New ownership?
by cjones2010 on Oct 4, 2011 11:43 AM EDT
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Doesn't Liberty Media's contract run out this year and shouldn't we be getting new owners who are willing to spend more money?
If we are indeed getting new owners, then we should have more money to spend regardless of what we decide to do with Derek Lowe.New ownership means we could have the money to get 2 big name free agents such as Beltran and Wilson, or Beltran and Reyes, either way we need a LF and put Prado as a super utility guy
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I'm not sure what you mean by contract
But we have now reached the commitment that Liberty Mutual gave Bud back in the day. They guaranteed to hold the team until after the 2011 season.
They did not guarantee to sell the team after this season. It wouldn’t surprise me if they start shopping the team, but I guess I could see them waiting a bit to find a good price. The Braves are probably not costing LM anything.
"The Braves could use [Loney] at first base to help back up Freddie Freeman, and in return the Dodgers could get Tommy Hanson from the Braves."
MARK CUBAN!
Please buy this Atlanta and forget about the Cubs. While the Cubs may have tradition the Braves have a wining tradition. Atlanta is also closer to Dallas and your Mavericks. Please Please Please buy the Braves and increase the payroll, you will not be disappointed by the outcome.
He can't be an owner
the owners around the league didn’t like his in your face attitude
Chopmaster: my link is my dad who has watched the braves since I don’t know. he’s 56.
Flagged.
Not really. But a million times Not This!!
I see great things in baseball. It's our game - the American game. It will take our people out-of-doors, fill them with oxygen, give them a larger physical stoicism. Tend to relieve us from being a nervous, dyspeptic set. Repair these losses, and be a blessing to us. ~Walt Whitman
Not sure why everyone thinks payroll will suddenly go up once Liberty sells
We’re 15th in team salary and 15th in attendance. Seems like we’re operating like most MLB teams do. Very few owners are willing to consistently lose money, especially when there is little upside. Considering the fact that the Braves are in contention again has made almost no difference in attendance, I don’t think I’d be pouring money into this team either.
by nixa37 on Oct 4, 2011 3:05 PM EDT reply actions 1 recs
the braves are never going to be able to have a big payroll again
i mean we were one of the best teams in the league for a while but we were 15th in attendance. atlanta isn’t a bad sports town it’s just not the best. of course southern heat and humidity never helps.
we used to be able to because of tbs. the braves for a while were the most viewed team in baseball which brought in a ton of money. now that honor goes to the yankees because of the YES network. they make 75 million from that and 400 million from attendance alone every year.
the only way would be if mark cuban bought the team and treated the team as his toy rather than his business. that just isn’t going to happen.
All good points.....
But I think most of us are just looking for a 1 man majority owner. While that does not mean he will raise pay-roll, it does likely mean we will have the once in a while very high profile signings. New owners like to make a splash! And I do think we are one legit superstar away form being a special team
If ever one would send me $10, that'd be a great start.
I’ll make that sacrifice. Everyone send me money, and the Braves will win again!
http://sportsandgrits.com/
If we assume that TalkingChop has an interested audience of 1000
We could potentially all chip in with a measly 500k each and make a decent offer.
Who’s in?
"The Braves could use [Loney] at first base to help back up Freddie Freeman, and in return the Dodgers could get Tommy Hanson from the Braves."
Do people...
really want Reyes? I know I would be ashamed to have him on my team considering he asked to come out of the game to protect his batting title. He could have at least faked a hamstring injury considering he was hurt so much anyways. :) But yeah, I’ll throw in my $10 plus an extra $1.
I don't think Jose Reyes makes a good Jose Reyes anymore
by JoelGuzman'sScout on Oct 8, 2011 7:53 AM EDT up reply actions
I see what you are saying…….. But let me remind you the team gave up on their season before he did! So as the team looked to next year and the future when they traded Carlos, do players not have the same right? A batting title likely gets him more money, trading Carlos saved the Mets money and got them a few good spec’s. So no i don’t have a problem with what he did, the Mets Org quit long before he did to save money. ……..
All that said we all want an employee who will work til the end of the day no matter what.
I wouldn’t be ashamed of his ability to play SS and get on base and make things happen.
My dad taught me how to make meat for sloppy joes and my mom let me turn over hot dogs on the grill.
by ChopMaster on Jun 25, 2011 7:25 PM CDT
by justincredubil02 on Oct 4, 2011 8:19 PM EDT up reply actions
Here are his career OPS totals by year…
2003: .769 OPS
2004: .644
2005: .687
2006: .841 (signed extension)
2007: .775
2008: .833
2009: .750
2010: .749
2011: .877 (walk year)
As you can see…a model of consistency. And quite a noticeable Jeff Blauser effect in Arb or Walk years.
