Navigation: Jump to content areas:


Pro Quality. Fan Perspective.
Login-facebook
Around SBN: The Gift Of The 2003 Tigers

2010 NL East Fan Projections: IFs

Introduction

Last week, I reviewed FanGraphs' Fan Projections for NL East Starting Pitchers.  According to the fans, the Braves' rotation will be the best in the division--about 2 games better than the Phillies'.  This week, I am going to analyze the fan projections for the Infielders in the division.  I'll be looking at fielding as well as hitting.

The infield is clearly one of the strengths of the NL East, particularly the left side of the infield.  Chase Utley and Hanley Ramirez are without a doubt 2 of the top 5 position players in all of baseball, and Ryan Zimmerman, David Wright, and Jose Reyes aren't far behind.  The division is so strong at shortstop that Yunel Escobar, who has the 6th-highest projected WAR of any SS in baseball, is only the 4th-highest-rated SS in this division (though he's neck-and-neck with Jimmy Rollins).

So who do the fans think has the best Infield in the division?  For the answer to that question, and of course lots of nifty graphs, read on.

Star-divide

The Best Infield in the NL East Will Be...

Unlike the starting rotations in the division, the infields are more or less set for each team; there are a couple position battles, but we pretty much know who will be playing (if not how much they will play).  Even the first couple guys off the bench look fairly set for each team.  I looked at the fan projections for each infielder who is likely to make his team's opening day roster (that means no Logan Morrison for Florida).  For ease of comparison, I limited each team to 6 players for this analysis--a starter at each of the 4 IF positions, plus a backup corner infielder and a backup middle infielder.  If there was more than 1 player at one of the backup positions,  I left out the one with the lower projected WAR*, though this had little effect on the totals.

* WAR (Wins Above Replacement player) combines all aspects of a position player's game--hitting, baserunning, and fielding--which explains why Placido Polanco has nearly the same projected value as Adam Dunn

So, who has the best infield in the division?  I summed up all the WAR values from each team's 6-man infield, and these are the results:

4406771270_2c30373a9f_o_medium

Thanks in large part to Chase Utley's league-leading 8.0 projected WAR, the Phillies come out on top.  The Mets are a distant second, followed closely by the Braves, with the Marlins and Nationals bringing up the rear.  It should be noted, though, that the Nationals' 14 WAR figure is not bad at all (though I'd hate to see their infield without Zimmerman); the NL East is just full of good infields.

The next part of this graph that jumps out at me is the poor bench production that the Phillies and Marlins are projected to get.  This is especially concerning for them because each has so much value tied up in 1 player--an injury to Utley or Ramirez would be devastating.  On the other hand, the Braves have a couple decent bench guys (and no superstars), making the drop-off in case of injury much less severe.

Overall, as with the starting rotation projections, these seem fairly reasonable to me.  I do have some bones to pick with a few of the individual projections (more on them later), but the totals are about right.  I'd probably flip-flop the Braves and Mets, but that's really about it.

I will reiterate my warning from the last post: a lot can change during the season, between injuries, trades, surprise performances, and call-ups.  This is not a prediction; it is only a projection based on how things look right now. I could see any of these teams ending the year with the best infield WAR, particularly if Utley falls short of his monstrous projection.

Below, I examine the projections for each team in more detail.  

Team-by-Team Projections

For each IF in the sample, I list the # of votes cast for that player, plus his projected plate appearances (PA), batting average (AVG), on-base (OBP), slugging (SLG), walk rate (BB%; the percentage of PAs that end in a walk), and strikeout rate (K%; the percentage of at-bats that end in a strikeout).  I also included each player's projected home runs (HR), stolen bases (SB), Ultimate Zone Rating (UZR; a measure of how many runs a player saves/costs his team compared to an average fielder), and WAR.

A few caveats:

  • Remember, there's a lot of wiggle room in these numbers, since they aren't, y'know, real.
  • WAR depends largely on playing time, so check each player's PAs if you think their WAR is a bit low. If that player stays healthier than the fans project, he will eclipse his WAR projection even if he doesn't play any better.  This is particularly applicable to guys like Troy Glaus.  
  • Also, you should keep in mind that the projections with fewer votes are more likely to be outliers than those with more votes, so if a player has fewer than 15 votes, take his projections with a grain of salt.

As with last week, we'll go in alphabetical order by location, starting with the Braves.

