O'Brien on the Tex Trade.
With some FireJoeMorgan.com spice to it:
New Criterion For Being Good At Baseball: YOU MUST IMPRESS DAVID O'BRIEN
---Snap-billed mreetwass
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
The snap-billed mreetwass is a legendary creature with the body of a unicorn, the tail of a griffin, the face of a Korean person, and the wings of a leprechaun (if a leprechaun had wings). The mreetwass feeds on DVDs of the Larry Sanders Show and reproduces once a year, always on Cinco de Mayo. The mreetwass is notable for only being identifiable by one Mr. David O'Brien of Atlanta, Georgia. Mr. O'Brien is the world's foremost and only authority on mreetwasses and Mreetwassery (the study of mreetwasses); all inquiries should be directed to him.
Wikipedia entry created by awesomeobrieninternet69 at 02:30, 21 July 2008.
---
Now imagine that same bullshit, but in place of the word "mreetwass" insert the words "impact offensive player." You pretty much have the premise of David O'Brien's piece on trading Mark Teixeira.
Is Teixeira, with his Gold Glove-level defense and likely .290-30-120 to .310-45-130 offensive range for many years to come, worth $20 mill a season? I’d say only to a team that has a huge payroll, at least $150 mill or so. Not to a team with a $100 mill payroll, because while he piles up stats, he’s not a player, at least from what I’ve seen, who puts a team on his back and delivers big hits when the team needs it most.
The mreetwass, you see, doesn't settle for hitting 35 home runs or 125 RBI. He concentrates on leading the league in Distance Carried (Team on Back Division) and Hits (Bigtime Department). He wins David O'Brien over.
All Teixeira has done is put up OPS+ years of 150, 126, 144, and 131 the last four years, along with the aforementioned stellar defense. He does "pile up stats" because he's very good at baseball, and baseball people who watch baseball games record stats to show how good or bad someone is at baseball. That said, he will probably be overpaid. Some non-mreetwassian reasons for this:
1) He has a career home/away OPS split of .955/.859, so some team paying for his fat home run totals and ostentatious slugging percentages may be being a little misled by the Ballpark at Arlington.
2) He plays first base, where you can usually find some decent hitting, and decent power hitting at that.
3) The first base thing means his defense, which is very good, is perhaps not all that valuable.
4) He will get something like 7 years, $140 million, and he's not quite on that super-elite near-1.000 OPS-hitting level of guys like Pujols or A-Rod or (pre-2008) Miguel Cabrera.
5) He'll be 29 next year, so in your megadeal for him you're going to be getting some 34- or 35-year-old Tex in there.
But I'm drifting from the point here, which is: what are David O'Brien's crazy reasons for pooh-poohing Teixeira?
Say, for instance, during the first six weeks of this season, when the Braves were dealing with a slew of injuries and Chipper Jones was carrying the offense with help from either Brian McCann or Yunel Escobar, but not much from Tex.
Stupid Tex -- didn't you know that all truly great players kick ass for the first six weeks of the season? That is prime time, baby. Real men mash in April.
Slow-starter or not (and he’s a slow-starter, every season), the Braves needed to count on him for power and RBIs, and didn’t get it on a regular basis until about two months into the season, when they were already back in the standings.
So if Teixeira swats 20 bombs post-All Star break in 2008, is he an asshole because he waited until his team was out of contention? I'm confused. I'm so used to the exact same argument being used against guys who peak too early. Hey, the 2007 Mets were 22-12 after six weeks. Was that the right time for them to play awesome?
Even yesterday, his two-homer, three-RBI game didn’t have much impact, seeing that both homers were solo shots, one early in the game when the Braves were already down 6-1, and the other, well, I’d have to look it up, it was so relatively meaningless near the end of an utter blowout loss.
Mreetwasses only homer when the game is within two runs either way. It's a switch they just turn on and off. Also, no solo shots: those are for dickheads.
Anywaym [sic], this isn’t to diminish his skills or output.
Not at all. You just called his last home run "relatively meaningless" and said he doesn't deliver "big hits when the team needs it most." How could he be offended?
He’s durable and piles up stats, year after year.
This is entering Blyleven territory. People, Jesus: stats are just records of things that happen in ballgames. You only "pile up stats" because you do good things, over and over again, game after game, year after year. Ergo: you are good.
