Is there tension between the Braves' manager and GM?
by gondeee on Sep 22, 2009 4:18 PM EDT
72 comments
Some interesting stuff from Yahoo's Gordon Edes (hat tip: Rowland's Office)
Another situation that bears watching is in Atlanta, where manager Bobby Cox has been hedging about whether he will be back. According to a major league source, the relationship between Cox and GM Frank Wren deteriorated during the spring to the point that Cox packed his bag and climbed into his car to drive home from spring training until dissuaded from doing so by one of his coaches.
Cox was unhappy at the way the John Smoltz issue had been handled, the source said, and because he had not been kept up to speed on other personnel decisions. The relationship appears to have been patched up, although the parting with Tom Glavine was another strained episode, and the expectation is that Cox will be back because he's excited that the Braves have another core of young talent developing. Stay tuned.
The headline at Rowland's Office was "Will Bobby be Smoltzed?" That's an accurate read on the situation.
My overall thinking here is that Frank Wren is trying to turn the Braves ship in a different direction. It's a similar direction to the one that existed under John Schuerholz, but one in which player loyalty is not valued over player performance as it usually was in the Schuerholz era (a new ideal that Cox may not share). Perhaps more accurately, the issue didn't come up that much in the previous administration since all the players the Braves were loyal to in that era were still high performers. Now that the effectiveness of the Smoltzes and Glavines have faded the organization is realizing it must turn away from some of those longstanding relationships to try and achieve new success with new players.
The same notion may begin to apply to our Hall of Fame manager. In an era of matchups and specialization a new type of manager is needed. The cache of Bobby Cox may also be a diluted one in this era. Back in the early 90's a manager who was loyal to his players above all else was somewhat of a novel thing, but most new-age managers have adopted some form of the Bobby Cox style.
As adventuresome as last off-season was, with the manager question, 6 starting pitchers, no first baseman, no closer, and no left fielder, this off-season is shaping up to be just as interesting.
0 recs |
72 comments
|
Email
Print
Comments
Make it happen Frank. I’m behind you and your giant testis.
"Matt Diaz is a baseball player."-Joe Simpson
by 10-4 on Sep 22, 2009 4:24 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
I am behind Frank
Bobby gave us all he had. But sad to say, it’s time to step down. We havent won a WS for 14 years and missed the playoffs 3 years in a row. Thanks Bobby. Who should be his replacement? Thats a tough question to answer. I would like someone who the players respects, someone who’s played the game and is a players coach.
by AlRoBraves95 on Sep 22, 2009 6:23 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I second that
After how well it worked out when Wren parted ways with Smoltz and Glavine, I think he needs to Smoltz Bobby.
Maybe thats why Schuerholtz moved Wren there, Schuerholtz didn’t want to be the one to give these guys the axe.
Do you know why Buster Olney's initials are BO, because he stinks
by kp.atl on Sep 22, 2009 11:32 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
ideas for a new manager?
I hope Bobby stays but If he doesnt, id like these guys to be considered as a replacement:
The murph
Manny Acta
Maddux
Rocket wheeler
Don't fire Bobby.
by esadb on Sep 22, 2009 4:26 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Dave Duncan?
Mat Gamel is way too cool for double consonants.
by VivaLosBravos on Sep 22, 2009 5:44 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Word is he’s not happy with the way the Cardinals treated his kid.
by John Holton on Sep 23, 2009 11:33 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
If Cox leaves Terry better not take over.
by blitzerlover on Sep 22, 2009 4:30 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
I would go with Chino over Terry.
But Maddux as the manager would be interesting,
(self-appointed President of Yunel's Cartel~~~)
"The future is no place to place your better days." - Dave Matthews ~ RIP Roi
Chief! Do your anti-rain dance!!! Now, damn it! Now!!!
by Chief Noc-A-Homa on Sep 22, 2009 4:36 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Mike Maddux, I assume?
Take care of the little things, and the big things will take care of themselves.
by SunDolphin on Sep 22, 2009 9:45 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Well done, Gondee
“As adventuresome as last off-season was, with the manager question, 6 starting pitchers, no first baseman, no closer, and no left fielder, this off-season is shaping up to be just as interesting.”
