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Around SBN: The Reemergence of Barry Bonds

Who Creates the Braves' Runs? A Graphical Breakdown

For this post, I used a statistic called Weighted Runs Created (wRC). I explain it in more detail below, but for now just know that each wRC value is equal to that many runs.

In the graph, the Braves' wRC is broken down by position (and by player within each position). The area of each section is proportional with the wRC at that position. A bigger area = more runs created. The dark outlines represent the MLB averages for each position.

Braves-wrc-graph_medium

Click the image for a bigger version.

On the season (this does not include yesterday's game), the Braves' offense has been 30 runs worse than the average offense. To make this a fair comparison, it only counts position players, not pitchers or designated hitters. Over 67 games, that's 0.45 fewer runs per game. The Braves have been above average at only 3 positions: catcher, left field, and (barely) third base.

Position-by-position analysis and an explanation of wRC after the jump.

Star-divide

Catcher (+16 wRC compared to an average team)

Brian McCann and David Ross, unsurprisingly, have been worth much more than the average team's catchers: 46 wRC compared to an average of 30 (more than 50% better). That's the best mark in the NL, and 2nd-best in MLB behind the Tigers (whose Victor Martinez has spent a lot of time at DH).

Left Field (+11 wRC)

In left field, Martin Prado and Eric Hinske have done a good job (52 wRC, which is 11 runs above average). Both of them have seen a good deal of time at other positions, though, so you might want to spread a few of those runs around to 3B, RF, and 1B. Clearly, though, left field has been one of the team's few bright spots.

Third Base (+1 wRC)

Chipper Jones has been slightly better than average at third base, putting up 34 wRC, 1 more than the average team's 3B. This does not count the contributions of Prado and others on Chipper's rest days, so the figure should perhaps be even higher.

Shortstop (-4 wRC)

The Braves' shortstops have been nearly equal to the average team's shortstops (28 wRC vs. 32 for an average team), and given Alex Gonzalez's stellar defense, I'm sure most Braves fans will take that.

Center Field (-9 wRC)

The Braves have also gotten below-average performance in center field, where Nate McLouth and Jordan Schafer have both underwhelmed, totaling 28 wRC at a position that averages 37.

First Base (-10 wRC)

At first base, the problem is not so much that Freddie Freeman has been bad (he hasn't) as that the offensive standard is extremely high at that position. Freddie's 32 wRC is 4th-best on the team, but that says more about the team's offensive struggles than about Freeman's successes. Even if you add a few runs for the other players who have filled in at first in Freddie's absence, the Braves are still clearly below-average at this position.

Second Base (-13 wRC)

The Braves' worst production has been at second base, where the bar is much lower than at first base. Still, their 22 runs at that position is 13 runs lower than the average team. If Dan Uggla is really starting to get back into form, we should expect this position to be a strength rather than a weakness for the rest of the season.

Right Field (-19 wRC)

In right field, a combination of injury (to Jason Heyward) and ineffectiveness (of everyone else) has led to a poor production of 26 runs, which is 19 runs below average for that position. Right field has been the best offensive position in MLB so far (average of 45 wRC, edging out 1B), but the Braves have gotten their second-lowest production from that spot.

More About wRC

The statistic wRC summarizes a player's total offensive contributions in one run value. The "weighted" part of the name means that different events count for different fractions of a run, so a double counts for more than a single (not twice as much, though). Each event's value is determined by historical averages for that event, adjusted to today's environment. So a single today counts more than a single 10 years ago, because the average number of runs scored is less today than it was in the go-go early 2000's.

The total number of wRC in the league is scaled to the total number of runs scored, and each team's overall wRC value tends to track very closely with its total runs scored. Thus, you can use wRC to easily portion out the credit for a team's run-scoring, as I did in the graphic. Since the Braves had scored 261 runs (before yesterday's game) and Alex Gonzalez had a 27 wRC, you can give him credit for a bit more than 10% of the Braves' offense.

You can read the FanGraphs primer on wRC here. The formula for calculating wRC is in this post.

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So it’s left field and catcher coming through for us, eh?

Ryan's the name, Call of Duty and Braves baseball's the game.
Twitter: @RyanMarby

by ChopMaster on Jun 15, 2011 1:51 PM EDT reply actions  

Wow. Very cool graphic

Great work, JunkStats!

"It wasn’t that it was slippery or anything like that. It was just, dadgum, my hands and the balls were so wet..." - Tim Hudson

by KoKo the Monkey (T-Bone) on Jun 15, 2011 1:52 PM EDT reply actions  

Wonderful post! When Heyward comes back, we should get to about -5 wRC.

