If J-Hey bats cleanup...
by HalleyGator on Mar 9, 2010 3:12 PM EST
85 comments
I know we talk all about the projected line up and whether J-Hey should hit second or seventh, etc.
But what if we just realize that we are dealing with a FREAK and admit that he is just "that good" so that he can start off in the #4 hole. After all, is there ANY DOUBT that the kid is going to be a cleanup hitter for a ong, long time?
NOW how strong does our lineup look?
1. McLouth (L)
2. Prado (R)
3. Chipper (R/L)
4. J-Hey (L)
5. Glaus (R)
6. McCann (L)
7. Escobar (R)
8. Diaz/Melke (R/L)
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Well actually...
he looks a lot more like a #3 hitter for the long run, so yes there is doubt that he is going to bat cleanup for a long, long time.
This.
"SIGN PUJOLS OR FIRE WREN" ~ Swo12bv
by Smoltz's Beard on Mar 9, 2010 4:37 PM EST up reply actions
This...
I could see Jay Hey moving to the #3 slot at some point this year, and Chipper to #2, but the #4 is Glaus’.
"Yeah, and I have an enchanted jock strap." -- Karl Karlson
There’s no way J-Hey is batting lead off, and I don’t believe anyone but Chipper will man the 3-hole unless he ends up hurt. But I am waiting for some yahoo to recommend that we put Glaus in the lead off spot becuse he is a singles hitter and gets on base alot!
by I Saw Buzz Beaned on Mar 10, 2010 11:44 AM EST up reply actions
Nah...
He’s Ryan Howard, Fred McGriff and A-Rod…all rolled into one!
He’s what they had in mind when they wrote “Casey at the Bat.”
He’s what wikipedia shows when you look up “Cleanup hitter.”
he would lose about 15-20 PAs over a season from one spot…
additonally generally you put a guy in the 3 hole who can hit for a high avg has good power and good plate discpline
for those of you not paying attn. Heyward is a prototypial three hitter, your 4 hitter is generally a power hitter who may not hit for a higher avg but has a great ISO so that he can drive in runs (ala Adam Dunn)
Heyward,Hanson,and Shaffer r ready now!! Why do you think they havent signed the "right handed bat"?
by fatazfoot on Jan 7, 2009 8:59 PM EST
You’re right about Dunn being a prototypical cleanup hitter. He surely isn’t a prototypical leadoff hitter, that distinction would go to Corey Patterson.
"SIGN PUJOLS OR FIRE WREN" ~ Swo12bv
by Smoltz's Beard on Mar 9, 2010 4:53 PM EST up reply actions
see u always know what im saying…i love that about you
Heyward,Hanson,and Shaffer r ready now!! Why do you think they havent signed the "right handed bat"?
by fatazfoot on Jan 7, 2009 8:59 PM EST
BFF
"SIGN PUJOLS OR FIRE WREN" ~ Swo12bv
by Smoltz's Beard on Mar 9, 2010 5:06 PM EST up reply actions
only if we can get shirts that prove it
Heyward,Hanson,and Shaffer r ready now!! Why do you think they havent signed the "right handed bat"?
by fatazfoot on Jan 7, 2009 8:59 PM EST
my favorite part is that it appears to be a cut of shirt designed for the ladies…which means I’m in
Heyward,Hanson,and Shaffer r ready now!! Why do you think they havent signed the "right handed bat"?
by fatazfoot on Jan 7, 2009 8:59 PM EST
Thought you’d like that.
"SIGN PUJOLS OR FIRE WREN" ~ Swo12bv
by Smoltz's Beard on Mar 9, 2010 5:57 PM EST up reply actions
Excellent work
I really lol’d
"…aren’t worthy enough to hold his (Pujols) ass cheeks apart while Playboy models wipe him with thousand dollar bills after he craps out the cure to whatever previously-incurable disease." by royhobbs 1/7/09
I would bat him second.
