If David Wright goes to the Phillies....
How in the hell can the Braves not get Jose Reyes. Obviously everyone knows that the Braves need a shortstop and a left fielder. I'm sorry, the Braves NEED both. If they want to win the division anytime soon. If that means trading Prado and prospects to Miami for Hanley Ramirez and letting Fredi go then do it. More realistically, i would like to think, would be PAYING for Reyes and Cuddyer. At least one of them (Reyes). However, if I can dream, imagine a lineup of Reyes, Bourn, Chipper, Uggla, McCann, Cuddyer, Freeman, Heyward and Tim Hudson. Reyes and Bourn could obviously be switched, so could Chipper and McCann. But anyways, can we all agree that we NEED someone.
This FanPost does not express the views or opinions of Talking Chop.
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We NEED an owner who’s willing to start PAYING more for players…
"Reach down in there...TURN THAT DAMN THING UP!" - Coach Paul Johnson
Then we NEED more fans to show up
Middle of the road attendance, middle of the road payroll.
Follow me on Twitter at @JakeHumphrey91
by Jake Humphrey on Oct 26, 2011 5:09 PM EDT up reply actions 2 recs
Winning games does not equal more fans for this team. Sorry.
The Pirates are not going to trade Andrew McCutchen - please stop suggesting this.
the braves had the 4th best record in the league for most of the season
and we still finished 15th in attendance with 200,000 less than last year
you are a moron.
Legendary collapses in September
and the lack of a legendary manager’s last year to fuel the fires of attendance certainly didn’t help those numbers.
Most people use statistics the way a drunk would use a lamppost—for support, and not for illumination.
www.duwanis.com
Disagree on the first part...
If the Braves had cruised through an easy September into the playoffs, I doubt that would have helped ticket sales for the regular season. Those games at the end had much higher than average attendance figures, unless the Braves were playing the Marlins.
The Mets series actually out-drew the Phillies series, though, so maybe those final few games of the collapse suffered as a result…but the Mets were a weekend series as well.
-C
It’s rough to sit through these games and not have someone that can’t hit a Ball?
by cthabeerman on Oct 27, 2011 11:36 AM EDT up reply actions
Compare that to last year, though
when all 3 games of the last season were sold out.
Last year’s mentality was “let’s get into the playoffs for Bobby,” and fans were turning out to support it in droves. This year seemed to be more along the lines of “I can’t believe how badly we’re playing.”
Most people use statistics the way a drunk would use a lamppost—for support, and not for illumination.
www.duwanis.com
I think it can be attributed to Bobby, for sure. The collapse I’m less sure about. Fickle fans probably weren’t going to go to the NYM series if the team had essentially punched its playoff ticket early. By that point, the playoffs had become cloudy, and those dreams of spending big dollars on playoff tickets were in doubt.
Of course, this is all anecdotal, so either could be utterly right or wrong.
-C
It’s rough to sit through these games and not have someone that can’t hit a Ball?
I WAS CHECKING IN THE SEASON AND WHEN THEY WERE ROLLING THEY STILL HAD MEDIOCRE ATTENDANCE!!!
think and do a little research before you think
ask the marlins and rays if winning has made them fill the stands!
.
It’s not 1991-1993 anymore, and the sooner people lower their expectations and realize that the Braves will struggle to have 50,000 packed houses in Atlanta-Fulton County Stadium doing the Tomahawk Chop in unison, the sooner this attendance issue will temper down.
Times have changed. People no longer want to go out in 102 degree humid Georgia summers anymore. Atlanta’s more diverse with more transplants in than before. Attitudes have changed. Some people think the chop is lame. I don’t do it because I went to VT. Fuel costs are higher. MARTA still sucks. People don’t have as much disposable income as they used to.
Fandom is cyclical. The Phillies may have 104% attendance two years going but 4-5 years ago, people couldn’t give away their Citizens Bank Park tickets. Sometimes it takes marketing. Sometimes it takes winning. Sometimes it takes promotions and cheap bait. But even Wrigley Field and Fenway Park aren’t selling out to the mythical proportions they once had at some point. But things will change, and eventually people will come back. Whether or not it requires more time of tepid attendance is yet to be determined.