Ryan's the name, Call of Duty and Braves baseball's the game.
Twitter: @RyanMarby

by ChopMaster on Jun 15, 2011 1:53 PM EDT reply actions  

Good stuff.

"If you go out to a bar, pick up a chick, take her home, but can't close the deal, we used to call that "Calling Dan Kolb in for relief."-Talking Head

by SCrebel10 on Jun 15, 2011 1:54 PM EDT reply actions  

I’m surprised first base didn’t edge out right field. The likes of Joey Votto, Ryan Howard, Prince Fielder, and Albert Pujols could overtake the likes of Jay Bruce, Dominic Brown(?), Lance Berkman, and I don’t know the right field for Milwaukee.

Ryan's the name, Call of Duty and Braves baseball's the game.
Twitter: @RyanMarby

by ChopMaster on Jun 15, 2011 1:55 PM EDT reply actions  

Two words: Jose Bautista

Without him, 1B would be ahead of RF.

"Yeah, and I have an enchanted jock strap." -- Karl Karlson
I now twitter as @junkstats and blog about made-up stats and general baseball stuff at JunkStats.

by Jacob Peterson on Jun 15, 2011 1:57 PM EDT up reply actions  

I have 2 challenges for you: Find out what percentage of wRC by right fielders in the AL, and then MLB total, is made by Jose Bautista.

Ryan's the name, Call of Duty and Braves baseball's the game.
Twitter: @RyanMarby

by ChopMaster on Jun 15, 2011 1:59 PM EDT up reply actions  

His 68.1 wRC

are about 5% of all the right-fielders’ wRC.

"Yeah, and I have an enchanted jock strap." -- Karl Karlson
I now twitter as @junkstats and blog about made-up stats and general baseball stuff at JunkStats.

by Jacob Peterson on Jun 15, 2011 2:04 PM EDT up reply actions  

Sweet Jesus.

Joey Bats alone outdoes our entire RF and CF combined, by 14 runs.

Our crappy lucky team *WAS* better than your good unlucky team.

by Richard R on Jun 15, 2011 2:24 PM EDT up reply actions  

I've been working in Excel the last few days so, formula time!

’Braves’RF+’Braves’CF+1/2’Braves’SS=’JoseBautista’+0.1.

Our crappy lucky team *WAS* better than your good unlucky team.

by Richard R on Jun 15, 2011 2:31 PM EDT up reply actions  

This is off-topic,

but every Braves fan should watch this gif. Especially if you hate Shane Victorino (which you do).

http://blogs.thescore.com/mlb/2011/06/15/exciting-day-baseball-gif/

"Yeah, and I have an enchanted jock strap." -- Karl Karlson
I now twitter as @junkstats and blog about made-up stats and general baseball stuff at JunkStats.

by Jacob Peterson on Jun 15, 2011 2:07 PM EDT reply actions   2 recs

Oh, that’s the best thing I’ve seen all week.

by Fatvirus on Jun 15, 2011 2:12 PM EDT up reply actions  

ill put it here....

for the lazy people….

the exponent in the equation is a matter of preference and "fit" it can vary depending on what the user believes to yield the curve that best predicts a team’s ability to win games.

by Ivan the Great on May 20, 2011 12:31 PM VET

by Bizarros on Jun 15, 2011 2:57 PM EDT up reply actions  

It's fine.

Dicks are used to getting hit by balls.

Screw the MCAT. F*** you, AAMC.

-Me

by frozendesert on Jun 15, 2011 3:12 PM EDT up reply actions  

Man, you could’ve dropped a C bomb or a T bomb and it would’ve been 5 times funnier.

by joshmaurer on Jun 15, 2011 3:13 PM EDT up reply actions  

I’ve been trying to be good for the man upstairs. I need his help tomorrow on the MCAT.

Screw the MCAT. F*** you, AAMC.

-Me

by frozendesert on Jun 15, 2011 3:18 PM EDT up reply actions  

Upstairs? You mean you have a homeless person living in your attic that will help you on a test?