Atlanta Braves

  Player Votes PA AVG OBP SLG BB% K% HR SB UZR WAR
1B Troy Glaus   94 515 .259 .351 .462 12.2% 24.6% 22 0  0.3 2.2
2B Martin Prado 112 595 .299 .350 .426   7.4% 12.3% 11 5 -0.1 2.8
SS Yunel Escobar   83 616 .299 .375 .434   9.9% 12.3% 14 6  1.4 4.3
3B Chipper Jones 100 576 .304 .414 .497 16.1% 16.6% 21 5 -4.4 4.5
Corner IF Eric Hinske   28 372 .247 .343 .396 11.8% 25.6% 11 3  0.4 1.1
Middle IF Omar Infante   22 365 .281 .333 .355   7.4% 13.3%   2 5  0.4 0.9

Overall, these numbers imply that the fans think the Braves have added about 3 wins from their infielders (they got roughly 13 WAR from these positions in 2009).  The fans project a loss of about a win from the Kotchman/LaRoche combo to Glaus, and a gain of about two wins by replacing Greg Norton with Eric Hinske.  Most of the rest of the projected gain comes from a projected bounce-back year from Chipper Jones, which makes sense but is hardly a guarantee.  Chipper is definitely the biggest potential source of downside in the Braves infield.

As for upside, there are several places to look... The fans think that Yunel Escobar will do almost exactly what he did last year, which to me seems a bit conservative.  At his age, he could just as easily break out with a 5.5-6.0 WAR season.  I'd project his slugging and HR numbers, in particular, to improve.  Prado is projected to lose almost 40 points of SLG off last year's number; I don't see any reason why that should be the case--he did slug .461 in more limited PAs in 2008, too.  Then there's Glaus.  I think there's a very good chance that this projection understates both his power numbers and his health.  I would project Glaus for 600-ish PAs, about 30 HRs and a SLG near .500 (his career mark is .497).  I can understand the fans' skepticism with Troy, but he's only 33, he is healthy by all accounts, and if he stays healthy, he will definitely hit more than 22 homers--and possibly far more.

As for the defense, all of the UZR projections seem reasonable.  The Braves' entire infield seems average to me with the glove, except for Chipper, who is a bit below average (though Escobar has the potential to be above average).

All in all, my optimistic projection would add about 2 WAR to the fans' projection.  I'd put Escobar at around 5 WAR, Prado at 3.5, and Glaus at 3.0, with the others staying where they are.  Even if I wanted to be pessimistic (especially with Chipper), I don't see how I could project our infield to be worse than last year's.

I combined the projections from the Braves' 6 infielders and compared those numbers to the projected league-average numbers.  The graph below gives you a sense of how the Braves compare to the averages in 5 categories: batting average (AVG), isolated power (ISO; slugging minus batting average), walk rate (BB%), strikeout rate (K%), and UZR*.  

* Well, a modified form of UZR... Since UZR can be negative, and negative numbers mess up the percentages, I converted all the UZRs to positive numbers by finding the difference between a player's UZR and the UZR that the worst projected defender, Brad Hawpe, would put up in the same amount of playing time.  The resulting stat, which I call "UZR Above Brad Hawpe," or "UZR (ABH)", is ridiculous, of course--but it does allow me to convert defensive skill to a % value, so whatever.  To give you an idea of what the numbers look like, the projected league average UZR (ABH) is 18.9 per 600 PAs.  The Braves were slightly below average at 17.5 UZR (ABH).

To read the graph, keep in mind that closer to the center is always worse and closer to the edges is always better.  In other words, the bigger the shaded area, the better.  The percentages given are relative to the league average.  The Braves' infield rates as "+12%" in the K% category--this means that they project to strike out 12% less often that the league average, not 12% more.

4406004851_2d799012a8_o_medium

This graph really gives you a good sense of the Braves' infielders' strengths and weaknesses.  On the down side, they don't hit for great power and they aren't great with the glove (though they aren't terrible in either area).  On the plus side, they hit for a good average, walk a ton, and don't strike out very often.  Add in the fact that there's some upside in the power area--Prado, Escobar, and Glaus could all outslug their projections by quite a bit--and this is a potentially excellent infield.