That sums it up nicely.
by NEBravesFan33 on Sep 22, 2009 4:45 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Brian Snitker
Dump Cox, then cover the “loyalty” issue by showing loyalty.
by Drom John on Sep 22, 2009 4:52 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
So if Bobby left
Why not make Chip the manager and Sign Chone Figgins
SCOREEE!!!
by drumzalicious on Sep 22, 2009 4:54 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Player Manager. We need to bring that back like Timberlake brought sexy back.
"Actually, Justin was right."
by bigjoe on May 15, 2009 9:04 AM PDT
by justincredubil02 on Sep 22, 2009 5:30 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Touche, Justin.
"...Braves tie! ...Braves tie! ...Braves tie!"
by The Keith Lockhart Era on Sep 22, 2009 11:23 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Mad Dog FTW
Come on guys. He was/is revered as one of, if not THE, biggest genius in the game. His awesomeness didn’t end when we stepped off the mound. I think, even if not for us, and even if not in the near future, he will end up as a manager and probably see success in that role. He most definitely has the mind for it. With that in mind, why not us and why not now? Sign the man.
by J-Freak on Sep 22, 2009 5:03 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Keep Bobby: An Unpopular View
I believe Bobby should stay next year. Although I have listed possible replacement candidates for him before, I like Bobby; he is one of the things that makes the Braves, the Braves. We would likely have no division titles without his front office and managerial leadership. Mark Bowman states a condition for his returning to managerial success that I agree with.
Like was mentioned in this forum a few months ago, Cox isn’t any different than Joe Paterno or Bobby Bowden, who have been forced to rely more heavily on their coaching staffs as they’ve continued to win their battles against Father Time.
This isn’t to say there would have to be a major overhaul on the coaching staff. But the organization could benefit from parting ways with a couple members of Cox’s staff and also changing the roles of some of the other current coaches.
Roger McDowell and, unfortunately, Terry Pendleton need to leave. I would love to see Leo Mazzone back rocking on the bench. Roger has looked like a good pitching coach this year but look at what he has to work with. While he nothing to work with last year and the starting pitching staff collapsed, the 2004 Braves starting pitching staff of Mike Hampton, Russ Ortiz, John Thompson, Paul Byrd, and Jaret Wright combined to go 65-41 with a sub-4.00 ERA due to Mazzone’s coaching. Terry Pendleton, who I like as a player and person a great deal, is an inferior hitting coach compared to Don Baylor, Merv Rettenmund, or Clarence Jones. Terry Pendleton, in honor of his service to the Braves, should be given some other job in the organization. The same goes for Roger McDowell.
by Mr. Glavine #47 on Sep 22, 2009 5:19 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
“. I would love to see Leo Mazzone back rocking on the bench. Roger has looked like a good pitching coach this year but look at what he has to work with.”
Ummm….Leo had much better pitcher for the vast majority of the time he was here. Look at all the good work Leo did in Baltimore…
While he nothing to work with last year and the starting pitching staff collapsed
Hudson – DL
Glavine – DL
Smoltz – DL
Hampton – DL
JoJo Reyes, JJ, Charlie Morton, others I can’t remember right now – if any pitching coach can turn that piecemeal rotation into a winning one, they deserve a Nobel Prize.
I think Roger has done just as good, if not a better job than Leo did. Leo has to be one of the most overrated coaches in sports history. He had 3 1st ballot HoFers in his rotation year in and year out.
I will give him credit though. He turned some journeymen pitchers into pretty good ones (Denny Neagle, Russ Ortiz, etc). But, having said that, I think that anyone pitching in that rotation with the 3 anchors will put up better numbers…maybe those career years were more a product of their environment (and maybe even Bobby, since several offensive players revived their careers in Atl too) than Leo’s coaching.
And to be fair, if we want to credit Leo with reviving those careers and making lemonade from lemons, we should give McDowell credit for the progress that Kenshin Kawakami has shown, the explosion of Javier Vazquez (who, with better run support would be a Cy Young contender) and the dominance of Peter Moylan.