Ryan's the name, Call of Duty and Braves baseball's the game.
Twitter: @RyanMarby

by ChopMaster on Jun 16, 2011 12:11 PM EDT up reply actions  

I like how he just takes it. Is Mrs. Victorino an angry drunk?

by GumpBrave on Jun 15, 2011 4:06 PM EDT up reply actions  

Happened to me in Jr High ball

Same year i took a bad hop to the teeth. Not a great year for me in 2001.

by 5InningsofChuckJames on Jun 15, 2011 5:30 PM EDT up reply actions  

Love that

"The first person I would like to thank is the good Lord, for giving me the ability to play the game of football. Because without the ability to play the game I would have been at Auburn." - Marty Lyons

by crimsonpride19 on Jun 15, 2011 2:58 PM EDT up reply actions  

So that’s why he wears the helmet with two earflaps…

by John Holton on Jun 15, 2011 3:56 PM EDT up reply actions  

Amazing graph

A pleasure for the eyes!

Except, you know, the numbers posted on it.

by frozendesert on Jun 15, 2011 2:20 PM EDT reply actions  

No doubt.

"Baseball is the only place in life where a sacrifice is really appreciated."

by Grantdawg on Jun 15, 2011 2:34 PM EDT up reply actions  

Great stuff as always.

As I mentioned earlier Heyward is back today so hopefully that RF wRC is on the up and up.

by GumpBrave on Jun 15, 2011 2:27 PM EDT reply actions  

Heyward is back?

Where did he go on his mystical magical journey?

by frozendesert on Jun 15, 2011 2:52 PM EDT up reply actions  

Dunno, but he is supposed to be back in the lineup today. I hope so.

by GumpBrave on Jun 15, 2011 3:12 PM EDT up reply actions  

Haha...

Nope, I know he’s been injured. You just said he was coming back, so I decided to ask where he’d been.

/end lame joke

Screw the MCAT. F*** you, AAMC.

-Me

by frozendesert on Jun 15, 2011 3:19 PM EDT up reply actions  

I know, I’m just confused why I am the only person who will be thrilled to see Heyward on the field for the Braves.

by GumpBrave on Jun 15, 2011 3:22 PM EDT up reply actions  

I’m noticing he’s not saying he’s healed or saying he’s feeling great—he’s saying that he can play. Something unsettling about that.

by joshmaurer on Jun 15, 2011 3:24 PM EDT up reply actions  

Well, it may be a stretch, but I can surmise from the attitudes of certain members of TC, as well as my own, that Heyward may be slightly falling out of favor. Now, I don’t mean that in a ’let’s trade Jason’ sense; I believe that this cautious optimism can be derived from the fact that he’s been a little too injury prone his first couple of years. We’re all holding our breath and hoping he doesn’t turn into Darryl Strawberry or someone.

So, overall, I think that the silence is a function of us being wary of becoming too excited about his return, lest he re-injure himself in a horrific fashion.

Screw the MCAT. F*** you, AAMC.

-Me

by frozendesert on Jun 15, 2011 3:29 PM EDT up reply actions  

Yea, and I feel the same way, but we should all love him when he is on the field and reasonably healthy because the kid can play. I admit that I am starting to rethink if he is going to be the face-of-a-franchise superstar that we all hoped, but I think that it is at least very possible.

I’m just glad to see his name penciled in if only because it has to give the opposing pitcher something to think about.

by GumpBrave on Jun 15, 2011 3:35 PM EDT up reply actions  

I agree.

The good folks over at CAC have presented some compelling arguments that he’s a young player who’s joints are still growing and who is still filling into his body to explain the multitude of injuries; however, there’s been a lack of concrete evidence to support their points. Additionally, none of the three really have any medical training, let alone advanced knowledge about injury rates of young, tall baseball players.

Hit or miss, I’ll be cheering for him.

Screw the MCAT. F*** you, AAMC.

-Me

by frozendesert on Jun 15, 2011 3:41 PM EDT up reply actions  

Hmm..turns out it’s Jason Heyward bobble head day tonight…

by GumpBrave on Jun 15, 2011 3:45 PM EDT up reply actions  

Conspiracy.

Chicks dig the long ball.

DOB: Did you ever hit balls as hard as Jason Heyward does?
Chipper: Is that possible?

by kimrob1 on Jun 15, 2011 3:50 PM EDT up reply actions  

FG: “So what you’re saying, Frank, is that more people will show up tonight to Jason Heyward bobble-head night if I play Jason Heyward?”

by TBuzz on Jun 15, 2011 3:53 PM EDT up reply actions  

FW: Yes I did. I thought it was a better strategy than the “Mark a child with various numbers and see which one doesn’t get hit by my Harley” game that you were employing.

by GumpBrave on Jun 15, 2011 4:03 PM EDT up reply actions  

Of course we're thrilled...

there’s just a lot of deep-seated frustration from a lot of our members because we’re not 69-0

by TBuzz on Jun 15, 2011 3:43 PM EDT up reply actions  

How can people not love Heap?

