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Around SBN: So Let's Talk About Hulk Too, I Suppose

Jason Heyward: Jim Callis' #3 Prospect of the Past Decade

In his most recent weekly mailbag over at Baseball America, Jim Callis discussed the top prospects of the past decade. Jason Heyward came in 3rd. Jim Callis, who is easily one of the most respected prospect gurus around, had this to say about Jay Hey:

Let's stack Heyward up against the No. 1 prospects from the past decade: Rick Ankiel (2000), Josh Hamilton (2001), Josh Beckett (2002), Mark Teixeira (2003), Joe Mauer (2004 and 2005), Delmon Young (2006), Daisuke Matsuzaka (2007), Jay Bruce (2008) and Matt Wieters (2009). While Heyward would definitely rank No. 1 in fanfare received as a prospect, let's ignore all the hype swirling around him and focus solely on talent.

Heyward hit .323/.408/.555 as a 20-year-old in high Class A and Double-A (and a three-game cameo in Triple-A) last season. The only position players to top his performance were Matt Wieters (1.053 OPS) and Mark Teixeira (1.005 OPS), both as 22-year-olds in high Class A and Double-A. Jay Bruce had a .962 OPS but didn't control the strike zone close to as well as Heyward did.

Looking at the list of hitters, only Mark Teixeira and Joe Mauer are the unquestionably better hitters than Jason Heyward currently is. Jay Bruce still cannot control the strikezone on a regular basis to become an All Star-like talent and Josh Hamilton, unfortunately, got into the wrong things and is now paying the price after abusing his body for so many years. Delmon Young never quite figured out Major League pitching and still struggles to make consistent contact despite being such a highly-regarded prospect. Matt Wieters, who Callis chose as the top prospect of the past decade, hit well in his rookie season, but is still learning to be the leader of a young pitching staff.

Star-divide

Callis goes on to list Heyward 3rd, behind only Weiters and Red Sox ace Josh Beckett and finished just ahead of Mark Teixeira. Here's his reasoning:

Among the hitters, I'd take Heyward second. I'd put Wieters No. 1 because of the positional value he has as a catcher, and I'd put Heyward ahead of Teixeira for having a comparable performance while two years younger.

Callis, whether it be correct or not,always seems to give a huge advantage to catchers in his prospect ratings simply because of the positional value they bring.  While I agree with him that offensively-talented catchers are very rare nowadays, I feel that he might be over-valuing them just a little bit too much. And it's not like Heyward is a slouch in Right Field either; all of the scouting reports we've seen and heard about have Jay Hey as a plus-defender in the outfield who takes great routes to balls and has a cannon for an arm. In my opinion, I'd have Weiters listed as "1a." and Heyward listed as "1b.", with Beckett, Teixeira and Mauer rounding out the top 5.

Here's what Callis had to say about comparing Heyward to the pitchers in the list:

It's more difficult to compare Heyward to the pitchers. Matsuzaka arrived in the United States with the reputation for having six pitches that graded as plus at times (not even counting the mystical gyroball), as well as a track record of sterling success in the Japanese majors and international play. Beckett was spectacular in 2001, going 14-1, 1.54 with 203 strikeouts in 140 minor league innings before an impressive September callup.

First of all, Dice-K was never a prospect. He was 26 or 27 when he made his Major League debut and had been pitching professionally for years before that. It's not fair to compare him to a bunch of 21-year old kids with only minor league experience. As for Beckett, those numbers are very, very impressive. The only reason I have him listed 3rd (or 2nd, if you want to be technical about it) is because a pitcher can only affect the outcome of a ballgame once or twice a week. While Weiters and Heyward are bashing on pitchers 6 or 7 days a week, Beckett can only pitch once or twice for 15 innings or so. I'd take the incredibly talented every day player before I'd take the incredibly talented once-every-5-days player.

All-in-all, I think the article confirmed what many of us had been thinking for quite some time: Jason Heyward is an incredible talent who could become the next superstar in baseball. He's blessed with ridiculous talent and his potential seems limitless. Let's all just sit back and watch as this phenom grows.