"Actually, Justin was right."
by bigjoe on May 15, 2009 9:04 AM PDT
by justincredubil02 on Sep 22, 2009 5:37 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
not to mention a criticism of Leo: he wasn’t very good in handling young pitchers. And its safe to say with Hanson, JJ, Medlen, and the others in the pipeline, Roger will be very important to this organization.
"Matt Diaz is a baseball player."-Joe Simpson
by 10-4 on Sep 22, 2009 7:06 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Leo did turn Bedard into a near Cy young talent, just injury prone
by McCann's the Man on Sep 22, 2009 9:41 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Roger McDowell is not a bad pitching coach. I do not blame him for the starting pitching disaster that was 2008. Your points about Roger’s ability to work with young pitchers is valid, that is why Roger should be sent to AAA or AA, developing pitchers for the big league club. The point I was getting at (I didn’t really finish it) is that Bobby needs some coaches who can disagree with him. I think Roger agrees to put whatever pitcher Bobby wants in the game, whether it is Peter Moylan for the 967th time this year (all good appearances but he is being overworked) or Manny Acosta when the game is on the line. From what I have read, Leo had no problems disagreeing with Bobby. Leo might say something like “Bobby, leave Hanson in there to at least try to finish off the Astros.”
by Mr. Glavine #47 on Sep 23, 2009 2:54 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Well then, that is a completely different point. I agree with this completely. It is NEVER good to have “Yes” men in any organization!
"Actually, Justin was right."
by bigjoe on May 15, 2009 9:04 AM PDT
by justincredubil02 on Sep 23, 2009 11:07 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Warren Spahn was great back in the day too, we should dump Lowe and bring back Spahn. And then get Murphy back to play center, because McLouth isn’t as good as he was too.
"Matt Diaz is a baseball player."-Joe Simpson
by 10-4 on Sep 22, 2009 7:11 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
It’s a similar direction to the one that existed under John Schuerholz, but one in which player loyalty is not valued over player performance as it usually was in the Schuerholz era (a new ideal that Cox may not share).
I don’t understand how this is an issue.
Mat Gamel is way too cool for double consonants.
by VivaLosBravos on Sep 22, 2009 5:48 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
No way we should have started this year with Francoeur in right, that was due to loyalty. We should never have entertained another Tom Glavine comeback, not last year, not this year. The John Smoltz situation was so hard because everyone, even Smoltz, expected the Braves to give him what he wanted to stay. There are other lesser examples (Pete Orr). The Braves have always showed a great deal of loyalty, even at the expense of a player’s performance on the field (which, when the player is not doing well, is an issue).
by gondeee on Sep 22, 2009 9:51 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think giving Francoeur a shot was the smart thing to do.
Not getting rid of him sooner when it didnt work out was the dumb part.
Don't fire Bobby.
by esadb on Sep 22, 2009 10:21 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Loyalty?
Uh, JS dumped players left and right when he felt it was the right move.
Maddux, Glavine, Justice, Grissom, Jordan, Gant, McGriff, Millwood, Avery, Klesko, Lopez, Galarraga, et cetera …
by Lennox on Sep 22, 2009 10:37 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
i will never forgive him for trading Klesko.
"Matt Diaz is a baseball player."-Joe Simpson
by 10-4 on Sep 23, 2009 8:38 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Give him hell, Frank.
You’re the reason we’re 10 games over .500 this year, not Bobby. I support Frank Wren.
Frank Wren for GM of the Year.
"Wait, bait and bash." - Jason Heyward's personal philosophy.
by mvhsbball on Sep 22, 2009 6:31 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Yep, Douchenozzle Wren is the reason that this team will, yet again, miss the playoffs and is on the hook for bad contracts over the next few years.
Give ’em hell, Frank!
by Lennox on Sep 22, 2009 10:38 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Really?
"...Braves tie! ...Braves tie! ...Braves tie!"
by The Keith Lockhart Era on Sep 22, 2009 11:25 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
oh dear.
I worry about Frank Wren bashers like this.
Do I need to make my page-long comment on why Frank Wren is one of the better GMs in baseball? I’ve already done it 2 or 3 times this season.