Florida Marlins

  Player Votes PA AVG OBP SLG BB% K% HR SB UZR WAR
1B Gaby Sanchez   12 453 .271 .344 .434   9.5% 17.1% 14   3  0.5 1.3
2B Dan Uggla 248 649 .255 .357 .478 12.9% 27.1% 30   5 -4.9 3.7
SS Hanley Ramirez 129 684 .324 .400 .546 10.5% 17.3% 29 31 -0.6 7.5
3B Jorge Cantu   33 624 .281 .339 .464   7.5% 16.3% 22   4 -4.5 2.0
Corner IF Wes Helms     7 367 .257 .311 .335   6.5% 24.2%   4   0  0.0 0.1
Middle IF Emilio Bonifacio   20 449 .254 .306 .319   7.1% 21.8%   1 22 -0.9 0.0
Unsigned Hank Blalock*   16 469 .256 .309 .442   6.8% 21.1% 19   3 -0.8 0.6

The Marlins' 1B situation has to be a bit troubling for them.  Supposedly, there is an open competition between Sanchez and hot prospect Logan Morrison to win the job, but I just don't think either is ready to be even an average hitter just yet.  Perhaps that's why the Marlins are rumored to have offered a minor-league deal to Hank Blalock, though really he won't be that much of a help--he'd add about 0.5 WAR compared to Wes Helms.  (I've included Blalock's numbers in the table above for reference, but they were not used in any of the graphs.) Edit: Apparently Blalock has signed with the Rays, so no dice here for the Marlins.  Looks like they'll have to put up with Sanchez until Morrison is ready, whenever that is.

The hitting projections seem right on to me.  I might pick Uggla to do a bit worse and Ramirez to do a bit better, but that's minor.  The biggest discrepancy I see in these numbers is actually Jorge Cantu's UZR figure.  I think the voters must not have considered that he's moving to 3B (where he's terrible) from 1B (where he's actually not bad).  I covered this issue in my Troy Glaus defense post a while back.  Given his age and track record at 3B, I'd project Cantu to put up something more like a -14.5 UZR, not -4.5.  That'd knock a whole win off his WAR mark.

Here's the Marlins' graph:

4406004895_3f72f2f1f8_o_medium

As you can see, this is a fairly average-hitting infield overall.  The Marlins' infielders seem to be willing to sacrifice a few strikeouts for an uptick in power, which is reasonable.  The problem with this infield is that it stinks defensively.  Uggla is bad, and nobody else can really make up for that.  And, of course, their UZR figure is liable to be even worse, thanks to Cantu's aforementioned position switch.  If I were Josh Johnson, I'd be furious about this; it's not out of the realm of possibility that poor infield defense could cost him the Cy Young.

New York Mets

  Player Votes PA AVG OBP SLG BB% K% HR SB UZR WAR
1B Daniel Murphy 131 536 .279 .343 .448   9.1% 14.6% 14   5  1.9 1.6
2B Luis Castillo   77 571 .291 .376 .331 12.1% 11.8%   2 16 -7.3 1.4
SS Jose Reyes   97 666 .292 .361 .341   9.9% 12.0% 13 50  2.3 5.3
3B David Wright 178 675 .311 .398 .515 12.9% 20.6% 24 26  0.7 6.4
Corner IF Fernando Tatis   14 378 .279 .345 .420   7.9% 18.4%   9   5  1.1 1.6
Middle IF Alex Cora   21 271 .256 .327 .344   7.7% 11.6%   2   5 -2.2 0.1
Other Anderson Hernandez   13 244 .261 .314 .345   7.4% 17.3%   2   7 -0.7 0.0

Ah, the Mets.  You've got to love them.  A few stars and a bunch of scrubs.  If their stars stay healthy and play to their potential (like the fans think), their infield will be in decent shape.  But if not, watch out; this could get ugly again.  All of these projections are fine if you assume Reyes and Wright will be back to normal in 2010.  But that seems a bit too optimistic to me, given the Mets' dysfunctionality.  Personally, I would have a hard time projecting Wright to hit 24 HRs a year after hitting 10, or projecting Reyes to get 666 PAs given the questions about his hamstring and his thyroid.  I'd subtract 0.5-1.0 WAR from each of their projections to be safe.

One note about the 1B projection.  Supposedly, the Mets are having an open competition between Murphy and Mike Jacobs (either one will likely split time with Tatis, which makes sense).  Mets fans had better hope that Murphy wins that clash of the titans, for Jacobs is just terrible--a projected -0.7 WAR.  In a well-run organization, Jacobs would be nothing more than catastrophe insurance in case several guys get hurt, so I didn't include him in the table above... But with the Mets, you never know.

The defensive projections seem fine; Castillo is a butcher and the others are decent (though Wright is so inconsistent in the field, he's hard to project).  My only question is whether Murphy is a plus defender.  When I saw him at 1B last year, he looked awful (though that's a small sample, obviously, and he looked even worse in the outfield).