"He knows where he's throwing. If he didn't, there'd be dead bodies strewn all over Idaho." - Washington Senators scout on Walter Johnson

by Doghnut on Jun 15, 2011 2:28 PM EDT reply actions  

TL2's got a

gag-and-choke order on anybody who loves McCann. McCann love is a registered trademark of TL2.

by frozendesert on Jun 15, 2011 2:52 PM EDT up reply actions  

Because he's messy

"You come at the king, you best not miss."

by a hooter's baby on Jun 15, 2011 3:03 PM EDT up reply actions  

Great work as always, Jacob.

And now I know a little about wRC, which before this moment seemed an impossible dream.

LIVE EDT

Tape-delayed for the West Coast

by TheLetter2 on Jun 15, 2011 3:08 PM EDT reply actions  

Not trying to be a douche but...

this is the classic example of sabermetrics gone too far, with all these fancy charts and everything.

"Sports is human life in microcosm."

Howard Cosell

by GouldisGold on Jun 15, 2011 3:20 PM EDT reply actions  

Not trying to be argumentative but...

this is exactly why people love sabermetrics—a great visual approximation of the run-producing value of our players.

by joshmaurer on Jun 15, 2011 3:26 PM EDT up reply actions  

Hey,

this is how teams nowadays analyze players. These are the methods that Frank Wren and company use to evaluate which players to pursue in the impending trade market. I appreciate the fact that we, as a public, can use some of the same tools to give ourselves an idea of how players are performing.

If you don’t like that, that’s cool. But don’t say that this is going too far, because this is exactly what Front Office baseball is these days (if it hasn’t become more advanced already).

Screw the MCAT. F*** you, AAMC.

-Me

by frozendesert on Jun 15, 2011 3:31 PM EDT up reply actions  

What is it about fancy charts that you dislike so?

What’s the problem with having information displayed in a more aesthetically pleasing arrangement?

Also, sabermetrics has nothing to do with fancy charts. I could have just as easily done this graphic with Runs or RBI and it would have looked very similar (only much less accurate as far as each player’s value).

"Yeah, and I have an enchanted jock strap." -- Karl Karlson
I now twitter as @junkstats and blog about made-up stats and general baseball stuff at JunkStats.

by Jacob Peterson on Jun 15, 2011 3:35 PM EDT up reply actions  

Word.

I’d much rather look at these in a simple excel chart, that way all of the number can run together and nothing really stands out.

Graphs suck!

derp derp.

Our crappy lucky team *WAS* better than your good unlucky team.

by Richard R on Jun 15, 2011 3:37 PM EDT up reply actions  

This is brilliant. I don’t know what sport you are watching but stuff like this is really interesting even if you arent so sabermetrically focused. What part of the chart and information do you dislike exactly?

by GumpBrave on Jun 15, 2011 3:39 PM EDT up reply actions  

On the contrary

I used to be vehement against sabermetrics and expansive statistics, but I got tired of being intellectually dismantled by those who knew how to look beyond traditional statistics, so I read up, and learned about other nerdy saber crap that honestly doesn’t serve me any benefit in the real working world, especially someone who does art for a living.

But I was doing it through boring vanilla sites like baseball-reference before it went all ad-topia, and Jarrod Saltalamacchia’s name broke the site. Plain, white, typewriter, text. No examples, no analogy, no relation to how it affects my Braves. Boring. But because I wished to expand my horizons a little bit, I persisted anyway. I’m still by no means an expert, but at least I can pretend like I know what I’m talking about.

It’s the artsy part of me that appreciates what Jacob’s doing, presenting colorful, vibrant graphs, with relation to the Braves, that I really wish were around 2-3 years ago when I really started to appreciate the stats. And it’s through stimulating presentation, in which I’m finding that i’m learning or coming to better understand other statistics, not be put off by the efforts.

No wonder nobody likes you, Tuttle... everything's a (Pujols) damn debate.

by royhobbs on Jun 15, 2011 3:45 PM EDT up reply actions  

On the contrary, I have a story that I've been saving for a situation like this.

In short, a two-hour long discussion of sabermetrics and the changing game got me an internship this summer at Case Western doing respiratory research.