The power is there, but I like Glaus at cleanup. With Heyward/Chipper/Glaus hitting 2-3-4, the rest of the lineup is going to see a lot of pitches from the pitcher before having to bat and the pitcher is going to have to exert a lot of energy early in the game.
I'm starting to like him second, too.
I would put Prado leading off then and put McLouth low in the order, who would you have leading off?
The third-base umpire ran into the outfield and retrieved the biggest chunk. "It's a f***in' potato."
by alligatorimpersonator on Mar 9, 2010 4:14 PM EST up reply actions
I don't know who I would bat leadoff.
Prado doesn’t have the patience, McLouth’s average keeps his OBP down and he strikes out too much, but he has some speed. Escobar probably has the best skill set for the job but doesn’t seem to do well hitting leadoff. Diaz gets on base better than most, but doesn’t work the count enough. Honestly, any of them would do, each has strengths and weaknesses at leadoff and the difference between them probably doesn’t amount to much.
Yunel’s got a .799 OPS in the leadoff spot so he’s solid enough (especially the .371 OBP), but yeah he’s much better lower in the order…SSS though.
"SIGN PUJOLS OR FIRE WREN" ~ Swo12bv
by Smoltz's Beard on Mar 9, 2010 4:49 PM EST up reply actions
Why do I think always seemed to struggle in the leadoff spot...
as the stats don’t back that idea up like it does with Kelly Johnson (who’s career numbers are much better in the bottom half of the order vs. the top).
I’ve seen quite a few people make the same assumption, so you’re not alone.
"SIGN PUJOLS OR FIRE WREN" ~ Swo12bv
by Smoltz's Beard on Mar 9, 2010 5:57 PM EST up reply actions
I think people make the assumption...
…because Yunel has said he prefers to hit lower in the order.
You might be right.
"SIGN PUJOLS OR FIRE WREN" ~ Swo12bv
by Smoltz's Beard on Mar 10, 2010 9:19 AM EST up reply actions
Troy Glaus. Troy Glaus. Troy Glaus.
Omar Minaya is my hero!
"I'm not even allowed in Mexico."
by mvhsbball on Mar 9, 2010 3:54 PM EST via mobile reply actions
cavebird makes a good point but, only problem is if mclouth is hitting leadoff that puts two left-handed bats back to back and prado is already a pretty good two hole hitter. I think if Heyward makes the club he’ll hit in the 7th spot behind Escobar and in front of Melky/ Diaz. Depending on how he fares will determine if he moves up in the order.
Come on!!!
Are you guys avoiding the obvious just because you don’t want to jinx the big guy? :)
NOBODY on our roster has anywhere near the power that J-Hey has.
There is a reason that the biggest power hitters have hit 4th for a century now.
Why try to dance around the issue?
I want to hear your projected lineups ASSUMING that J-Hey is batting 4th!!!
(In other words…pretend it is June 1st and the Braves have a 7 game lead in the Division and J-Hey has already blasted 21 dingers!)
I have!
I’m trying to decide which year I need to buy tickets for the induction ceremony: 2035 or 2036.
I think it all depends on whether he breaks camp with the big squad or stays in the minors for a few weeks! LOL
NOBODY on our roster has anywhere near the power that J-Hey has.
Troy Glaus disagrees.
The third-base umpire ran into the outfield and retrieved the biggest chunk. "It's a f***in' potato."
by alligatorimpersonator on Mar 9, 2010 4:15 PM EST up reply actions
No kidding. Glaus is out cleanup hitter.
Omar Minaya is my hero!
"I'm not even allowed in Mexico."
by mvhsbball on Mar 9, 2010 4:28 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
Davis Ross career ISO =215
Eric Hinske career ISO- 184
Cody Johnson career ISO (Minors) = 246 (i think i did that right)
so your point is definitely confirmed (although the Hinske argument is lacking IMHO)
Heyward,Hanson,and Shaffer r ready now!! Why do you think they havent signed the "right handed bat"?
by fatazfoot on Jan 7, 2009 8:59 PM EST
I guess everyone picked up in the Sammons sarcasm I thought somebody was going to run with it
by Quilvio Veras on Mar 9, 2010 5:47 PM EST up reply actions
he hit 9 HR last year…the power is not illusionary
Heyward,Hanson,and Shaffer r ready now!! Why do you think they havent signed the "right handed bat"?
by fatazfoot on Jan 7, 2009 8:59 PM EST
Glaus has a .243 career ISO.
