selection do its work. Pssh. You're like the guy who invented the seat belt."

Dwight Schrute

by Swo12bv on Dec 2, 2010 5:09 PM EST up reply actions  

Huge assumption

to think that they would all be Major League starter-ready when they are 22-23 I think…

by TBuzz on Dec 1, 2010 1:14 PM EST via mobile up reply actions  

if Gonzo goes soon, who will be ready first?

I’d say Simmons. Let’s not forget we won pennants with Rafael Belliard out there. If Simmons is Belliard with an arm better than Furcal, all I’m asking is “can he bunt?”

With the rest of our projected lineup, he could hit .230 and help us if he is that good of a fielder. That’s what Omar Vizquel hit in his first 1000 AB’s over his first three years in the majors. The hitting will come eventually.

Of course he could also pitch a little on the side, just to see how much command he can get over that 98mph stuff. No need to get all Rick Ankiel about things.

by JimK on Dec 1, 2010 12:53 PM EST reply actions  

its a huge risk in playing a guy like Simmons in the bigs before he is ready…he may have the talent to be a legit ML, and by putting him int he ML and hoping he figures out to hit….could result in him sucking ass and being out of the league in a couple of years. Omar Vizquel is probably the exception to the rule, in that he turned into a very acceptable hitter.

"No. Lonely people mixing with one another? Breeding? Creating an even lonelier generation? You're not even allowing natural selection do its work. Pssh. You're like the guy who invented the seat belt."

Dwight Schrute

by Swo12bv on Dec 1, 2010 1:05 PM EST up reply actions  

If you put Andrelton Simmons in the Majors in 2012 he wouldn’t even come close to .200, much less .230. I like the kid, I really do, he’s a fantastic athlete with a great attitude and natural leadership abilities, as well as ridiculously good defense, but you can’t push him further than he’s capable of handling.

I wrote a novel, it's about baseball, you should buy it:
http://www.amazon.com/Four-C-B-Wilkins/dp/1449578454/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1257720610&sr=1-1
www.dropoutproductions.com

by cbwilk on Dec 1, 2010 5:39 PM EST up reply actions  

If Gonzo goes down...

Diory Hernandez or Brandon Hicks will get the first crack at it. If they are both epic fails we will either trade for a stopgap like Jerry Hariston or Pastornicky gets a shot. He really profiles best at 2B but will stay at SS as long as they can keep him there. Myke Jones might get a look if he has a monster spring training also, though he probably profiles best at CF or 2B.

by MWhitexx on Dec 1, 2010 1:58 PM EST reply actions  

I think Myke Jones will be our Super utility late in 2011 or out of ST in 2012.

Free Matt Young!

by bighop on Dec 1, 2010 2:04 PM EST up reply actions  

I think Myke being a super utility in 2012 is a pretty good bet.

I wrote a novel, it's about baseball, you should buy it:
http://www.amazon.com/Four-C-B-Wilkins/dp/1449578454/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1257720610&sr=1-1
www.dropoutproductions.com

by cbwilk on Dec 1, 2010 5:39 PM EST up reply actions  

i like that idea...

he’s got major tools and is a great guy.

by MWhitexx on Dec 1, 2010 5:47 PM EST up reply actions  

Whoa, whoa, whoa

WHERE is Mycal Jones?

I’d also wager that Andrelton Simmons doesn’t end up being a SS and guarantee you Edward Salcedo doesn’t end up being a SS.

"The WAR folks like yunel apparently. i know this, bobby cox hated going to war with this guy." - Jon Heyman

Beyond the Box Score / Capitol Avenue Club / shwitter: @CapitolAvenue

by PWHjort on Dec 1, 2010 3:24 PM EST reply actions  

If I'm not mistaken, he was their #1 2B prospect...

and has been quoted as saying he’s moving to that position.

http://sportsandgrits.blogspot.com/

by Mr. Sanchez on Dec 1, 2010 3:26 PM EST up reply actions  

Agree 100% with you on Salcedo not staying at SS.