Frank Wren for GM of the Year.
"Wait, bait and bash." - Jason Heyward's personal philosophy.
by mvhsbball on Sep 23, 2009 12:14 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yes, please do, then I’ll go through it and explain why it’s as wrong as your claims that Nick Swisher hasn’t been a good hitter since the first month of the season (which you never bothered to respond to, btw).
by Lennox on Sep 23, 2009 1:23 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
What the hell are you talking about?
Nick Swisher??
Frank Wren for GM of the Year.
"Wait, bait and bash." - Jason Heyward's personal philosophy.
by mvhsbball on Sep 23, 2009 2:08 AM EDT via mobile up reply actions 0 recs
In the 9 over .500 Fanpost (http://www.talkingchop.com/2009/9/17/1034426/9-over-500#comments) responses you said:
“Nick Swisher hasn’t done shit since his 1st month, not to mention he’s helped by the joke that is the new Yankees Stadium. Dunn would’ve been perfect, but do you have $20 million to commit to him?
And do you really wanna go into your season with Eric Hinske, Gabe Kapler or Rocco Baldelli as your starting LF? I hope not.
Frank Wren for GM of the Year.
“Wait, bait and bash.” – Jason Heyward’s personal philosophy.
by mvhsbball on Sep 17, 2009 10:01 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs"
I responded with, you know, actual statistics, that show that he’s been much better than FUGA this season, and that he’s only had one full on bad month (May). And that his home/road splits clearly show that he is not being helped by Yankee stadium (and is, in fact, being hurt by playing there).
The fact that you go from agreeing that Dunn would be “perfect” to trashing him in your new defense or Wren is just an added bonus.
by Lennox on Sep 23, 2009 2:38 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
looking backward
Mazzone was awesome and patient and skilled yet ultimately
he had glavine maddox and smoltz,. hard to look bad. McDowell
has done nicely developing young guys and working with some
fine albeit less than stellar vets.
Folks are quick to forget the force behind the Braves’ ascent from
last to first a few years back. In my opinion it was TP who taught the
Braves how to win. Time and again he took a leadership role.
Was he meant to be a batting coach?: puleeze. He hit 230somethin
before JS signed him. be cautious in judging a great source
of winning, of fundamental baseball, of a guy who is truthfully ‘out of
position’ yet has the intangibles of a winner, our next manager.
by sealift67 on Sep 22, 2009 8:56 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
is this supposed to be a poem?
"Matt Diaz is a baseball player."-Joe Simpson
by 10-4 on Sep 22, 2009 9:25 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
TP did have a career grit of 435 – 2nd only to David Eckstein in MLB history.
"Actually, Justin was right."
by bigjoe on May 15, 2009 9:04 AM PDT
by justincredubil02 on Sep 22, 2009 9:45 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
regardless of what happens
this: 
is the most kickass badass Bobby picture you will ever find
You are *almost*
as amazing as Matt Diaz..
by Titansfan9 on Sep 1, 2009 8:01 PM PDT
(Yunel is still the Queen of Hearts)
by GoBravesNY on Sep 22, 2009 10:41 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Getting rid of Bobby while keeping Wren would only solve half of the problem.
by Lennox on Sep 22, 2009 11:02 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
fail. Wren has been outstandingly incredible this year
You are *almost*
as amazing as Matt Diaz..
by Titansfan9 on Sep 1, 2009 8:01 PM PDT
(Yunel is still the Queen of Hearts)
by GoBravesNY on Sep 22, 2009 11:05 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
No GM who let his team spend months fielding a starting OF that was among the worst in the game (3 hitters who were all but sure outs in the lineup) can be considered to have been “outstandingly incredible”.
by Lennox on Sep 22, 2009 11:50 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
So you mean to tell me that
You’d have rather throw money at some LF than getting pitching?? Wren has been superb.