"SIGN PUJOLS OR FIRE WREN" ~ Swo12bv
by Smoltz's Beard on Mar 9, 2010 4:40 PM EST up reply actions
.200+ in every year except 1998 and 2009
"SIGN PUJOLS OR FIRE WREN" ~ Swo12bv
by Smoltz's Beard on Mar 9, 2010 4:51 PM EST up reply actions
yo’u and your new fangled stats
Heyward,Hanson,and Shaffer r ready now!! Why do you think they havent signed the "right handed bat"?
by fatazfoot on Jan 7, 2009 8:59 PM EST
Quiet you.
"SIGN PUJOLS OR FIRE WREN" ~ Swo12bv
by Smoltz's Beard on Mar 9, 2010 4:52 PM EST up reply actions
Not 4th
I can see Heyward batting 2nd, 3rd, 5th or 7th, but not 4th. Glaus was signed specifically for 4th. McCann is pretty well entrenched at 5th. 2nd and 3rd depends on Chippers production and how he feels about giving up his spot. I’d also guess that if he gave up 3rd, it would be his final season. So, to me, 2nd and 7th seem the most likely. If it turns out to be 2nd, I’d assume Prado or Diaz leading off and McLouth moving to 7th.
Glaus
has more power than Jay Hey, at least right now. Let’s not get caught up in a few monster HRs here. I’d be pleased if Heyward hit 20 HRs, but that’d be disappointing from Glaus.
"Yeah, and I have an enchanted jock strap." -- Karl Karlson
This, this, oh god, this!
(That was an E-gasm)
"My team of nine guys who hit like Albert Pujols and never ever bunt just beat your team with one Shane Victorino 472 to 3."
by justincredubil02 on Mar 10, 2010 11:28 AM EST up reply actions
best lineup
http://www.talkingchop.com/2010/3/1/1332374/regularly-platoon-mclouth-diaz-at
sorry I couldn’t help myself…
Why not Heyward 4th?
Chip-Heyward-Glaus-McCann
for a 3-4-5-6…. that is poop your pants scary. Or we could stick heyward 7th and break up our verision of ‘murderers row’. If i’m the mets, phils, red sox, yankees, whoever, looking down that roster, I’m scared of those 4 guys, three or 4 times a game you’d have to fight to get through those guys-espcially since heyward-chipper and glaus all draw a lot of walks. Heyward loses protection at 7th.
2nd
Diaz/ Heyward/ Chipper/ Glaus/ McCann/ Escobar/ McLouth/ Prado isn’t too shabby.
what about...
Heyward/Heyward/Heyward/Heyward/Heyward/Heyward/Heyward/Heyward/Heyward?
Omar Minaya is my hero!
"I'm not even allowed in Mexico."
Heyward+Pujols/Heyward+Pujols/Heyward+Pujols/Heyward+Pujols/Heyward+Pujols/Heyward+Pujols/Heyward+Pujols/Heyward+Pujols/Heyward+Pujols
Both sides of the batters box.
I don't need the Cat Lady to throw cats at me to let me know she's crazy!
by McCann and McWill on Mar 9, 2010 10:39 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
u do realize the phillies wont be scared right
their lineup of Rollins/Victorino/Utley/Howard/Werth/Ibanez > anything we can throw
the Yankees bring Jeter/Granderson/Arod/Texiera/Swisher…they wont exactly be scared either
the Mets will probably shit themselves…
and the Red Sox will laugh because thier defense is so good this year and thier pitching is so ridiculous they might not give up any runs this year
Heyward,Hanson,and Shaffer r ready now!! Why do you think they havent signed the "right handed bat"?
by fatazfoot on Jan 7, 2009 8:59 PM EST
Are we still being funny?