There are only 2 bad seasons in that whole list. You know he isn’t going to hit for power, so OPS is a bit unfair to judge him by.
It’s his OBP that makes him so good – and his SB%
Year/OBP/SB%
2003 / .334 / 13 SB 81% (69 games)
2004 / .271 / 19 SB 90% (53 games)
2005 / .300 / 60 SB 80% (161 games)
2006 / .354 / 64 SB 79% (153 games)
2007 / .354 / 78 SB 79% (160 games)
2008 / .358 / 56 SB 79% (159 games)
2009 / .355 / 11 SB 85% (36 games)
2010 / .321 / 30 SB 75% (153 games)
2011 / .384 / 39 SB 85% (126 games)
Career: .341 / 370 SB 80% (1050 games)
For extra good measure, he has a career OPS of .782, even though he is light hitting.
To say he only performs in walk years is extremely misleading. Jose Reyes is one of the best SS in baseball, regardless of walk year or not. He is electric at the top of the lineup and is really good at getting on base. Once the man gets on base, he has an 80% SB rate…EIGHTY PERCENT!
That’s just fantabulously awesome.
My dad taught me how to make meat for sloppy joes and my mom let me turn over hot dogs on the grill.
by ChopMaster on Jun 25, 2011 7:25 PM CDT
by justincredubil02 on Oct 4, 2011 9:45 PM EDT up reply actions
I 100% agree with you on this one.
He is a top of the order hitter, that played in a big park! His OPS isn’t that important to me. I like Jose, he and Bourn would be crazy at the top of the order……. My only question is how much money he will get. Around 100 mil, I’m all in. 150 mil, I’ll pass.
Bourn
Reyes
Heyward-And I’m predicting he will be the .300/.400/.200 guy we all thought he would.
Jones…. We can’t start the season with Uggla in the 4 hole. Slow starter.
McCann
Uggla
Freeman
Prado- When Prado’s hitting 8th that’s a great line up.
If Jason is not the player I’m predicting just flip it, Jason 7th, Brian 3rd and Freeman 5th….. We can move it around after Uggla heats up.
For the record.......
I do think the poor season of Carl Crawford ( Who Reyes is often compared to), will have an effect on what Reyes gets. With the Yanks, Texas, Boston, and the Angels all having their SS, I can’t see why we wouldn’t at least kick the tires?
I am sure we will.
But it is still a longshot. He probably won’t get Crawford money, although he probably should, since they are similar players and he is more valuable being a shortstop. Crawford’s poor season will probably hurt him. That being said, I would guess he gets $125 million from somebody, although it is hard to figure out who will give it to him—-the Mets are a mess financially and most of the other big money clubs are set at SS.
Well.....
IMHO any FA we are talking about right now is a long shot, because FW and F-Gon have not sat down and talked about any players yet ( from what’s been reported that will happen the end of the week). Also it’s the player’s choice, so we have no say so.
Back to Reyes/Crawford….
1) While Reyes plays a more important position, Crawford was healthy for the most part in his career and Reyes has missed time in the last few years.
2). Crawford also had no character issue’s, I’m not saying Reyes does, but he has had somethings go on between he and the Mets that Crawford did not have.
3) The way it’s looking right now ( and it is early), Crawford had more suitors than Reyes may have.
I would love Jose despite the things listed above, but I can also see how these things may drive down his price tag. Carl got 7 years at 142 mil. I could see Reyes getting 6 yrs at 100+ mil. 125 I dunno, but that might be around where I would draw the limit for the Braves. But it all goes back to how they fill about Pastornicky and Simmons. I would also think, it depends on where they Prado in the future. If they are high on Simmons ( who is rumored to be all world defensively), thena future move of Reyes to 3B is not out of the question.
there is also the chance that
Reyes is unhappy with the current free agent market for him and decides to sign a 1 or 2 year deal in hopes there will be a bigger market for him down the road. no?
idk…
Braves.
Falcons.
Gamecocks.
Good point!
But with his injury history, he could also be shooting himself in the foot with that. Agents ussually want to take the most money that is on the table, when that player is coming off his career year. ANd despite Jose putting up good numbers in his career, I doubt anyone would argue that this wasn’t his career year to date. I just don’t see him signing for less than 5 years, but I could be wrong. And If he does decide to do that, wouldn’t that be all the more reason for the Braves to go after him?
Not saying he’s crappy in any way. He batted 3rd in the lineup this year and was an XBH machine.