No wonder nobody likes you, Tuttle... everything's a (Pujols) damn debate.
OH MAN YOU WROTE IT ALL IN CAPS I REALLY MUST BE RETARDED
I live in Atlanta and I go to several games throughout the year, and I can tell you that in ‘10, at least, the attendance was mediocre until we were in first in the division. Then attendance picked up (which was kind of annoying, because it made MARTA even more of a pain in the ass, because I had to ride with a bunch of fair-weather fans). When we’re not chasing the Phils, more people get out to games. On top of everything royhobbs mentioned.
Most people use statistics the way a drunk would use a lamppost—for support, and not for illumination.
www.duwanis.com
first of all yes
secondly you are wrong. i checked at least 3 times throughout the season for the “at this rate” attendance and it actually picked up as it got cooler with with the help huge weekend where they drew 120,000 against the marlins that weekend and the final series against the phils
Well if you checked 3 times
There’s no way I could be right.
Most people use statistics the way a drunk would use a lamppost—for support, and not for illumination.
www.duwanis.com
because I had to ride with a bunch of fair-weather fans).
racist
"People ask me what I do in winter when there's no baseball. I'll tell you what I do. I stare out the window and wait for spring." Rogers Hornsby
You're right
I just have an instinctual repulsion to the belligerently drunk upper middle-class white male. I can’t help it. I need therpay.
Most people use statistics the way a drunk would use a lamppost—for support, and not for illumination.
www.duwanis.com
Wow typing fail
therapy
Most people use statistics the way a drunk would use a lamppost—for support, and not for illumination.
www.duwanis.com
Admitting you have a problem is the first step. Just 11 more to go. :^)
I didn’t know the fair-weather fan came only in one variety?
"People ask me what I do in winter when there's no baseball. I'll tell you what I do. I stare out the window and wait for spring." Rogers Hornsby
The really annoying ones seem to.
Most people use statistics the way a drunk would use a lamppost—for support, and not for illumination.
www.duwanis.com
There's hope
With the recession our country is in, pretty soon there won’t be an upper middle class. But alas, you’ll still have to deal w/the belligerently drunk white guy.
"People ask me what I do in winter when there's no baseball. I'll tell you what I do. I stare out the window and wait for spring." Rogers Hornsby
we need an owner that is an owner and not a corporation
that way the team is treated as more than a tax write off.
In what way?
You want them to treat it as something they’re willing to lose money on for the sake of winning? They wouldn’t own the team for very long…
Most people use statistics the way a drunk would use a lamppost—for support, and not for illumination.
www.duwanis.com
I actually prefer the team to be used as a tax write-off...
for someone with so much money, a la Ted Turner, that he can afford to take a financial loss and overspend on the team.
If their $20MM overspend just means they don’t pay $20MM extra in taxes, that’s what I’d prefer. Hell, it’s legal to do it in America, why can’t my team do it??
This said, Liberty Media could totally pull that off as well or better than any owner out there, so the ownership change idea is moot.
-C
It’s rough to sit through these games and not have someone that can’t hit a Ball?
Jose Reyes would definitely give us offense & defense at SS and a upgrade over Alex…
The Only Thing To Fear Is, Fear Its Self.......
by Dirtybyrdatl4life on Oct 26, 2011 4:35 PM EDT reply actions
and play just 100 games.. to much money for a guy that keeps getting hurt….
To be the man, you got to beat the man!!
by wisco on Oct 26, 2011 4:51 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
who plays more games in 2012
Chipper or Reyes
by drumzalicious on Oct 26, 2011 9:25 PM EDT up reply actions
Chip.
By a skosh.
I see great things in baseball. It's our game - the American game. It will take our people out-of-doors, fill them with oxygen, give them a larger physical stoicism. Tend to relieve us from being a nervous, dyspeptic set. Repair these losses, and be a blessing to us. ~Walt Whitman
I was thinking the same thing
except by a smidge, not a skosh.
http://sportsandgrits.com/
by Mr. Sanchez on Oct 28, 2011 11:13 AM EDT up reply actions
a smidge < a skosh…. or is my conversion tool broken?