Agree? Disagree? It's been an incredibly slow day for Braves news and hopefully this will spark some discussion. Also, consider this your pre-game thread, so chat away about tonight's game if you're in to that sort of thing. First pitch is at 10:05EST. The Jay Hey Kid will be in the lineup.

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BTW, MattyD is hitting leadoff tonight

I know that makes me happy.

"(Jason Heyward) is like the Grim Reaper -- you know he's going to get you, you just don't know where or when."

by Scott Coleman on Apr 14, 2010 6:45 PM EDT reply actions  

This also makes me happy.

This Heyward kid is different. -Duk, Big League Stew

by McCann and McWill on Apr 14, 2010 6:52 PM EDT up reply actions  

lol

"Playoffs are over, fire Bobby, hang Wren, destroy the stadium, sign Eckstein." ~ UltimaParadox, 4/12/10

by Smoltz's Beard on Apr 14, 2010 8:56 PM EDT up reply actions  

That made my day.

Jason Heyward is so good, he makes David Wright piss in Ryan Howard’s pants

by heap16 on Apr 14, 2010 7:13 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions  

LADIES AND GENTLEMEN..... HEYWARD HYSTERIA IS UNDERWAY

by JKowalek on Apr 14, 2010 8:51 PM EDT up reply actions  

we will be up by 3 by the end of the third

and, escobar will have a hit by then and at least 2 hits or one big hit in the game.

by willlinn on Apr 14, 2010 6:55 PM EDT reply actions  

Lineup:

MattyD
Prado
Chipper
McCann
Glaus
Escobar
Heyward
McLouth
Hanson

"(Jason Heyward) is like the Grim Reaper -- you know he's going to get you, you just don't know where or when."

by Scott Coleman on Apr 14, 2010 7:11 PM EDT reply actions  

So Callis chose Wieters over Mauer???

by dunnytwogloves on Apr 14, 2010 7:18 PM EDT reply actions  

looks like it

but it seems like Callis chose potential and talent at the time of being called up and didn’t really give much thought to what the players have done in the Majors.

If I was starting a team, I’d take Mauer over anyone for the next 10 years, but that’s just me.

"(Jason Heyward) is like the Grim Reaper -- you know he's going to get you, you just don't know where or when."

by Scott Coleman on Apr 14, 2010 7:23 PM EDT up reply actions  

Not counting contracts, I'm assuming.

But I’d still take J-Hey over Mauer for the next 10 years. If we’re talking any 10 years, I might take Mauer (including his last few and his next 6 or 7). But given J-Hey’s age, I think he’s a slightly better bet for the next 10.

I think of Wieters as a kind of Mauer-lite. Maybe I’ll be proven wrong, but I wouldn’t rate him as high as J-Hey either.

"Yeah, and I have an enchanted jock strap." -- Karl Karlson

by Jacob Peterson on Apr 14, 2010 7:36 PM EDT up reply actions  

I think he's looking more at a historical perspective

I think I’d definitely take Mauer ahead of all of the above at this point. Especially for an AL team like Minnesota, where they can extend his shelf-life by using him at DH sometimes during the season. He can get away from the grind 40-50 games per year without the team losing his bat in the line-up.

But as a prospect, Wieters was crazy good. He was about the only player I could find who had the mix of power/average that Heyward does, as well as his strike zone control. He was every good a hitter as J-hey, over slightly more games, and he did it from catcher. That’s extremely valuable.

I’d put him right neck and neck with Teixeira. I can even understand why he’s behind Beckett-Beckett has been greatly overrated as pitcher since he moved to Boston, and that was after years of being underrated in Florida, but as a prospect, he was Tommy Hanson times 2. A sure thing star pitcher in the making, and he lived up to it. He’s definitely a top 15 pitcher in the league, maybe even top 10, despite being overrated.

by Bronn on Apr 14, 2010 7:50 PM EDT up reply actions  

You really think Beckett is top-10 in the league?

"Playoffs are over, fire Bobby, hang Wren, destroy the stadium, sign Eckstein." ~ UltimaParadox, 4/12/10

by Smoltz's Beard on Apr 14, 2010 8:58 PM EDT up reply actions  

I sure don't, as of right now

top 20 is debatable, even.