"That guy mvhsbball is really an insufferable schmuck." - FuquaManuel

by Scott Coleman on Dec 1, 2010 3:49 PM EST up reply actions  

I just don’t understand this. He’s not a big kid. He’s tall and quick as hell. He’s got years to put on muscle, but there’s not an ounce of fat on him right now. If you lined all these guys up and I said, who’s the most athletic, who’s the guy you want at SS, 99 out of 100 folks would pick Salcedo.

I wrote a novel, it's about baseball, you should buy it:
http://www.amazon.com/Four-C-B-Wilkins/dp/1449578454/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1257720610&sr=1-1
www.dropoutproductions.com

by cbwilk on Dec 1, 2010 5:41 PM EST up reply actions  

as always i trust your opinion on this and also as always don’t really give any weight to what MVHS says..

"No. Lonely people mixing with one another? Breeding? Creating an even lonelier generation? You're not even allowing natural selection do its work. Pssh. You're like the guy who invented the seat belt."

Dwight Schrute

by Swo12bv on Dec 1, 2010 6:13 PM EST up reply actions  

I don’t either.

"That guy mvhsbball is really an insufferable schmuck." - FuquaManuel

by Scott Coleman on Dec 1, 2010 6:22 PM EST up reply actions  

MVHS hasn't seen him though,...

PWHjort has, and he disagrees. Not saying cb is wrong, just saying that we’ll know the answer a little better as he climbs up the ranks, matures, and gets closer to 20-21.

http://sportsandgrits.blogspot.com/

by Mr. Sanchez on Dec 2, 2010 9:12 AM EST up reply actions  

i definitely respect PWHjort’s opinion, and we will definitely see…i have no clue where he ends up bc i haven’t seen him play.

"No. Lonely people mixing with one another? Breeding? Creating an even lonelier generation? You're not even allowing natural selection do its work. Pssh. You're like the guy who invented the seat belt."

Dwight Schrute

by Swo12bv on Dec 2, 2010 10:35 AM EST up reply actions  

I don’t think it’s a matter of his size, just team need. We’re short of top talent at Third and if Lipka is ahead of him in our SS rankings, moving him to Third just makes sense logistically, I would think.

by king of games on Dec 1, 2010 8:54 PM EST up reply actions  

Well, Salcedo is ahead in my rankings, but they’re both great players and I’m excited to see how it all turns out.

I wrote a novel, it's about baseball, you should buy it:
http://www.amazon.com/Four-C-B-Wilkins/dp/1449578454/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1257720610&sr=1-1
www.dropoutproductions.com

by cbwilk on Dec 2, 2010 1:02 AM EST up reply actions  

Not a big kid?

He’s HUGE!

Prototypical corner frame with broad shoulders and a muscular build. He’s got a good first step and nice instincts, but he doesn’t run well enough to stay at SS.

My guess is he ends up at 3rd (at least initially) but all 4 of the corners are in play.

"The WAR folks like yunel apparently. i know this, bobby cox hated going to war with this guy." - Jon Heyman

Beyond the Box Score / Capitol Avenue Club / shwitter: @CapitolAvenue

by PWHjort on Dec 2, 2010 7:48 PM EST up reply actions  

I saw him play this season and am convinced he would be fantastic at third. Many of his errors were on balls that were on the periphery of his range that many SS wouldn’t get to or over throws where he had a lot of time to think. He could have great mobility at 3B and some of the plays where he has a lot of time coming in would be eliminated by what is often a longer throw.

Could be very like David Wright at third.

by MWhitexx on Dec 2, 2010 8:41 PM EST up reply actions  

Unless he's pre-steroids Ken Caminiti...

Why not keep him at SS??

If his range is so great, it suits him better to stay there, and his offense obviously plays better at SS than it will at 3B.

For those who don’t remember (or are too young), you couldn’t get through a great fielding montage without seeing 8 Caminiti plays during the early 90s…and 7 of the plays were nade on hard-hit balls on Astroturf. The guy practically swallowed doubles down the line for a living.