"No. Lonely people mixing with one another? Breeding? Creating an even lonelier generation? You're not even allowing natural selection do its work. Pssh. You're like the guy who invented the seat belt."
Dwight Schrute
Reyes would be an offensive upgrade...
…but not a particular defensive upgrade. Reyes’s defense is good, but so is Gonzo’s. Gonzo’s bat, on the other hand….
GUYS I don't KNOW what THIS THREAD is all ABOUT
I stopped READING at the PART where it SAID that we HAD TO GO OUT and SIGN Reyes.
Most people use statistics the way a drunk would use a lamppost—for support, and not for illumination.
www.duwanis.com
WHADAYA YELLIN’ AT?!?!?
"Think of how stupid the average person is, and realize half of them are stupider than that." George Carlin
by DolphinNation on Oct 27, 2011 8:07 AM EDT up reply actions
Ok....
First off, where the hell are you getting this Wright to the Phillies nonsense? Which prospects are they trading for him? And just where the hell do we have the money to sign Reyes from?
Follow me on Twitter at @JakeHumphrey91
+1
I see great things in baseball. It's our game - the American game. It will take our people out-of-doors, fill them with oxygen, give them a larger physical stoicism. Tend to relieve us from being a nervous, dyspeptic set. Repair these losses, and be a blessing to us. ~Walt Whitman
WHO said THAT the PHILLIES are GOING to GET david WRIGHT?
My dad taught me how to make meat for sloppy joes and my mom let me turn over hot dogs on the grill.
by ChopMaster on Jun 25, 2011 7:25 PM CDT
by justincredubil02 on Oct 26, 2011 5:57 PM EDT reply actions
Never said they were, just "if" they were to get him.
They have been linked to him for some time now.
"Whoever said nothing was impossible, obviously has not tried slamming a revolving door."
by A_Patrick_Tactic on Oct 30, 2011 3:51 PM EDT up reply actions
They have?
My dad taught me how to make meat for sloppy joes and my mom let me turn over hot dogs on the grill.
by ChopMaster on Jun 25, 2011 7:25 PM CDT
by justincredubil02 on Oct 30, 2011 7:11 PM EDT up reply actions
Pass.
Reyes is a d!ck.
He gets hurt easily. Do you need to be reminded that he is not a team player. He pulled himself out of the last game to keep his average/batting title intact.
He turned it on last year because it was his contract year and he still got hurt (again).
I would rather deal with Gonzo’s (non)offense than the baggage that comes with Reyes.
I cant be the only one who has seen how he reacts to umpires whether the call was right or wrong.
F Reyes.
I'll go out on a limb and make a prediction.
Simply that there will be no team willing to pay Reyes what he THINKS he’s worth. I have seldom been wrong about my prognostications about overrated players. I do believe someone WILL pay Pujols anything HE wants. Now I might not be right , but I’m never wrong, I wouldn’t kid you, just ask my 7 ex-wives
Senator, we have another old saying,"Don't piss down my back and tell me it's raining." Fletcher
A post like this needs a good joke
Senator, we have another old saying,"Don't piss down my back and tell me it's raining." Fletcher
How about this
But anyways, can we all agree
I laugh everytime I see someone make this statement.
"People ask me what I do in winter when there's no baseball. I'll tell you what I do. I stare out the window and wait for spring." Rogers Hornsby
Where are you getting this Wright to the Phillies stuff?
I see Cuddyer being their guy. Someone who can cover 1B till Howard is back and can cover 3B as well as RF/LF.
I'm guessing he thinks cause the Phillies have the most money in the NL Reyes will go there.
Senator, we have another old saying,"Don't piss down my back and tell me it's raining." Fletcher
Mets and Dodgers come to mind as two teams who actually would have more money than the Phillies but just haven’t been able to use it
by drumzalicious on Oct 29, 2011 2:41 AM EDT up reply actions
That's about as convoluted as this post is.