However, I doubt paying him the 6-7 year $100MM-$120MM contract he will ask for as a FA is worth the price…especially considering it’s a pretty safe bet his production will dip with a new contract in tow.
by TBuzz on Oct 4, 2011 10:24 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
I think he’s exactly the kind of big contract we need to hand out.
Just because our last big contract (Lowe) didn’t work out so well, doesn’t me we should be scared to give out another one.
My dad taught me how to make meat for sloppy joes and my mom let me turn over hot dogs on the grill.
by ChopMaster on Jun 25, 2011 7:25 PM CDT
by justincredubil02 on Oct 4, 2011 11:04 PM EDT up reply actions
Giving it to a 29 yr old is much better than a 35 yr old, that’s for sure.
I’m wondering how strongly the FO is considering Pastornicky at SS for the forseeable future? His career AA and above numbers are not bad, about a .350 OBP and an OPS at about .750…and a SB rate at about 75%. Well worth the minimum if he can stick in the bigs.
by TBuzz on Oct 4, 2011 11:27 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
We’ve had this discussion within the last couple of days (maybe you not and me, per se) but the reports are he can’t stick at SS due to his arm.
My dad taught me how to make meat for sloppy joes and my mom let me turn over hot dogs on the grill.
by ChopMaster on Jun 25, 2011 7:25 PM CDT
by justincredubil02 on Oct 5, 2011 12:06 AM EDT up reply actions
If he’s made it to Gwinnett as a SS, he can stick for the duration of his team control. The kid’s not yet 22 – his arm isn’t going to deteriorate to unusable by 28. If the Braves thought he couldn’t stick, they’d have moved him elsewhere.
It would be an incredibly short-sighted move on the team’s part to leave someone with an ML-talented bat at a position they can’t play in the majors. Especially in the case of shortstops, who can essentially play any position on the field.
That doesn’t mean we should expect his arm to improve. It’s going to be weak for the position. But weak =/= can’t stick.
-C
It’s rough to sit through these games and not have someone that can’t hit a Ball?
One can stick at a position...
…through AAA because the team is hoping for improvement. Generally, shortstops who are questionable in the field stick there until it is obvious that they can’t do it. They can be moved elsewhere when needed. Hell, look how long we left Salcedo there even though it was pretty obvious he would never make it as a SS. Pastornicky is borderline. Given that his bat is hardly a sure thing, the weak infield defense we have already, and the groundball pitchers we have, he seems like an iffy everyday SS option for us.
How long it took Salcedo?? He played SS 19 times in his second year with the organization, at A ball. He got a pretty quick hook at SS.
The strength of a guy’s throwing arm is NOT going to improve by any significant degree. If it’s an overriding issue, he would have moved off much earlier…by Toronto, if not the Braves.
He’s not been moved, so it’s pretty clear the organization isn’t planning on moving him off the position. Weak =/= can’t stick.
-C
It’s rough to sit through these games and not have someone that can’t hit a Ball?
I'm with you 110%
Not to mention, Chipper was pretty often criticized during his batting title year for “skipping games” toward the end to make sure he won… I don’t remember many Braves fans complaining.
The Mets were going nowhere this year. So Jose won the first batting title ever in NYM history and it looks pretty nice on his resume. I’d love to have him in a Braves uniform. Our lineup would be dirty.
by atlbravosfan on Oct 4, 2011 10:48 PM EDT up reply actions
Just think of all those SBs…
of course, if Bourn got on, Fredi would have Reyes bunt him to 2nd for the “hitters” to drive in.
My dad taught me how to make meat for sloppy joes and my mom let me turn over hot dogs on the grill.
by ChopMaster on Jun 25, 2011 7:25 PM CDT
by justincredubil02 on Oct 4, 2011 11:02 PM EDT up reply actions
and you know this how?
you just got out of your Delorean?
by JoelGuzman'sScout on Oct 8, 2011 7:54 AM EDT up reply actions
Not liking him for the Braves is one thing....
But guaranteeing he’ll be a bust? Come on now!
Payroll isn't the issue.
I can see where the casual fan would think that we aren’t doing anything to contend because we aren’t signing all the big name guys. But really, we have a decent payroll, and we have a lot of young cheap talent that won’t stay cheap for long, so payroll flexibility, i.e. not having a bunch of free agents, who become complacent once they’ve gotten theirs, tied up, will be helpful.
I do think a new owner would be good though. Even if he keeps payroll the same, there is something comforting knowing that there is one man sitting up in a press box, or down in the owner’s seats, who legitimately cares about the team and wants to make it better. I miss you, Ted. I’ll always miss you…
It was a particularly small egg...thats why I asked.
by thenightstallion on Oct 4, 2011 8:04 PM EDT reply actions
I miss Ted, too...