You are *almost*
as amazing as Matt Diaz..
by Titansfan9 on Sep 1, 2009 8:01 PM PDT
(Yunel is still the Queen of Hearts)
by GoBravesNY on Sep 23, 2009 12:14 AM EDT via mobile up reply actions 0 recs
Oh god, I feel like typing something. This is to Lennox:
Okay, yeah, lets get a stud FA OF! Lets spend lots of money on Pat Burrell and his 6HRs this year! Or Raul Ibanez who had 1/3 of a fluke season and still can’t stay healthy! Or hell, lets sign Adam Dunn to have the worst defensive LF in baseball who’ll strike out 200 times! Lets do that!
Oh, and Frank got Nate McLouth for essentially for nobody. He got rid of Jeff Francoeur, one of the worst baseball players in the entire league… and he still got something in return. He signed GA, who has been perfectly decent for us this season in the roll of a bridge-player until Heyward is ready in 2010. And how was Frank supposed to know Jordan Schafer was going to hurt his wrist and need surgery? Who the fuck was he supposed to run out there in CF? Gregor Blanco? That would’ve been a nightmare.
Phew.
I’m thinking I wanna change my sig to: “I ♥ Frank Wren bashers!” What do you think?
Frank Wren for GM of the Year.
"Wait, bait and bash." - Jason Heyward's personal philosophy.
by mvhsbball on Sep 23, 2009 12:25 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
, yeah, lets get a stud FA OF! Lets spend lots of money on Pat Burrell and his 6HRs this year! Or Raul Ibanez who had 1/3 of a fluke season and still can’t stay healthy! Or hell, lets sign Adam Dunn to have the worst defensive LF in baseball who’ll strike out 200 times! Lets do that![/quote]
Yeah, it’s much better to have a bad defensive outfielder who can’t hit right in the middle of your lineup rather than a bad defensive OFer who is one of the most consistent HR and OBP machines in the game. Also, LOL at bringing up Dunn’s strikeouts.
The players who were most mentioned as options for LF before the season were Dunn, Swisher, and Abreu. All are playing much better than FUGA this season.
, and Frank got Nate McLouth for essentially for nobody. [/quote]
If by “nobody” you mean a couple of our top quality trade chips that we could actually afford to part with. It was a fair trade, too bad it came too late to provide the boost that the team needed.
got rid of Jeff Francoeur, one of the worst baseball players in the entire league… and he still got something in return.[/quote]He got rid of Francoeur after he’d been hurting the team for months with his poor player after having one of the worst seasons in the game the previous year. The fact that Wren allowed such a poor player to continue on as part of the team for so long isn’t something that should be seen as a good thing.
Getting Church was solid, though as I understand it the Mets were the ones who called him up with the offer, so the deal basically just fell into his lap.
signed GA, who has been perfectly decent for us this season [/quote]No he hasn’t, at all. He’s had 4 bad-to-awful months one great month, and one above average month.
the fuck was he supposed to run out there in CF? Gregor Blanco? That would’ve been a nightmare.[/quote[So you’re using Frank Wren’s inability to add a quality backup CFer as a defense of Frank Wren … Interesting strategy.
thinking I wanna change my sig to: "I ♥ Frank Wren bashers!" What do you think?[/qutoe]Go for it, it can’t be more absurd than supporting him for GM of the year.
by Lennox on Sep 23, 2009 1:58 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Apologies for the poor formatting of the previous post.
by Lennox on Sep 23, 2009 2:00 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Oh dear.
Frank Wren for GM of the Year.
"Wait, bait and bash." - Jason Heyward's personal philosophy.
by mvhsbball on Sep 23, 2009 2:09 AM EDT via mobile up reply actions 0 recs
Well then Mr Lennex
What would you’ve done last offseason?
Frank Wren for GM of the Year.
"Wait, bait and bash." - Jason Heyward's personal philosophy.
by mvhsbball on Sep 23, 2009 2:12 AM EDT via mobile up reply actions 0 recs
There’s obviously an unfair advantage when you’re dealing with hindsight, so I’m not going to go in to the things that make sense in retrospect at the moment.
The major thing is that, at the time I strongly would have favored signing Dunn over Kawakami, Glavine, and FUGA and letting the AAA pitchers fight it out for the last two rotation spots in ST.
by Lennox on Sep 23, 2009 3:15 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I would have prefered the pitching in this situation 10 out of 10 times.