Senator, we have another old saying,"Don't piss down my back and tell me it's raining." Fletcher
My friend and I were talking and we decided that if we get Pujols, Reyes, and Kemp, we'd be set
by saipol on Oct 26, 2011 10:47 PM EDT reply actions 1 recs
I really hope you don't have to use sarcasm font for that
I’d like to think we all know and appreciate that one.
Most people use statistics the way a drunk would use a lamppost—for support, and not for illumination.
www.duwanis.com
I'm getting tired of this.
The Braves are 15th in attendance and 15th in payroll. It’s fair. In the 90’s we got by with TBS but that gravy train is gone.
Deal with it.
Player salaries are going up 20 million this year anyways.
Kinda wish we could set up a TV deal that would be worth some $$
I don’t know about everybody else, but I wouldn’t mind seeing games on a different (and perhaps more national) channel than Fox Sports.
Most people use statistics the way a drunk would use a lamppost—for support, and not for illumination.
www.duwanis.com
Not sure if that is possible
Not until the new national deal. MLB signed a deal putting all teams without a stated local deal (WGN, YES, etc.) on a Fox Sports affiliate in their national deal. The Twins ran into this when they attempted to start their own station.
Hey! I’m new.
by ChopMaster on Jul 7, 2011 10:24 PM CDT (joined Jul 19, 2010)
Twitter: @biggentleben
by biggentleben on Oct 27, 2011 9:28 AM EDT up reply actions
Yeah
that’s why it was “wish we could” rather than “wish we would.” Thanks a lot, Selig.
Most people use statistics the way a drunk would use a lamppost—for support, and not for illumination.
www.duwanis.com
its not that simple
for instance: i live in memphis. if the braves had their own network it would start locally and people like me wouldn’t be able to see the games anymore
It could very well be that simple
I can get any of the team-specific channels that are already out there on cable. If they ink a deal with a network that already has more universal distribution (a la the TBS deal) then that’s not even an issue.
Most people use statistics the way a drunk would use a lamppost—for support, and not for illumination.
www.duwanis.com
haven't you heard?
mlb ratings are down. no body wants to pick up a baseball team that they have to show over and over nationally when they could just do a game of the week for a good looking matchup or what makes business sense and just do a college football game instead.
Haven't you heard?
MLB ratings are down, but still better than most TV shows. Teams with national fanbases (like the Braves) could even do better for being televised on a national network.
Most people use statistics the way a drunk would use a lamppost—for support, and not for illumination.
www.duwanis.com
this makes no sense
yes it would be good for the braves but it doesn’t make sense for a network. the braves have a nice little fan base but they aren’t the cowboys. collin cowherd had a good point about baseball compared to football a few months ago. he said one of the reasons the nfl is ratings gold is because it airs once a week. it is consumable. if usa picked up the braves they would have to air at least 5 games a week. there is no way in hell that on a national basis they would do better (especially because of the overkill factor) than their original programming.
i would suggest fuel tv but they have their sights set on competing with espn someday which is why comcast bought nbc.
do you have any network ideas?
i might be thinking of the verses network on second thought
but my argument is the same
How doesn’t it make sense? Baseball ratings don’t match up with football, but they’re a lot better than reruns of Dawson’s Creek, or some of the other crap these networks air. It’s a win-win for teams with a national audience. This is exactly the way TBS worked.
And no, I don’t have any specific ideas about networks, because I don’t really keep up with a lot of TV. I’m sure there are some that wouldn’t be good fits and some that would, just like for any other endeavor. But I know there are plenty of national channels that don’t have to worry about keeping up a primetime schedule or anything like that and could benefit from a baseball contract.
Most people use statistics the way a drunk would use a lamppost—for support, and not for illumination.
www.duwanis.com
It’s a cost issue for the most part.
Paying to air a baseball game Vs a couple of episodes of Dawson’s Creek or Friends or whatever.
Once they’ve already sunk the cost into a syndication deal they can basically air the show as much as they like. That and the fact that they’re usually having to share ad money with the team. So they’d rather get lower ratings to air something cheaper but probably turn a similar profit.