I love the “Heyward is so good…” jokes, but I think this post might be serious. So I think we ought to cool off a little. I mean, dude is going to be awesome (barring injury), but do we really, truly think he is the best hitter on the team right now? Maybe he is, maybe is the LH second-coming of Pujols like Leyland implies. But I think we’re setting ourselves up for disappointment if we expect him to be as good as Chipper, McCann or Escobar right now (or even healthy Glaus and Diaz). I think we need to see him make adjustments to ML pitchers before we ruin anymore pairs of underwear/pants/socks. Just sayin’.
"…aren’t worthy enough to hold his (Pujols) ass cheeks apart while Playboy models wipe him with thousand dollar bills after he craps out the cure to whatever previously-incurable disease." by royhobbs 1/7/09
Escobar is not in the same class as CHipper or McCann just yet…so maybe we should quell those expectations as well
but you’re very right…we need to relax on Heyward…he’s good, but he’s not gonna be an impact player from day one…few have been able to do that (Pujols at an advanced age)
Heyward,Hanson,and Shaffer r ready now!! Why do you think they havent signed the "right handed bat"?
by fatazfoot on Jan 7, 2009 8:59 PM EST
REALLY
We can’t expect him to put up Pujols, ARod, or Howard numbers, but is it that out of the question for him to step in and be an impact player this year for this lineup. Someone may hit for a higher average, more homeruns, more RBIs, but who is going to be that all around bat. Chipper has lost a lot of power, isn’t the player he was 5 years ago, McCann is a .280 to 290 hitter, 22 hrs, Diaz had his best year, but can he repeat. I can honestly say that being the best hitter in this lineup is not out of the question by far. For the Yankee, Red Sox, Phillies probably not, but this is a team without any kind of top hitter.
Chipper hasn’t really lost a lot of power. He hit 18 HRs last year in a season in which he struggled for the majority of the year. He had what, 22 HR the year before?
Chipper is one of those kinds of players who doesn’t try to hit a HR in the large majority of his at bats, yet he still will put up 20-25 in a typical season. Granted, that isn’t the 40 that he once hit…only once…but that is still good power from a selective, situational hitter.
"My team of nine guys who hit like Albert Pujols and never ever bunt just beat your team with one Shane Victorino 472 to 3."
by justincredubil02 on Mar 10, 2010 9:44 AM EST up reply actions
touche
Heyward,Hanson,and Shaffer r ready now!! Why do you think they havent signed the "right handed bat"?
by fatazfoot on Jan 7, 2009 8:59 PM EST
I had been under the same impression...
but when I checked, it wasn’t a valid opinion. Pujols broke in at 21, and for the lasts 9 seasons has been a hitting machine. Then again, he is special. But it does give hope that Heyward can have a more productive season than we saw from Junior Griffey, ARod, Andruw, or other elite prospects at this young age.
im still gonna follow the rule here opposed to the exception
Heyward,Hanson,and Shaffer r ready now!! Why do you think they havent signed the "right handed bat"?
by fatazfoot on Jan 7, 2009 8:59 PM EST
Same here...
but it does give a little hope for better than the ‘rule’ and the unrealistic expectations.
Escobar
was much better than Chipper last year, actually… Just sayin’
"Yeah, and I have an enchanted jock strap." -- Karl Karlson
you are correct sir, but its really close and considering its the worst or second worst season of CHipper’s career i think we can agree offensively Chipper has the better track record
Heyward,Hanson,and Shaffer r ready now!! Why do you think they havent signed the "right handed bat"?
by fatazfoot on Jan 7, 2009 8:59 PM EST
I’m OK with disappointment.