"Yeah, and I have an enchanted jock strap." -- Karl Karlson

by Jacob Peterson on Apr 14, 2010 9:00 PM EDT up reply actions  

That’s what I was thinking too. I was just curious to hear who Bronn would rate him over.

"Playoffs are over, fire Bobby, hang Wren, destroy the stadium, sign Eckstein." ~ UltimaParadox, 4/12/10

by Smoltz's Beard on Apr 14, 2010 9:03 PM EDT up reply actions  

I go back and forth on Beckett all the time. I mean the guy has been a horse for years and his stats are generally better than they appear at first glance especially pitching in that park against the competition he faces in the AL East. I think he is better than I used to think he was, but not necessarily in that Elite category.

by yondaime4 on Apr 14, 2010 11:25 PM EDT up reply actions  

Don’t get me wrong he’s really, really good. Just not really, really, really good.

"Playoffs are over, fire Bobby, hang Wren, destroy the stadium, sign Eckstein." ~ UltimaParadox, 4/12/10

by Smoltz's Beard on Apr 15, 2010 10:19 AM EDT up reply actions  

I don't disagree

but Wieters was significantly older (in prospect years) at the time he was doing damage. For me, that easily outweighs his positional advantage. I agree with mvhsbball that the catcher advantage is slightly overrated in many circles. The main reason is that catchers can’t play every day at catcher. Sure, Wieters or Mauer can DH some days, but they are not nearly as valuable as DHs. If they played in the field on those days, it might push them past J-Hey in my mind. We’re talking very fine points here.

"Yeah, and I have an enchanted jock strap." -- Karl Karlson

by Jacob Peterson on Apr 14, 2010 8:58 PM EDT up reply actions  

JoJo Reyes to the 15 day DL
Jo-Jo Reyes going on DL with strained knee, hurt it backing up home plate during Monday debacle.

Who’s coming up???

"(Jason Heyward) is like the Grim Reaper -- you know he's going to get you, you just don't know where or when."

by Scott Coleman on Apr 14, 2010 7:30 PM EDT reply actions  

Mike Dunn will be the man brought up from AAA. Move will probably be made on Thursday.

"(Jason Heyward) is like the Grim Reaper -- you know he's going to get you, you just don't know where or when."

by Scott Coleman on Apr 14, 2010 7:33 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions  

It’s possible that neither Dunn nor Jonny Venters is ready to pitch in the bigs, but I think both can do better than Jo-jo.

"Yeah, and I have an enchanted jock strap." -- Karl Karlson

by Jacob Peterson on Apr 14, 2010 7:39 PM EDT up reply actions  

Yall callin phantom injury? Interesting.

by romone_braves91 on Apr 14, 2010 7:45 PM EDT up reply actions  

C'mon

a “sprained knee”? That does not sound serious enough to merit a DL trip

"Yeah, and I have an enchanted jock strap." -- Karl Karlson

by Jacob Peterson on Apr 14, 2010 8:51 PM EDT up reply actions  

I had a sprained knee once it hurt for 6 months. just sayin.

by yondaime4 on Apr 14, 2010 11:26 PM EDT up reply actions  

As long as Proctor stays in the minors until a certain date (I think it’s around May 15th or so) we can offer him arbitration next year. I’m sure we’ll see him shortly after that date passes.

"(Jason Heyward) is like the Grim Reaper -- you know he's going to get you, you just don't know where or when."

by Scott Coleman on Apr 14, 2010 7:53 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions  

Proctor has also sucked

The Jordan Schafer Fan Club.

by acie4mvp on Apr 14, 2010 8:00 PM EDT up reply actions  

Thanks to Joe Torre for abusing his arm.

by romone_braves91 on Apr 14, 2010 8:08 PM EDT up reply actions  

At the time Proctor signed...

it was said if he was off the roster for 21 days. I’d assume that means he’s got a week or two before we have arb control of him next year.

by Mr. Sanchez on Apr 14, 2010 8:17 PM EDT up reply actions  

I think this may be one of those “roster” injuries. Kind of like how the Giants are keeping Fred Lewis on the DL b/c they have too many (mediocre) outfielders. I doubt Jo-jo’s knee is all that badly hurt. Unless “knee” is a code word for “chances of ever being more than emergency insurance for a contender”.