If it’s a national network like TBS, there’s also the issue where the Braves viewership is going to skew mostly to the south, while Friends or whatever is going to be viewed by people all over the country.
The south is another issue for the Braves, as, bluntly put, people in the south tend to be, on average, poorer than people in other parts of the country. So you get less ad money for the Braves than you might get with a Dodgers deal in California.
Q: If not us, who? If not now, when? A: The Batman. And "when you least expect it."
yeah except dawson's creek isn't in primetime anywhere
after you rule out all the fox, turner, nbc, and espn networks you are left with pretty much nothing.
you’re right about the tbs part. but the fact is they outgrew us, which is exactly what other networks want to avoid. they don’t want to exclusively plug into 1/30th of the market for baseball.
the other issue is that the network would likely actually have to own the braves rather than just a partnership. think about it. if the braves managed to get a 10 year deal they would likely have jack up the payroll to get marketable players that people want to watch. after that contract ends and the network decides they want to dump us we are left with a monstrosity that is our payroll and no way to sustain it. they could end up bankrupt. its a lot easier said than done to get a media corporation to pick us up.
stop using logic, clearly Liberty are all horrible people.
People seem to forget that the Braves made a lot more money back int he day when Ted was around, making more money means that he could spend more money and keep the profit margin similar. Increasing salary now would cut into Liberty’s profit margin, whereas Ted’s profit margin was soooo gigantic that he could afford to cut into it a bit. Thats simply not the case anymore.
"No. Lonely people mixing with one another? Breeding? Creating an even lonelier generation? You're not even allowing natural selection do its work. Pssh. You're like the guy who invented the seat belt."
Dwight Schrute
Part of that profitability
being coupled with TBS for well over 100 games being nationally televised. More ad revenue off TV, better TV, and more widespread interest for fans and merchandise among other revenue streams. The worst thing to happen to the Braves was no longer having 120-140+ games on TBS every year.
http://sportsandgrits.com/
by Mr. Sanchez on Oct 27, 2011 12:22 PM EDT up reply actions
exactly, losing TBS killed the Braves chances of having a high payroll, but its not like we are the Marlins and onyl spending 50M we can consistently win with a payroll around 90M, there’s no need to concern ourselves with a new owner.
"No. Lonely people mixing with one another? Breeding? Creating an even lonelier generation? You're not even allowing natural selection do its work. Pssh. You're like the guy who invented the seat belt."
Dwight Schrute
No worries.
The Phillies have the corpse of Ryan Howard under contract for 5 more years.
If we can land [Stephen Drew], I will give FW a bj.
~justincredubil02
Haha
Are you saying a hobbled, increasingly overweight 32-year-old with a diminishing skill set coming off of Achilles surgery isn’t gonna be worth $25-$28 million per season a couple years down the road? He drivez in RUNZ!
"If you were going to make a Mount Rushmore of managers, Bobby's one of them."
-Mike Scioscia
by The Keith Lockhart Era on Oct 27, 2011 6:00 PM EDT up reply actions
If Prado and nameless prospects to the Marlins were all that was needed to get Hanley Ramirez, someone else would gotten him 3 years ago.
My buddy and I just decided that the braves would be set if we could get Matt Kemp, Jose Reyes, and Albert Pujols.
by willlinn on May 17, 2011 2:13 PM EDT
But the Fish are going to go out and sign Reyes
so they’ll be giving HanRam away.
Most people use statistics the way a drunk would use a lamppost—for support, and not for illumination.
www.duwanis.com
How many GMs got pissed when they learned
a young lefty relief arm and a utility man was all it took for Uggla?
http://sportsandgrits.com/
Good point.
But where is the Reyes to the Marlins rumor coming from?
Some sportswriter
who said he could see Reyes going “to any NL East team,” and another sportswriter saying that he believes the Fish will move HanRam to another position if they pick up Reyes and/or Rollins.
Most people use statistics the way a drunk would use a lamppost—for support, and not for illumination.
www.duwanis.com
Wow....