But I know an impact offensive player, a player whose performance seems bigger than his numbers because he gets so many key hits. And I know the opposite.
And there we have David O'Brien's definition of the mythical mreetwass: it's someone who impresses David O'Brien. Someone who "seems" good. Someone who has the goddamn courtesy to get "key" "big" hits when David O'Brien is watching TBS and not when David O'Brien is in the kitchen for a second to pour David O'Brien a bowl of Smart Start for David O'Brien to eat.
Of course, there's also the opposite of the mreetwass, the shünkrogle. I wonder who might be one of those...
A-Rod, for instance. Dude piles up huge numbers, year after year. Tremendous numbers.
He must be terrible!
But let me ask you, how many SportsCenter highlights can you remember this year of A-Rod late-game homers or walk-off hits? Maybe a couple or few early on, but lately?
The shünkrogle, as we all know, is miserable in the all-important statistical category of SCHYCRL-GHW-OH,L (SportsCenter Highlights You Can Remember of Late-Game Homers or Walk-Off Hits, Lately). This trumps his OPS+ (159) and his EqA (.334) and his VORP (39.6).
The greatest thing about SCHYCRL-GHW-OH,L is that it's different for everybody. It could be 3. It could be 0. It could be 49.5. It's what you remember, and you can't be wrong about that. Finally, a stat that the fan can participate in. "What's your SCHYCRL-GHW-OH,L?" should be ESPN's new slogan for the big show.
A-Rod’s the highest paid player in the game, and many will tell you he’s the best player in the game. But he’s not the player I would build a team around if I could have any player. No way.
Mine neither, probably, at least not if we're talking about a team for both now and the future and not just this year. He's too old for that. But for this season, and this season alone, I'm not sure you can do too much better than A-Rod. Pujols? Utley? Berkman? Hanley? Chipper? Sizemore? Wright? It's a short, short list.
But you know, you just have to listen to the guy who literally wrote the Wikipedia article on mreetwasses (and probably shünkrogles, I have to check), David O'Brien. And he says, emphatically: NO WAY.
I have to hand it to David O'Brien. He's basically solved baseball analysis. Come up with a fake term ("impact offensive player"), fake-define it with subjective, self-referential, fake parameters ("from what I've seen...big hits when the team needs it," "performance seems bigger than his numbers," "key hits," "I know an impact offensive player"), and presto, you're Earth's premier expert on that fake term -- no amount of actual baseball information can ever change that. It's like creating your own Planet Baseball with the absolute data isolation of a short-lived Wikipedia page, and then ruling the shit out of that planet. You know what? Congratulations, David O'Brien. You have to respect that.
This FanPost does not express the views or opinions of Talking Chop.
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But the real kudos go to Junior over at FireJoeMorgan.com for writing it!
I guess I should be one to talk.
There's nights that I can't even walk.
There's days I couldn't give a fuck.
And in between is where I'm stuck.
by Smoltz's Beard on Jul 22, 2008 9:58 AM EDT up reply actions
Same ole sh*t
DOB has always been like this, I’m suprised his arrogant ass didn’t say he should be hitting clean up and playing first for the Braves.
THANK YOU Junior, from FireJoeMorgan.com!
oh snap
gondeee reneged on his putting this post up on the front page.
No wonder nobody likes you, Tuttle... everything's a (Pujols) damn debate.
Way to plagiarize ‘beard.
"Have you ever had your heart broken?"
"Yeah, when we lost the pennant in '87."
You guys all suck balls. I said it was from FJM in the first place, anyways.
I guess I should be one to talk.
There's nights that I can't even walk.
There's days I couldn't give a fuck.
And in between is where I'm stuck.
by Smoltz's Beard on Jul 22, 2008 12:16 PM EDT up reply actions
Yes sir…

I guess I should be one to talk.
There's nights that I can't even walk.
There's days I couldn't give a fuck.
And in between is where I'm stuck.
by Smoltz's Beard on Jul 22, 2008 12:29 PM EDT up reply actions
In fine print
...at the top. nobody reads that shit. I would have just posted the link, rather than copying and pasting, as it implies authorship. you thieving bastard.
"Have you ever had your heart broken?"