-C

It’s rough to sit through these games and not have someone that can’t hit a Ball?

by cthabeerman on Dec 3, 2010 1:29 AM EST up reply actions  

Pretty sure everyone is pretty convinced Lipka has the SS job to lose. Pastornicky will probably go to 2nd/Util and Salcedo to third. The other guys are all probably utility/trade/bench/injury replacement fodder.

by king of games on Dec 1, 2010 4:54 PM EST up reply actions  

So much can happen in the years before these guys are ready, the only thing I’m convinced of is we have a bunch of very good young players that could fit into several different positions of need. An Uggla extension could affect Pastornicky, Prado could be the man at 3rd for 5 or 6 more years, Lipka could see a more open path to the Majors if he moves to CF, not to mention future trades and drafts could block any of these guys.

In a vacuum, Pastornicky at 2nd, Lipka at SS and Salcedo at 3rd is great in Dec 2010. But come March 2014, there’s no telling what these guys will be doing, I just hope they are doing it for the Braves. They look like extremely versatile players,

Free Matt Young!

by bighop on Dec 1, 2010 5:12 PM EST up reply actions  

Yeah, obviously everything can change on a dime, but I’m comfortable with penciling Lipka/Salcedo into the starting spots in 2013 or 14. I don’t know if TP will have the bat or the arm to stick as a starter, but he could easily be an Omar Infante type off the bench. Unlike most around here, I don’t expect Uggla to hit a steel reinforced wall on his 34th birthday and I expect him to be around and productive for 4 more years as everyone in the clubhouse and FO seem to love the guy.

by king of games on Dec 1, 2010 5:29 PM EST up reply actions  

For as long as we’ve bullshitted around getting a RH power bat, letting Uggla go after one season does seem crazy considering the reception he has gotten, good point.

Free Matt Young!

by bighop on Dec 1, 2010 5:49 PM EST up reply actions  

i think everyone agrees we should try to resign him, but our interests and his interests don’t seem to align well. it doesn’t make sense to give him more than 3 years (4 at the most)…he has stated he wants a 5 year deal and will seek that this offseason… meaning we would have him until he is 36 or 37…which doesnt sound like a great idea.

losing him after one year might hurt us, but keeping him for 4-5 might hurt us worse.

"No. Lonely people mixing with one another? Breeding? Creating an even lonelier generation? You're not even allowing natural selection do its work. Pssh. You're like the guy who invented the seat belt."

Dwight Schrute

by Swo12bv on Dec 1, 2010 6:15 PM EST up reply actions  

I think we align very well. The Braves need a RH power bat and Uggla gets to play for a top notch organization with a Mgr he is familiar with and likes, on a team with players that are thrilled he is there, relatively close to home. Wren can offer him a 3 or 4 year deal, if he declines, he’s gone. I can’t imagine Wren giving him 5 years anyway. Not after the 4 year deal he gave Lowe.

Free Matt Young!

by bighop on Dec 1, 2010 6:29 PM EST up reply actions  

what concerns me with an Uggla extension is 2012. We will still have Chipper Jones, Tim Hudson, and Derek Lowe on the books for one more year with only KK, Alec Gonzalez and Nate McLouth( and perhaps signings later this year) coming off them. Thats around 14 million.

Uggla wanted 14.2 a year from the Marlins so presumably he wants at least 12 to stay in ATL.

So basically we will have to get a CF and SS(if a prospect isn’t ready for either spot) and probably at least one bullpen guy for about 2 million dollars, if one of these guys is up to playing SS or CF everyday were okay but if they don’t then were dumpster diving for starting players.

by MWhitexx on Dec 1, 2010 8:56 PM EST up reply actions  

That’s why I think the compromise will be at 4 years, and I’d be fine with that. Obviously three years would be best for the team, but you can’t expect Uggla to just sacrifice for the sake of sacrifice without getting something in return.

by king of games on Dec 1, 2010 9:00 PM EST up reply actions  

I think the 5 year requirement that Uggla wanted from the Marlins had more to do with thinking 4 yr/$48MM was a joke.

I think Uggla would do 4 years if the total was in the $55MM-$60MM range…

by TBuzz on Dec 1, 2010 9:20 PM EST up reply actions  

The 5 yr/$71M was directly set because of Hanley’s 5 yr/$70M.