The Fish have a decent young 3B man, so where would they move him? I also wouldn’t worry so much about Hanley and F-Gon getting along if Atlanta seeked to trade for him. I’d worry about Hanley and Dan getting along!
you could move Hanley pretty much anywhere on the diamond and he would play, he would struggle in CF, but I am sure he could handle a corner OF spot, or 3B or 2B….he couldnt be a lot worse defensively at those positions.
"No. Lonely people mixing with one another? Breeding? Creating an even lonelier generation? You're not even allowing natural selection do its work. Pssh. You're like the guy who invented the seat belt."
Dwight Schrute
Please read above.
The Fish have a good, young 3B man in Dominguez. The scouts love himm and even Chipper gave him a few complements ( If you care to google it). CF as you mentioned would be a struggle. Offensively he would be fine at a corner spot, but they have Stanton and Morrison, both younger and cheaper. it would be a mistake to sit either of those guys if you ask me. 1B they have Sanchez and 2B omar, Hanley will not and can not be a catcher. So I ask again where would the Fish play him? If they sign Reyes to me that would be clear that they would move Hanley or Logan. Hanley makes more, so i’m guessing Hanley.
I think Hanley has a world of talent. .300 . 30 hrs and 30+ SB’s are all with in his grasp. I wouldn’t mind at all if the Braves went after him! Although it would kill my David Wright idea for 2013.
Omar isn't some player
you aren’t willing to move. And I think Hanley could play a passable CF. Not good, but there’s a lot who get by on athleticism and not much ability out there these days.
http://sportsandgrits.com/
I assume Hanley would be slightly worse than a player like Josh Hamilton in CF. basically a slightly below average CF. Of course that is right now as he ages and if he continues to get bigger and stronger he will outgrow CF
"No. Lonely people mixing with one another? Breeding? Creating an even lonelier generation? You're not even allowing natural selection do its work. Pssh. You're like the guy who invented the seat belt."
Dwight Schrute
first of I am well acquanted with minor league players and Matt Dominguez is a solid player. He is supposed to be a very good defender, but considering he hsa one season with an OPS above 800 in the minors, and an OBP of 325 in the minors… I would assume the Marlins would rather have Hanley in teh lineup than DOminguez.
He is a solid prospect but he isnt a player you build around, which means DOminguez is expendable. Especially when you look at his career arc todate, he appears to be regressing a bit.
"No. Lonely people mixing with one another? Breeding? Creating an even lonelier generation? You're not even allowing natural selection do its work. Pssh. You're like the guy who invented the seat belt."
Dwight Schrute
If they had any plans on trading Omar......
They would not have just extended him. They already knew who they would make a run at in FA, so I can’t see them giving him a contract with their limited funds if they didn’t want him around. I don’t think Hanly can play CF at all, I just don’t see it. Add to that you have an avg defensive RF’er in Stanton and a below avg defender in LF in Logan and you put a guy in CF that has never played there, just doesn’t seem like a good baseball move to me.
Who said anything about trading him?
I said move him, as in if they get a better player, he’s not one you have to have in the lineup. He’s not entrenched as a starter.
http://sportsandgrits.com/
by Mr. Sanchez on Oct 29, 2011 12:19 PM EDT up reply actions
They just gave him 4 mil a season. I think they view him as a starter! So IMHO he is entrenched as a starter!
A starter capable of playing 3B, 2B, CF, or anywhere else, yes
or perhaps your 10th starter filling in wherever as we discuss with Prado.
http://sportsandgrits.com/
The reason they make italics is so you can stress words without needing to capitalize
Freeman isn’t on Heyward’s level in terms of tools, skills, or baseball IQ–but it’s fair to say Freeman has failed to meet the modest expectations in place for him - Capitol Avenue Club (May 28th, 2011)
I dunno
I don’t think this is much better than using caps a lot.
The better thing to do would be to point out which words don’t actually need the emphasis. Like, for example, all of the words in the original post.
Most people use statistics the way a drunk would use a lamppost—for support, and not for illumination.
www.duwanis.com

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