I applied for the internship earlier this year with really no belief that I was going to get it (later, I found out that 10 people out of a total of 267 applicants were selected). For some reason, they gave me an interview, and I walked in, chit-chatted for a bit, and presented data from my research at BYU. About 20 minutes in, we were ready to wrap up the interview when I noticed a copy of The Extra 2% on the guy’s bookshelf. I proceeded to ask him about it, and he told me, in basic terms, that it was the story of how the Rays (his team, apparently) went from worst to first in a division with the Yankees and Red Sox. I laughed, and I started to ask him questions about the next undervalued resource in baseball, the amateur draft. One thing lead to another, and we had lunch together talking about market inefficiencies in the game.

And honestly, that’s really the only reason I believed I got the job.

Screw the MCAT. F*** you, AAMC.

-Me

by frozendesert on Jun 15, 2011 3:57 PM EDT up reply actions   1 recs

The one thing leading to another

led to lunch the day of the interview, not breakfast the day after.

You horrible person.

Screw the MCAT. F*** you, AAMC.

-Me

by frozendesert on Jun 15, 2011 4:09 PM EDT up reply actions  

Haha :)

you were saying something about dirty jokes…

by TBuzz on Jun 15, 2011 4:15 PM EDT up reply actions  

Aaah...

Dirty jokes: The best kind of jokes.

Screw the MCAT. F*** you, AAMC.

-Me

by frozendesert on Jun 15, 2011 4:16 PM EDT up reply actions  

Like grave danger...

Is there any other kind?

by TBuzz on Jun 15, 2011 4:19 PM EDT up reply actions   1 recs

+1

http://sportsandgrits.blogspot.com/

by Mr. Sanchez on Jun 15, 2011 4:36 PM EDT up reply actions  

And we learned a valuable lesson that day, didn’t we?

by GumpBrave on Jun 15, 2011 4:05 PM EDT up reply actions  

Yup

If I hadn’t wasted all the time that I do researching the Braves and reading about sabermetrics, and rather applied that time towards making myself a complete person, I probably could have gotten that internship without having to restore to praising the Evan Longoria contract.

Screw the MCAT. F*** you, AAMC.

-Me

by frozendesert on Jun 15, 2011 4:10 PM EDT up reply actions  

I have virtually no idea how to apply any of the concepts, but the charts are pretty.

LIVE EDT

Tape-delayed for the West Coast

by TheLetter2 on Jun 15, 2011 4:24 PM EDT up reply actions  

More wRC means more good.

That’s the extent of my understanding.

Screw the MCAT. F*** you, AAMC.

-Me

by frozendesert on Jun 15, 2011 4:25 PM EDT up reply actions  

basically this

"Welcome to the show, Brandon Beachy. I think you’re going to stay a while."

by abraves257 on Jun 16, 2011 4:22 PM EDT up reply actions  

Art for a living?

so you are the anti-thesis of a “starving artist”?

http://sportsandgrits.blogspot.com/

by Mr. Sanchez on Jun 15, 2011 4:34 PM EDT up reply actions  

Haha.....

That sparked a laugh only because I’ve seen a picture of Sergeant Slaughter.

Screw the MCAT. F*** you, AAMC.

-Me

by frozendesert on Jun 15, 2011 4:36 PM EDT up reply actions  

Ouch.

LIVE EDT

Tape-delayed for the West Coast

by TheLetter2 on Jun 15, 2011 5:36 PM EDT up reply actions  

food can be made into art, too

No wonder nobody likes you, Tuttle... everything's a (Pujols) damn debate.

by royhobbs on Jun 15, 2011 4:37 PM EDT up reply actions  

Gourmet art is not food...

it’s a fat person tease of tasty morsels that are bite size and will only leave us hungry for more after spending an exorbinant fee for their appetizers.

/this reminds me of one of the few Punk’d I liked, with Warren Sapp at a restaurant getting pissy when they brought him child-sized portions.

http://sportsandgrits.blogspot.com/

by Mr. Sanchez on Jun 15, 2011 4:39 PM EDT up reply actions  

Damn It

Now I’m hungry.

Screw the MCAT. F*** you, AAMC.

-Me

by frozendesert on Jun 15, 2011 4:41 PM EDT up reply actions  

Don't go to a 5 star restaurant...

they’ll only arrouse your appetitie without bedding or backdown.

http://sportsandgrits.blogspot.com/

by Mr. Sanchez on Jun 15, 2011 4:42 PM EDT up reply actions  

Arousal, you say?