Free Matt Young!

by bighop on Dec 1, 2010 9:45 PM EST up reply actions  

Great job with the list CB, always like reading this type of thing.

braves#1

by rockybull on Dec 1, 2010 6:35 PM EST reply actions  

Between Salcedo and Simmons- I’d say moving Lipka to CF now should be done.

There’s no guarantee Schaefer will make it

At the very least- it sounds like Simmons could turn into a Belliard-type shortstop, and in today’s baseball, I think a Belliard would be a lot more of an asset then he would have been in the juiceball era.

Pastornicky could develop into something decent also.

I feel pretty good at least two of these four guys will develop into a starter quality SS. I’m not confident we have someone who will end up starter quality CF right now.

by Broccoman on Dec 2, 2010 5:11 AM EST reply actions  

Neither one of those guys

is going to end up sticking at SS I wouldn’t think.

Lipka’s got the tools/athleticism to stick there and has excellent work ethic. He signed for slot and started playing right away. Disregarding the fact that a SS is slightly harder to find than a CF, I think they have to let Lipka try to make it as a SS. It’s not like he’ll need 4 years of development to learn to play CF if the SS thing doesn’t work.

"The WAR folks like yunel apparently. i know this, bobby cox hated going to war with this guy." - Jon Heyman

Beyond the Box Score / Capitol Avenue Club / shwitter: @CapitolAvenue

by PWHjort on Dec 2, 2010 7:51 PM EST up reply actions  

Matt Lipka is a terrific young bowler and despite his 11 errors in 42 games at the shortstop does no mean that he is out of repair and improvement. I have noticed that players at 18 years and below are still inexperienced despite possessing exceptional skills.

God Disguised as Michael Jordan

by mehmetozgur33 on Dec 2, 2010 7:19 PM EST reply actions  

did, did you say “bowler”…i mean how good can he be…what’s his average…is he in a men’s league or co-ed?…does he drink when he bowls or is it serious time, no embibing.

"No. Lonely people mixing with one another? Breeding? Creating an even lonelier generation? You're not even allowing natural selection do its work. Pssh. You're like the guy who invented the seat belt."

Dwight Schrute

by Swo12bv on Dec 2, 2010 7:46 PM EST up reply actions  

He’s 18, so I certainly hope he doesn’t drink when he bowls.

I wrote a novel, it's about baseball, you should buy it:
http://www.amazon.com/Four-C-B-Wilkins/dp/1449578454/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1257720610&sr=1-1
www.dropoutproductions.com

by cbwilk on Dec 2, 2010 8:14 PM EST up reply actions  

like that stops a dedicated bowler.

"No. Lonely people mixing with one another? Breeding? Creating an even lonelier generation? You're not even allowing natural selection do its work. Pssh. You're like the guy who invented the seat belt."

Dwight Schrute

by Swo12bv on Dec 2, 2010 11:36 PM EST up reply actions  

True story...

I turned down a full-ride (academic) scholarship to Kansas State because I was a better bowler than Bill Snyder was.

This might have helped in my decision as well…

-C

It’s rough to sit through these games and not have someone that can’t hit a Ball?

by cthabeerman on Dec 3, 2010 1:37 AM EST up reply actions  

that guy’s body is on backwards…God must feel like a real jackass for that one

"No. Lonely people mixing with one another? Breeding? Creating an even lonelier generation? You're not even allowing natural selection do its work. Pssh. You're like the guy who invented the seat belt."

Dwight Schrute

by Swo12bv on Dec 3, 2010 8:09 PM EST up reply actions   1 recs

i once bowled a 226…so thats pretty solid, right? and it wasnt like a mistake i am decent

"No. Lonely people mixing with one another? Breeding? Creating an even lonelier generation? You're not even allowing natural selection do its work. Pssh. You're like the guy who invented the seat belt."

Dwight Schrute

by Swo12bv on Dec 3, 2010 8:09 PM EST up reply actions  

this isn’t cricket mate, and if it were he would still be a batsman.

by MWhitexx on Dec 2, 2010 8:37 PM EST up reply actions  

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