Even if he is a communist.
/The above would be bracketed in sarcasm font.
//If I knew how to bracket comments in sarcasm font.
I see great things in baseball. It's our game - the American game. It will take our people out-of-doors, fill them with oxygen, give them a larger physical stoicism. Tend to relieve us from being a nervous, dyspeptic set. Repair these losses, and be a blessing to us. ~Walt Whitman
The key difference between Ted Turner and Liberty Mutual, is that Turner was actually willing to lose money to be able to sign that player that could help win a World Series. Those teams in the 90s would routinely lose $20M a year. Now, the payroll is balanced. The way I understand it LM sets us a budget based on projected revenue. Basically, if the Braves want a high payroll, then they would have to find ways to increase revenue.
Ownership
Bud Selig is also stepping down as commissioner after 2012 so a new commish will most likely be handling the Sale of the Braves.
There are a few people that I wouldn’t mind owning the Braves(don’t say Arthur Blank-he is almost broke and will most likely have to sell the Falcons).
1. Mark Cuban-he invests in his team and does what ever he can to make them better.
2. The Group lead by Steve Garvey
3. Phil Knight
4. David Einhorn-put up 200 million for minority stake in mets, why not buy the division rival and beat them for about 250 million more.
Phil Knight?
I would support this. Maybe. But where do you get that Blank is almost broke?
You shouldn’t sip liquor.
-justincredubil02
no, Jack Daniel is whiskey.
-ChopMaster
"Welcome to the show, Brandon Beachy. I think you’re going to stay a while."
"My Montana Grill at My Field"
That could be Ted’s new restaurant!
I don’t understand why everyone here thinks that a new ownership group will automatically mean a higher payroll. From all the reports I’ve heard, LM has set a budget with the directive of at least breaking even with revenue. So, we can’t increase payroll without finding a way to increase revenue. The days of Ted Turner allowing us to run this team $20M or so overbudget are gone. We have to be budget conscious in everything we do, or find ways to increase revenue.
We simply don’t know. The reason is that the Braves are an elite, highly desirable franchise which could conceivably be purchased by any of thousands of super rich businessmen, a group, or another corporation. Whoever is the purchaser will make the call about the budget. He, they, or it may not share your concern for budget consciousness. Instead, for example, he,they, or it might think signing top free agents and maximizing the team’s championship chances is the priority.
I think what people are asking for is a new owner willing to purposefully lose money...
Terry McGuirk and Frank Wren have made this point abundantly clear. Liberty Media doesn’t set the budget, they only care about turning a satisfactory profit. Therefore, despite all the rumblings of how our execs are simply covering up for the ownership group…the budget really is set internally. The Braves FO could easily generate more revenue and grow sales, and adjust the budget accordingly, but they’re at self-imposed limit based on their performance as a business.
by TBuzz on Oct 6, 2011 11:08 PM EDT via mobile reply actions
Please read it all before responding!!!!!!
If the Braves really want to be a big market team again, they have to get a player fans will come to see. I agree that LM, just won’t loose money, so the budget is set by what we can generate. WHen the Braves where drawing fans they had players the Atlanta fans wanted to see, Chipper, David Justice, Deon Sanders, Otis Nixon, John Smoltz, Tom Glavin, Greg Maddux, Steve Avery, ect……. And while Chipper is still a Brave, You’ed have to be kidding yourself to think he is the same draw he was 10 years ago. Brian is a great catcher and one of MLB’s best, but he’s not a draw that makes you think I have to go see him ( few catchers are Piazza and Joe are the 2 that come to mind). Jason has his fans ( count me as one), but he had a down year. Outside of that the Braves are relatively un-known on the national sceen. Freeman and Kimbrel are starting to get some pub, but they are not there yet. Atlanta is a star driven city! That’s just the truth, un-less you have a mega star or a few star’s on the team, fans will not come. The Falcons have figgured this out.The Hawks should have, the arena hasn’t been packed since the days Nique played at the Omni. And while Uggla will give you a consistent 30 hr’s, he’s not a fan fav and never has been. Kind of a shame, meet the guy twice and he’s a really nice guy.
So please don’t just glance over this and say well Brian a star, Freeman’s a star, Craig is a star, Dan’s a star, it has nothing to do with on field preformance. Just as how they bring fans to the game. And the numbers are behind me. There was a buzz when Jason stepped on the sceen, that buzz wasn’t the same with Freeman and Craig. It’s about what they generate, not the players they are on the field and we just don’t have that one Mega player that does that right now. Could one of these guys become that guy? Yes, my money would be on Jason. But it will be hard to move the budget up untill he does so, or we get a player who can create that type of buzz!
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