You rant against Wren for bad contracts, then support the idea of getting Burrel, Swisher or Dunn – all of whom would have contracts that hinder the team.
You also berate Wren for the moves he made (or didn’t make) but then you say that you can’t offer reasonable alternatives due to “hind sight”.
You need to give 1 plausible reason why Wren is a bad GM. If you can find 1, I will be impressed.
"Actually, Justin was right."
by bigjoe on May 15, 2009 9:04 AM PDT
by justincredubil02 on Sep 23, 2009 11:13 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
You’d honestly rather have Kawakami as a bottom of the rotation starter (now long reliever) than have Adam Dunn posting a .960+ OPS in the middle of our lineup every game in the place of FUGA and his .719 OPS? Now, usually I’d favor pitching first, but how many great starts from JJ and Javy did we waste this year because our offense was crap?
We had a pretty bad offense last year, and little was done to improve it, other than pinning our hopes on Frenchy suddenly turning in to a cleanup hitter.
As for Dunn’s contract, he is only 29 and makes 10 MM a year over two seasons, he can be moved to 1B. A nice controlled investment given his consistent offensive production. He could have been the perfect bridge to both Heyward and Freeman with his contract coming off the books just as Jair moves into arbitration. Wren was offering an even bigger deal to Furcal of all people before that whole thing went down the way it did.
Swisher is 28 and his contract is pretty reasonable considering how he is producing this year, so I don’t know why you consider it bad.
Lowe is 36, he might be worth his $15 MM this year, but is he going to be worth his $15 MM in 2012 at age 39? Kawakami is 34, again, money tied up in a player on the way out of his prime. There is good reason to be concerned that they’ll decline over the next few years. We aren’t the Yankees, we can’t afford to just offer those extra years to bring a player in and then just eat their salary if they go in to decline.
Now, to Wren’s credit, he’s made some good trades (he seems to be quite adept there), but his free agency dealings, IMO, leave quite a bit to be desired. I, quite honestly, also hate the way he has dealt with the press and feel that he showed a general lack of class in his approach to the Smoltz and Glavine situations in the media, regardless of whether he actually made the right baseball move or not..
by Lennox on Sep 23, 2009 1:48 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yes. I would rather have a really good pitcher than 1 extra bat. Adam Dunn would not have made a difference on this team, IMO. Our offense was more than 1 more player from being potent. We have had several things go wrong this season on the offensive side that 1 more bat would not have fixed – Chipper’s slump, McCann’s disappearance during the middle of the season, KJ’s slump, Jordan’s injury, Francoeur’s failings – all of which prevented this team from having a good offense.
Pitching is the key, always has been the key and always will be the key.
Our offense is mediocre, but we still have a (slim) shot at the playoffs – thanks to our pitching.
"My team of nine guys who hit like Albert Pujols and never ever bunt just beat your team with one Shane Victorino 472 to 3."
by justincredubil02 on Sep 23, 2009 2:12 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
It’s not a zero sum game. Wren added THREE big money pitchers, investing $100 MM over the next few years in them (he also wasted money on Tom Glavine for some reason). Instead of spending all that money on pitching you sign one fewer pitcher (consider that one of our starters is currently being wasted pitching out of the bullpen) and add the hitting that the team so obviously needed.
by Lennox on Sep 23, 2009 1:32 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
one starter is being “wasted” because Hudson was a wild card. Nobody knew how he would bounce back. It isn’t like we have had 6 dominating pitchers for the whole season.
"Actually, Justin was right."
by bigjoe on May 15, 2009 9:04 AM PDT
by justincredubil02 on Sep 23, 2009 11:14 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
What the hell is wrong with Wren?
Didn’t folks of this opinion disperse for the most part several months ago?
"...Braves tie! ...Braves tie! ...Braves tie!"
by The Keith Lockhart Era on Sep 22, 2009 11:26 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
i thought so
but i guess they’re coming back…slowly.
Frank Wren for GM of the Year.
"Wait, bait and bash." - Jason Heyward's personal philosophy.
by mvhsbball on Sep 23, 2009 12:27 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Guess so
The same folks bitching about Lowe’s $60 million contract are the same folks that would be doing so anyway if we hadn’t raised our offer from $48 mil and Lowe was a Met.