And in my mind (and wallet), Chick-fil-a is a five star restaurant.

Screw the MCAT. F*** you, AAMC.

-Me

by frozendesert on Jun 15, 2011 4:42 PM EDT up reply actions   1 recs

The Chick-fil-a by my house has been slacking lately. There is a zaxby’s thats even closer…

by GumpBrave on Jun 15, 2011 4:48 PM EDT up reply actions  

Slacking?

What ingrates.

Screw the MCAT. F*** you, AAMC.

-Me

by frozendesert on Jun 15, 2011 4:50 PM EDT up reply actions  

They are ingrates. I worked at the very chick-fil-a I’m referring to in high school and opened the store in fact and we wouldn’t have pulled this kind of cold food, orange stained tenders bullshit.

by GumpBrave on Jun 16, 2011 12:23 AM EDT up reply actions  

I don’t like Gopher.

by joshmaurer on Jun 15, 2011 4:55 PM EDT up reply actions  

thank you

http://sportsandgrits.blogspot.com/

by Mr. Sanchez on Jun 15, 2011 4:57 PM EDT up reply actions  

One of my faves

I’m the god-danged paterfamilias!

by joshmaurer on Jun 15, 2011 4:58 PM EDT up reply actions  

looks like art to me

No wonder nobody likes you, Tuttle... everything's a (Pujols) damn debate.

by royhobbs on Jun 15, 2011 4:42 PM EDT up reply actions  

Is that Cap'n Crunch?

http://sportsandgrits.blogspot.com/

by Mr. Sanchez on Jun 15, 2011 4:55 PM EDT up reply actions  

And on the real point,...

like you, I’ve come reluctantly over to more saber stats. I still think baseball can’t be broken in to an algebra equation, but it’s certainly a helpful tool when used in conjunction with others. But I wonder how different some of the numbers and rankings within those numbers would be if the “weight” used was altered. How do those who create the stats determine how to weight say, for wOBA a 2B vs. a 3B vs. a HR so they can reflect value more accurately in the stat?

http://sportsandgrits.blogspot.com/

by Mr. Sanchez on Jun 15, 2011 4:41 PM EDT up reply actions  

You mean like

reducing the 2B weight to 0.0005 since Braves’ leadoff doubles are always left to become LOBster?

Fangraphs, on Craig Kimbrel: "His strikeout rates look like they’re coming from a video game"

by carpengui on Jun 15, 2011 4:43 PM EDT up reply actions  

They’ve done it. I don’t know the exact math, and this is a very bad explanation, but through mathematical calculations, you can determine how much a double contributes to a team winning by examining games where a double is hit and how it affected the offense for that game. Then, you can do the same for a triple, and compare.

Trust me, they’ve accounted for it.

Screw the MCAT. F*** you, AAMC.

-Me

by frozendesert on Jun 15, 2011 4:44 PM EDT up reply actions  

Anyone who says "Trust me"...

is immediately untrustworthy. Kind of like how “No offense…” always leads to something offensive, or how “gentleman’s clubs” aren’t really for “gentlemen”.

http://sportsandgrits.blogspot.com/

by Mr. Sanchez on Jun 15, 2011 4:57 PM EDT up reply actions  

Or how "not trying to be a douche"

always precedes a very douchey comment.

Kidding. No one is ever a douche on the internet!

"Yeah, and I have an enchanted jock strap." -- Karl Karlson
I now twitter as @junkstats and blog about made-up stats and general baseball stuff at JunkStats.

by Jacob Peterson on Jun 15, 2011 5:05 PM EDT up reply actions  

Well if it makes you feel any better, I use a lot of your material to introduce my baseball fan friends to sabermetrics. It’s great, like royhobbs said, to link the statistic perspective on the game to our favorite team.

by GumpBrave on Jun 15, 2011 5:08 PM EDT up reply actions  

In short, a ton of statistical analysis. Much of it is proprietary, so you would have to pay to get the raw data (as they did…unless they’re John Dewan).

From there, it’s a whole lot of math covering years and years as a sample size.

And, yes, the variables do change. For instance, FIP’s league-specific factor (which usually settles around 3.20) that is used to make the results match ERA’s scale should change daily (they may not change the factor daily on FG, etc., not sure…an easy way to tell would be to see if a pitcher’s FIP changed on a day when they didn’t pitch), depending on how each and every pitcher that threw that day performed.