"Yeah, when we lost the pennant in '87."
Fine. Fine. I thought it was funny, but I won’t post anything like that anymore!
I guess I should be one to talk.
There's nights that I can't even walk.
There's days I couldn't give a fuck.
And in between is where I'm stuck.
by Smoltz's Beard on Jul 22, 2008 12:29 PM EDT up reply actions
Teixeira's career numbers
Overall: .285/.372/.535
Bases Empty: .275/.345/.502
Men on: .297/.400/.572
RISP: .321/.443/.621
So with the Bases empty Teix is good ball player. When people are on base, he’s Fred McGriff and if any of those runners are in scoring position, he’s Albert Pujols.
He’s still a jerkface because he hits too many solo homeruns.
I guess I should be one to talk.
There's nights that I can't even walk.
There's days I couldn't give a fuck.
And in between is where I'm stuck.
by Smoltz's Beard on Jul 22, 2008 12:52 PM EDT up reply actions
Dave O'Brien on Tex
I get (and often agree) with stat head types. The idea is that stats how good someone really is, as opposed to perception. Stat head types rightly defend A-Rod from the guys who think that Scott Brosius was better because the Yanks won championships when Brosius played 3rd.
That said, some stat heads believe that there are no intangibles, no clutch play, etc. Tex’s numbers look really good. The Braves as a team lead baseball in one run losses. My eyes have seen Tex strikeout or fail to move the runners over during the games. A lot. During the recent game in which he hit two solo homeruns ( a good thing) he failed when runners were on.
With Tex the Braves are 6 back. Without him, they’d probably be 10 back.
Good point about Brosius…I think we can all agree that most New Yorkers (or any big market city) don’t have the slightest clue about how baseball actually works. You really don’t need to look any further than Hank Steinbrenner. He pretty much demanded that Joba become a starter and put him in the role without any sort of strength and conditioning done in the minors to stretch out his workload (retarded). And what has happened since? He’s pitched well, the Yankees have gone 6-3 in his 9 starts, but he has yet to get passed the 7th inning and has not gotten through the 5th inning in 4 of those starts with 14 ERs in 47.2 IP. When he was in the bullpen they were 15-5 and he gave up 6 ERs in 22.5 IP. Has it made that much of a difference? Hard to say, but I would lean towards not really. Do you think the average New Yorker, or even Streinbrenner, would notice this? Of course not. But they cheer louder than anyone else, so they must know what they’re talking about.
As far as the whole “clutch hitting” arguement, I’m not going down that road again. And I feel like there have been plenty of situations where Tex has failed with RISP but the stats (there’s that word again!) prove otherwise. He’s got a .902 OPS with RISP, .945 OPS with runners on, 1.357 OPS with runners on 2nd and 3rd, and 1.138 OPS with the bases loaded. He must be doing his damage in blowout wins/losses though, because people are still saying that he isn’t “clutch”...that he isn’t coming through “when the game counts”...is that even really his fault? More times than not he’s proven that he will come through with a hit…whether or not it comes at the right time is not up to him, but of the 8 other men in the lineup and the long line of starters and relievers.
*Didn’t mean any of this negatively towards you, neikromurphy…just kinda went on a tangent there…
I guess I should be one to talk.
There's nights that I can't even walk.
There's days I couldn't give a fuck.
And in between is where I'm stuck.
by Smoltz's Beard on Jul 22, 2008 3:11 PM EDT up reply actions
I will point out sir that there is a good chance that the Yanks are going to have a good record in games in which Joba pitches in relief because he is probably going to get the ball in situations where they already have the lead and the only thing left to rely on there are the bullpen arms. If he is starting and pitching well he still has to rely on the offense to outscore the opposition and the bullpen to maintain whatever lead might or might not be handed to the,.
Also I agree with you (and sadly DOB) about Tex appears to get a lot of meaningless hits. But I haven’t seen a lot of games personally this season (or recently especially) so I can’t speak to that very well
Also I owe you one for pointing me to firejoemorgan.com. That guy cracks me up.
True, I guess my point was mostly to show that Steinbrenner demanded Joba be moved from a position where he was excelling into the bigger spotlight as a starter. Has the move made any real improvement towards the team’s play? Probably not…but Steinbrenner and other New Yorkers would like to think so.