"...Braves tie! ...Braves tie! ...Braves tie!"
by The Keith Lockhart Era on Sep 23, 2009 4:45 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Granted, $60 million pitchers shouldn't have 4.50 eras
But he’s still better than alot of the slop that got slung out to the mound last year.
"...Braves tie! ...Braves tie! ...Braves tie!"
by The Keith Lockhart Era on Sep 23, 2009 4:46 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
THIS
is exactly what im talkin about!
I agree that DLowe has been a little overpaid this season, but what other options did we have? The best pitcher on the market besides DLowe after Burnett and $abathia signed was Jon Garland. That would’ve been a nightmare.
Frank Wren for GM of the Year.
"Wait, bait and bash." - Jason Heyward's personal philosophy.
by mvhsbball on Sep 23, 2009 7:34 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Boo
If they shitcan Bobby on the cusp of what could be a last-hurrah kind of season I for one am not gonna go around clapping my hands and saying “Well it was time anyway.”
"Yeah we came up short today but I'm cool with things." -- Juan Pablo Montoya
by capital L on Sep 22, 2009 11:38 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
One more year
While I agree that Booby has holes in his managing like too much loyalty to struggling players and certain bullpen arms. I think he should get one more year with Heyward and a free agent LF to boost the offense and some depth to the bullpen, and see if he can pull out one more magical season.
by JFP on Sep 23, 2009 12:28 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think Wren did a good job @ picking up some good players,
but also probably caused us from not being in playoff contention, by allowing 3 auto outs in Jordan, Frenchy and KJ, to remain in the everyday line up Way too long….just saying..imo
Also, I’m not completely sold on Lowe and Chipper’s contracts, only time will tell if those were good moves.
As far as a replacement for Bobby, I like Freddie Gonzales or Manny Acta…..
Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter, and those who matter don't mind.
by HEYJUDE on Sep 23, 2009 12:16 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
this is how I feel about the DLowe contract:
What was Frank Wren supposed to do at the time? He had $60MM to spend and he hadn’t done anything after a month and a half. $abathia and Burnett had just signed with the Yankees. He had pretty much vowed to create an all new pitching staff for the Braves…and nothing had gone his way yet. DLowe was the only top-of-the-rotation guy left on the market and Wren wanted to make sure he got his man. People would’ve been calling for his head if he didn’t get DLowe. Did we overpay for him? Probably. But I feel like it was our only choice at the time.
Frank Wren for GM of the Year.
"Wait, bait and bash." - Jason Heyward's personal philosophy.
by mvhsbball on Sep 23, 2009 12:33 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Agreed, I thought it was a good move at the time. It is still not a stupid move and likely never will be. I do not think that Derek Lowe will ever suck for the amount of money that Mike Hampton or Barry Zito have sucked for in their careers. I guarantee that the majority of Braves fans applauded Wren’s signing of Lowe. Although he does not deserve complete credit for all of them, Lowe has 15 wins this season.
by Mr. Glavine #47 on Sep 23, 2009 3:04 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
i still think
Lowe and Chipper should give money back towards next years payroll because neither has lived up to what they need to be . If they have the year next year we hope they do then give it back . I’d like to see Chipper do like he did few years ago and add a year to his contract to lessen the payroll next year if he wants to see this team get better . Lowe personally send him to Milwaukee or Boston or even New York .
by ~~banditwolf~~ on Sep 23, 2009 12:26 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Since Chipper might retire if he plays badly next year and if he plays well he will be worth the money, I think Chipper’s contract is acceptable for now.
by Mr. Glavine #47 on Sep 23, 2009 2:59 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Agreed.
"...Braves tie! ...Braves tie! ...Braves tie!"
by The Keith Lockhart Era on Sep 25, 2009 1:17 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Comments For This Post Are Closed
Secondary Sidebar
FanPosts
Community blog posts and discussion.
Certain photos copyright © 2009 by Associated Press or Getty Images. Any commercial use or distribution without the express written consent of Associated Press and Getty Images is strictly prohibited.