I don't need the Cat Lady to throw cats at me to let me know she's crazy!
by McCann and McWill on Mar 9, 2010 10:41 PM EST up reply actions
Where will he bat next year if Glaus leaves? I think he will hit 4th until Chipper retires. Maybe if Glaus struggles this year then let him have a shot a 4th. I would say he will start off 7th, but if he is doing well, people will start pitching around him is possible with 8 and 9 coming up, and we don’t want the bat taken out of his hands. But, hopefully he will get a lot of atbats with McCann and Escobar on base infront of him.
I just like...
I just like where all of our OTHER hitters fall in the order when we put J-Hey at 4.
Chipper at 3.
Glaus at 5 (protecting J-Hey)
McCann at 6 (that’s a helluva bat to have in the SIX hole!)
Escobar at 7 (again, that’s a very strong 7 hitter)
Melky/Diaz at 8 (EIGHT! Look at the production we could get from the 8 hole!!!)
First real post so don’t go crazy on me.
I like how nobody is factoring in the days Big Heap is not in the lineup. Not focusing in on L-R-L-R scenario or pitching matchup, I would like to see a lineup of Chip/Glaus/J-Hey/Heap/Esco.
Basically flipping Glaus and Heyward. Glaus needs Heyward to give him pitches to hit. (This assumes that Heyward rakes during the season.)
Another reason to have Heyward behind Glaus is so that he can be a table setter for Mac and Esco while still having the ability to produce runs at the 5 spot. Heyward (from what I’ve read on this site) is a good base runner who walks a lot due to great plate discipline. Having those set skills, Heyward can put himself in position for Heap and Esco to produce RBI’s. As we know, Mac and Esco can put the ball in play. Plus I don’t see Mac being upset by hitting 6 spot.
Braves 2005 was the most underrated season.
by romone_braves91 on Mar 10, 2010 10:56 PM EST up reply actions
But would it hurt...
to have j-Hey on base BEHIND a plodder like Glaus?
Glaus has been hitting a lot of singles…and J-Hey gets a ton of walks.
J-Hey can’t go first-to-third on a single if Glaus was on second and had to be held at third. And J-Hey can’t ever steal second to get in scoring position for Glaus if he is hitting BEHIND him!
by HalleyGator on Mar 11, 2010 10:05 AM EST up reply actions
Glaus will be hitting more than singles.
"My team of nine guys who hit like Albert Pujols and never ever bunt just beat your team with one Shane Victorino 472 to 3."
by justincredubil02 on Mar 11, 2010 10:24 AM EST up reply actions
Glaus is not a singles hitter.
But he does get a ton of walks. That all being said, I hope (with reason looking at this lineup) the Braves are clogging the bases with tons of baserunners all season long. That’s the kind of problem I really like to see!
I understand what you are saying but.....
Having Heyward in the 4 spot would create the same problem of log jam as in the 5 spot. Chipper is not getting any younger therefore not going to be blowing ppl away with his speed on the bases. I am not sure but Chipper might be faster than Glaus for all I know.
I just wish there were (there might be I’m not sure) data that would tell fans how much time it take for a player to reach point A to point B in the following scenarios:
1. From Home to First (Meaning after a Hit).
2. While standing on First. First to Second.
3. While standing on First. First to Third.
4. From Home to Second.
5. From First to Home.
6. From Second to Home.
This would help solve or help our debate. Either way, having a log jam problem is a good thing.
Braves 2005 was the most underrated season.
by romone_braves91 on Mar 11, 2010 8:30 PM EST up reply actions
What’s more pleasurable, batting order banter or rosterbation?
Q: If on-base pct is so important then why don't they put it on the scoreboard? -Failcoeur
A: Because the Braves don't want to show their fans how bad you suck.
I came in post-rosterbation era, so I have no frame of reference. But I love monkeying around with the batting order.
What manager John Russell thought when Morton hit J-Hey with a pitch, "Would you mind not shooting at the thermonuclear weapons!"
by I Saw Buzz Beaned on Mar 11, 2010 4:59 PM EST up reply actions
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