"Yeah, and I have an enchanted jock strap." -- Karl Karlson

by Jacob Peterson on Apr 14, 2010 7:40 PM EDT up reply actions  

On another message board, someone brought up the fact that JoJo has never had a scoreless outing in his life.

"Playoffs are over, fire Bobby, hang Wren, destroy the stadium, sign Eckstein." ~ UltimaParadox, 4/12/10

by Smoltz's Beard on Apr 14, 2010 9:00 PM EDT up reply actions  

Wow

That is so remarkable that I actually had to go check it. And it’s true, at least for MLB. He has had several scoreless AAA appearances. I wonder who holds the record for most outings to start a career without having a scoreless one?

"Yeah, and I have an enchanted jock strap." -- Karl Karlson

by Jacob Peterson on Apr 14, 2010 9:06 PM EDT up reply actions  

I figured there were embellishing, so I did the same thing and checked his game logs. Sure enough, it’s true. A dozen or so quality starts, but no goose eggs.

And sorry, I should have put MLB career instead of life, ha.

"Playoffs are over, fire Bobby, hang Wren, destroy the stadium, sign Eckstein." ~ UltimaParadox, 4/12/10

by Smoltz's Beard on Apr 14, 2010 9:09 PM EDT up reply actions  

I did the exact same thing when I saw that post. I was completely prepared to go to B-R.com, find 3 or 4 games and come back and shove them in that poster’s face…but I shoved it in my own face.

He had a few really really good games (6+ innings, 1 R, etc), but no goose-eggs.

This guy wants to suck all the cubs dick can he not have an unbias some what partition reguards
by RWH2 on Apr 5, 2010 10:20 AM CDT

by justincredubil02 on Apr 15, 2010 9:52 AM EDT up reply actions  

I wonder who holds the record for most outings to start a career without having a scoreless one?

Do I smell the makings of a new post?

"Playoffs are over, fire Bobby, hang Wren, destroy the stadium, sign Eckstein." ~ UltimaParadox, 4/12/10

by Smoltz's Beard on Apr 14, 2010 9:09 PM EDT up reply actions  

$5 bucks says its up by friday morning. :)

"(Jason Heyward) is like the Grim Reaper -- you know he's going to get you, you just don't know where or when."

by Scott Coleman on Apr 14, 2010 9:27 PM EDT up reply actions  

I figured as much

Hopefully we get him the heck off the team while the season is still young

by Trek on Apr 14, 2010 7:52 PM EDT reply actions   1 recs

Who misses Braves on TBS?

Just read an article on Wags and how he grew up a Braves fan in VA due to TBS. Braves on TBS, man those were the days. Where is Ted Turner to come save the day with his money? The 90’s were awesome.

by romone_braves91 on Apr 14, 2010 8:02 PM EDT reply actions  

It’s the reason there are Braves fans in every other MLB city and the Braves get a good turnout wherever they are. Few teams other than the Yankees, Red Sox, Cubs, Cardinals, and maybe Phillies with their recent run can say the same.
 
The entire continental United States is Braves Territory, bitches. :)

tUMD Hockey: In search of a title! But probably not this year.

by UMDBHIK on Apr 14, 2010 8:19 PM EDT up reply actions  

The entire continental United States is was Braves Territory, bitches. :)

by Mr. Sanchez on Apr 14, 2010 8:23 PM EDT up reply actions  

I met a guy one time he said he was a die hard fan and he was from Oregon. His response threw me off for a sec. I was like, “I guess it’s either Braves or Mariners. Good Choice.”

by romone_braves91 on Apr 14, 2010 8:25 PM EDT up reply actions  

For now, sure,...

but the farther we get from TBS (it seems like over 5 years now), that will steadily change.

by Mr. Sanchez on Apr 14, 2010 8:32 PM EDT up reply actions  

I'm from Southern California then moved to North Idaho when I was a kid.