For other stats like wOBA, you’re looking at years of data in order to eliminate random variations that could alter the values day-to-day. But they will likely change slightly over time…right now, one of the discussions has been whether the value of steals should change based upon the run-starved environment we’ve experienced the past couple years.

-C

It’s rough to sit through these games and not have someone that can’t hit a Ball?

by cthabeerman on Jun 15, 2011 5:23 PM EDT up reply actions  

So it's like sausage making for the most part...

let’s hope it’s not the pre-Jungle version of sausage making.

http://sportsandgrits.blogspot.com/

by Mr. Sanchez on Jun 16, 2011 8:32 AM EDT up reply actions  

You lost me here.

-C

It’s rough to sit through these games and not have someone that can’t hit a Ball?

by cthabeerman on Jun 16, 2011 10:55 AM EDT up reply actions  

When was the last time you knew someone to spend an incredible amount of money to get a ton of raw data, take that product and work with it day and night for years to figure out how exactly something works, devise a system to implement a structured means of evaluating individual sample sizes from the whole of that raw data, and then just give it away for free??

Maybe one day UNICEF will get into the sabermetrics business, but until then, go buy The Book.

-C

It’s rough to sit through these games and not have someone that can’t hit a Ball?

by cthabeerman on Jun 16, 2011 1:25 PM EDT up reply actions  

Alternatively...

You could pay Baseball Info Solutions for all the raw data and do the math yourself.

-C

It’s rough to sit through these games and not have someone that can’t hit a Ball?

by cthabeerman on Jun 16, 2011 1:28 PM EDT up reply actions  

So I'm trusting both the data source...

the permutations of that data by the creator, and the weights they chose to assign that data in calculating their formula?

I guess I’m just not the trusting sort. Not saying they’re disingenious, but there’s an awful lot of steps in these equations, and each step is an opportunity for mistake that would just be magnified by the subsequent steps.

http://sportsandgrits.blogspot.com/

by Mr. Sanchez on Jun 16, 2011 1:55 PM EDT up reply actions  

You’re wrong in thinking they’ll be magnified. An error would cause minimal change in the data, as you’re looking at sample sizes of several hundred thousand PAs and any large error (say, carrying the one in the 10,000s column of singles) would have stuck out like a sore thumb when the product of the formula was reached.

Besides, all the actual math has to be automated (there have already been ~78K PAs this season, 184k last year, no way the math could be done by hand), so it would have to be an error in the formula itself, not in the data.

Also, they haven’t chosen weights. The weights are determined by the formula, not used in the formula. The way you worded that is something akin to me deciding that 44 is the product of seven times six. Regardless of what I think the product will be, it will be 42 every time.

If you don’t trust sabermetrics because there’s so much math involved, then by proxy you should also not drive cars, fly in planes, watch satellite tv or view anything that’s been recorded by camera, etc. The math used to create those designs is far more complicated and equally as prone to error.

-C

It’s rough to sit through these games and not have someone that can’t hit a Ball?

by cthabeerman on Jun 16, 2011 4:21 PM EDT up reply actions  

Then we're back on simplifying a game in to a math equation...

thanks for letting me know how much more is involved, but we can keep going with how the formula is determined (seriously, I’m interested in learning if you’re interested in typing).

But all in all, I think the components and what each individual brings are hard to break down in to a simple, easy to use, single formula, so the premise itself is just hard for my brain to grasp. I was always good at math, but hated it so maybe it really is that simple as you keep going down that path. Are math geniuses really this bored or this under utlized at work to have that much time devoted to analyzing the impact of every single play and outcome in MLB history?

http://sportsandgrits.blogspot.com/

by Mr. Sanchez on Jun 16, 2011 5:02 PM EDT up reply actions  

There is definitely a connection between brilliance and boredom. Lots of times brilliance is best utilized in an area in which the brilliant mind is interested. Baseball probably provides the intersection of entertainment and mathematical application that can keep these mathematical type interested

by GumpBrave on Jun 16, 2011 5:30 PM EDT up reply actions  

I love this kind of analysis man,

For big time baseball nerds it makes us happy down yonder to research sabermetrics such as this. A party in our pants, a pants party if you will. You sir, are not invited to our pants party.

by 5InningsofChuckJames on Jun 15, 2011 5:38 PM EDT up reply actions  

You whippersnappers with your new fangled charts.

I just had to say that.

Charts are pretty.

Chicks dig the long ball.

DOB: Did you ever hit balls as hard as Jason Heyward does?
Chipper: Is that possible?

by kimrob1 on Jun 15, 2011 3:42 PM EDT reply actions  

Especially pie charts.