Glad you enjoy the website…I count on those guys for my morning chuckle!
I guess I should be one to talk.
There's nights that I can't even walk.
There's days I couldn't give a fuck.
And in between is where I'm stuck.
by Smoltz's Beard on Jul 23, 2008 10:21 AM EDT up reply actions
if i remember correctly, tex DID carry us down the stretch last year. but its hard to carry a team FULL of corpses as opposed to a team with a couple corpses.
54 games – 208 ABs, 38 R, 66 H, 27 XBH, 56 RBI, 27/45 BB/K, .317/.404/.615
I guess I should be one to talk.
There's nights that I can't even walk.
There's days I couldn't give a fuck.
And in between is where I'm stuck.
by Smoltz's Beard on Jul 22, 2008 3:27 PM EDT up reply actions
No offense taken. Let me be clear…I think that Tex is a good ballplayer. Good with the bat, good with the glove. I don’t think he’s worth 200 million over 10 years to the Braves.
Tex didn’t choose to start slowly, but he did. Several of those one run games we lost were in the 1st two months. Those games count (standing wise) as much as games in August and September. He is mashing as of late. His recent numbers are very good. Had he put up similar numbers early in the season, the Braves would probably have been in striking distance. He didn’t and the Braves have a lopsised record in one run losses. Maybe someone could run his numbers to see how he has performed in the Braves one run losses.
BR doesn’t go that in depth, but I do!
18-78, 10 R, 7 2B, 2 HR, 8 RBI, 13 BB, 13 K, 3 GIDP
I went line by line so it’s possible I may have missed a couple, but those should be his stats from all our 1-run losses…20 of them I believe. Terrible numbers indeed, but I bet that there aren’t many people in our lineup other than Chipper and possibly McCann who will post a better line.
I guess I should be one to talk.
There's nights that I can't even walk.
There's days I couldn't give a fuck.
And in between is where I'm stuck.
by Smoltz's Beard on Jul 22, 2008 3:43 PM EDT up reply actions
Thanks for doing the stats Beard. I’m sure most of the team has been lousy in the one run losses. Tex is the only one looking for the big payday next year.
True...
...and I suppose that is why he gets picked on.
I guess I should be one to talk.
There's nights that I can't even walk.
There's days I couldn't give a fuck.
And in between is where I'm stuck.
by Smoltz's Beard on Jul 22, 2008 3:54 PM EDT up reply actions
Teix clutch stats
Baseball Reference has these in its splits. These are for the game situation when he comes to the plate, not the final game score.
Overall Career line for reference: .285/.372/.535
2008 Teix:
2 outs, RISP .245/.448/.449
Late & Close .360/.492/.700
Tie Game .240/.339/.413
Within 1 R .290/.401/.478
Within 2 R .280/.395/.461
“Late & Close are PA in the 7th or later with the batting team tied, ahead by one, or the tying run at least on deck.”
He’s been bad in Tie Games but he’s pretty awesome in Late & Close and the rest are good. Gets walked a lot in 2 out, RISP. I wouldn’t call him unclutch.
Teix Career:
2 outs, RISP .290/.424/.642
Late & Close .276/.376/.539
Tie Game .279/.375/.521
Within 1 R .274/.373/.508
Within 2 R .280/.376/.517
So for his career he’s basically around what he is and really awesome with 2 outs, RISP.
In my opinion, clutch stats are highly overrated. The large, large majority of players will have clutch lines very similar to their career lines.
Players labeled as unclutch are typically victims of small sample size with some bad luck. If anything, players should do worse in clutch situations because then you’re facing Mariano Rivera instead of Chris Resop.
Nice. I think it’s fairly obvious that the media/fans are the people who label the players as “clutch” or not, and it’s also fairly obvious that the majority of them do little to no research to back up their claims. I’m almost positive that if you asked a group of random NYers who they consider a clutch player and they would bring up a guy like Aaron Boone, despite the fact he went 9-53 in his career in the postseason…but he did hit that one clutch homerun!
I guess I should be one to talk.
There's nights that I can't even walk.
There's days I couldn't give a fuck.
And in between is where I'm stuck.
by Smoltz's Beard on Jul 22, 2008 4:49 PM EDT up reply actions

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