Braves fan. Always have been. David Justice, 1991 Sports Talk Baseball on Sega, and TBS. There are your reasons. ha.

by kreese555 on Apr 14, 2010 8:50 PM EDT up reply actions  

The problem now isn't so much the lack of TBS,

it’s the prevalence of nationally-available baseball of any type, but especially Yankees and Red Sox games. The Braves (and to a lesser degree the Cubs) used to have a monopoly on non-weekend baseball in many areas. That is no longer the case. And to make things worse, practically every Yankees/Red Sox game is on national TV, so people get exposed to those teams much more than the Braves or other teams.

On the plus side, you’ve got the internet, Extra Innings, etc. so baseball fans without a hometown team can watch and see which team they like best (which of course would be the Braves).

"Yeah, and I have an enchanted jock strap." -- Karl Karlson

by Jacob Peterson on Apr 14, 2010 8:55 PM EDT up reply actions  

check your e-mail

"(Jason Heyward) is like the Grim Reaper -- you know he's going to get you, you just don't know where or when."

by Scott Coleman on Apr 14, 2010 9:32 PM EDT up reply actions  

"While Heyward would definitely rank No. 1 in fanfare received as a prospect,"???

Wieters was pretty hyped himself now. Daiske, as said above, was a huge money signing, after a bidding war between the two ESPN fellate, with a supposed 6 plus pitches. I’d say that was a lot of fanfare. I’m sure Mauer got a lot of love in the Twin City.

Basically, while Heyward has been well publicized, those others got a lot of attention too.

by Mr. Sanchez on Apr 14, 2010 8:22 PM EDT reply actions  

Yeah, Wieters certainly got some hype

http://www.mattwietersfacts.com/

I think Baltimore fans are even more starved for a star than we are

by GTwill on Apr 14, 2010 8:35 PM EDT up reply actions  

Joe Mauer could ritualistically mutilate unwed teenage mothers in front of the state capitol and all he’d get was a stern lecture.
 
The guy literally can do no wrong here in Minnesota. I’d say the amount of adoration heaped upon the guy is sickening except for the fact I know that every fan base is like that. Jeter, ARod, Chipper, Pujols, etc.

tUMD Hockey: In search of a title! But probably not this year.

by UMDBHIK on Apr 14, 2010 8:55 PM EDT up reply actions  

i think ur misspeaking..there’s no way he’d get a stern lecture…no one would question Mauer

Heyward,Hanson,and Shaffer r ready now!! Why do you think they havent signed the "right handed bat"?

by fatazfoot on Jan 7, 2009 8:59 PM EST

by Swo12bv on Apr 14, 2010 8:58 PM EDT up reply actions  

Yeah, I was surprised about that remark as well.

"Playoffs are over, fire Bobby, hang Wren, destroy the stadium, sign Eckstein." ~ UltimaParadox, 4/12/10

by Smoltz's Beard on Apr 14, 2010 9:02 PM EDT up reply actions  

FYF with another bomb.

"Playoffs are over, fire Bobby, hang Wren, destroy the stadium, sign Eckstein." ~ UltimaParadox, 4/12/10

by Smoltz's Beard on Apr 14, 2010 9:10 PM EDT reply actions  

hes on my bench in fantasy

my team is f’ing horrible.

"(Jason Heyward) is like the Grim Reaper -- you know he's going to get you, you just don't know where or when."

by Scott Coleman on Apr 14, 2010 9:27 PM EDT up reply actions  

Game Time in less than 30

Hanson on the hill, Ladies and Gentlemen!

by romone_braves91 on Apr 14, 2010 9:38 PM EDT reply actions  

Haha, Spilborghs with a 3-run bomb to take the lead 4-3 against the Mets in the 3rd.

"Playoffs are over, fire Bobby, hang Wren, destroy the stadium, sign Eckstein." ~ UltimaParadox, 4/12/10

by Smoltz's Beard on Apr 14, 2010 9:41 PM EDT reply actions  

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