Mmmmm….. pie. Delicious, delicious pie.

Screw the MCAT. F*** you, AAMC.

-Me

by frozendesert on Jun 15, 2011 3:43 PM EDT up reply actions  

So many dirty jokes want to be made right now…

Chicks dig the long ball.

DOB: Did you ever hit balls as hard as Jason Heyward does?
Chipper: Is that possible?

by kimrob1 on Jun 15, 2011 3:50 PM EDT up reply actions  

That’s the whole point of comments on Talking Chop.

Screw the MCAT. F*** you, AAMC.

-Me

by frozendesert on Jun 15, 2011 3:58 PM EDT up reply actions  

I am fascinated by your wording here…

by GumpBrave on Jun 15, 2011 4:13 PM EDT up reply actions  

Even my wording was dirty.

Chicks dig the long ball.

DOB: Did you ever hit balls as hard as Jason Heyward does?
Chipper: Is that possible?

by kimrob1 on Jun 15, 2011 4:22 PM EDT up reply actions  

Jordan Schafer: 18 games, 9 wRC (7.9 according to fangraphs as of today)
Nate McLouth: 48 games, 19.6 wRC

Still a SSS on JS, but I think the ratios are speaking for themselves: pro-rated out, Schafer looks to be getting league-average numbers.

Fangraphs, on Craig Kimbrel: "His strikeout rates look like they’re coming from a video game"

by carpengui on Jun 15, 2011 4:10 PM EDT reply actions  

Schafer has not been league average.

His wOBA sits at .298, compared to a .316 mark for the league. The average for CFs is right around there, too. He’s definitely below-average offensively.

To put it another way, his wRC+ is 85. 100 is league average. That’s 15% below league average production.

"Yeah, and I have an enchanted jock strap." -- Karl Karlson
I now twitter as @junkstats and blog about made-up stats and general baseball stuff at JunkStats.

by Jacob Peterson on Jun 15, 2011 5:04 PM EDT up reply actions  

Okay.... help me out a bit here, then:

18 games, 7.9 wRC for Schafer. The Braves have played 68 games, so he’s played 18/66 = 27% of the games. Can I not extrapolate his 7.9 to a full 68-games by multiplying 7.9 x (100/27) and getting a projected 28.9 wRC?

Fangraphs, on Craig Kimbrel: "His strikeout rates look like they’re coming from a video game"

by carpengui on Jun 15, 2011 5:10 PM EDT up reply actions  

Yes, you can do that.

But 29 wRC is 8 runs below the 37 that is the average for both any position player and CF in particular. Not league average at all.

"Yeah, and I have an enchanted jock strap." -- Karl Karlson
I now twitter as @junkstats and blog about made-up stats and general baseball stuff at JunkStats.

by Jacob Peterson on Jun 15, 2011 5:11 PM EDT up reply actions  

Ah, dang it.... I just saw my error

I read your 28 in the original article as the league CF avg. — not the 37 which followed. I get it.

Fangraphs, on Craig Kimbrel: "His strikeout rates look like they’re coming from a video game"

by carpengui on Jun 15, 2011 5:14 PM EDT up reply actions  

The kids still technically a rook right?

I’ll take that for a rookie. Its almost 100% that Nate wont be resigned. Give Jordy some time to see if he is “the answer” before we overpay for some old fart. Besides his D is a lot better than Nate’s GOLD GLOVE.

by 5InningsofChuckJames on Jun 15, 2011 5:53 PM EDT up reply actions  

You know, if I had charts like this....

…even multi-day cricket matches could be interesting.

Fangraphs, on Craig Kimbrel: "His strikeout rates look like they’re coming from a video game"

by carpengui on Jun 15, 2011 4:23 PM EDT reply actions  

They totally already are,

DAMN IT.

Screw the MCAT. F*** you, AAMC.

-Me

by frozendesert on Jun 15, 2011 4:24 PM EDT up reply actions  

this is awesome!

I’d also like to see a rate form of the same info…

by blwfish on Jun 15, 2011 4:37 PM EDT reply actions  

Either wOBA or wRC+ will give you the rate info you want.

Can’t make a graph like this using rates, though, so I used wRC.

"Yeah, and I have an enchanted jock strap." -- Karl Karlson
I now twitter as @junkstats and blog about made-up stats and general baseball stuff at JunkStats.

by Jacob Peterson on Jun 15, 2011 4:58 PM EDT up reply actions  

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