Now for the Mets' infield graph:

4406004931_6425b69555_o_medium

The Mets' graph is a lot like the Braves, except more extreme (in fact, it looks more like a triangle than a pentagon).  They project to hit for less power (and it could be even worse if Wright doesn't get his HR stroke back) but also to strike out less.  Their defense projects to be a bit worse, but their batting average a bit better.  I guess that's what happens when Luis Castillo gets 571 PAs--no power, bad defense, few strikeouts, a decent average, and a lot of walks.

Philadelphia Phillies

  Player Votes PA AVG OBP SLG BB% K% HR SB UZR WAR
1B Ryan Howard 123 669 .271 .358 .571 11.8% 31.7% 46   5   1.3  4.5
2B Chase Utley 170 677 .298 .397 .528 11.4% 17.7% 31 17 12.7  8.0
SS Jimmy Rollins 107 700 .273 .328 .444   7.3% 12.5% 19 35   6.2  4.5
3B Placido Polanco 137 614 .297 .338 .401   5.0%   7.0%   8   5   5.8  2.7
Corner IF Greg Dobbs   13 377 .274 .323 .362   6.9% 17.1%   6   3  -1.6  0.5
Middle IF Juan Castro     7 190 .232 .269 .298   4.7% 19.3%   2   1   3.0 -0.4
Other Ross Gload   11 350 .268 .323 .372   7.1% 12.0%   6   2   0.0  0.0

It's all too easy when looking at the Phillies' numbers to focus on their offense, but I'd like to point out how excellent they are defensively.  All their starters are projected to have positive UZRs, and several are projected to be excellent with the glove, especially Utley.  Based on these projections, the Phillies will add nearly 3 wins compared to the average team with their infield defense alone.  That is, obviously, excellent.

As for the hitting, they have 3 good hitters on the infield and not much else.  Polanco is OK, mainly because his excellent strikeout rate allows him to hit for a good average.  Rollins is probably overrated in general, and particularly in these projections, but he's a good player.  I don't think he's going to be 4.5 WAR good next year--I think last year's suckitude portends a permanent decline--but I'd probably peg him for 3.5 to 4.0 WAR.  Howard's numbers seem about right, though hitters like him tend not to age very well.  As for Utley, well, he's awesome.  I don't doubt that he could, and probably will, put up a roughly 8.0 WAR season.  The only problem is that with that high of a projection, there's really nowhere to go but down.  He could put up an excellent, 6 WAR season and still be a disappointment.  And Phils fans had better pray that he doesn't get hurt, given that their bench guys aren't that great (I guess if that happened, they'd move Polanco to 2B and play Dobbs at 3B, which would be okay for a week or two, but not for longer).

Here's the Phillies' infield graph:

4406004997_ce584a04ce_o_medium

Obviously, the UZR number is out of this world, but I find it interesting that the Phillies manage to hit for a ton of power without striking out that much.  How is that +10% K rate possible with Ryan Howard, you ask?  Well, Rollins and especially Polanco have excellent K rates that more than counteract Howard's poor one.  Rollins and Polanco giveth in K rate, but they taketh away in walk rate.  Clearly, both those guys just really like putting the ball in play.

Washington Nationals

Finally, the Nats.

  Player Votes PA AVG OBP SLG BB% K% HR SB UZR WAR
1B Adam Dunn 98 665 .254 .388 .515 17.6% 31.9% 39   2 -14.8  2.8
2B Adam Kennedy 46 507 .281 .335 .391   7.3% 15.1%   8 13   -1.7  1.3
SS Ian Desmond 19 454 .277 .337 .420   7.7% 18.9% 11 12   -1.6  2.0
3B Ryan Zimmerman 90 676 .293 .364 .512 10.2% 17.5% 29   5  13.7  6.5
Corner IF Mike Morse 11 243 .269 .329 .442   6.6% 26.0%   5   1   -0.6  0.4
Middle IF Christian Guzman 29 571 .288 .318 .388   3.9% 12.4%   6   5   -3.0  1.1
Other Alberto Gonzalez 11 295 .260 .308 .336   6.1% 12.3%   2   4   -2.8 -0.2

According to the fans, the Nationals will roughly split the middle-infield positions between Kennedy, Desmond, and Guzman.  As you can see, giving Guzman the lions share of the PAs is not a wise plan (look at that walk rate--it's downright Frenchian).  I think the wise choice would be to play Desmond full-time at short and let Kennedy and Guzman fight for scraps at 2B.  Desmond is already the best of the 3, and he could be much, much better.

The hitting projections seem about right--I might put Desmond a bit higher, but that's about it.  The fielding projections, too, are reasonable.  It is interesting to note that of the 7 players listed, only 1 has a positive UZR projection.  Though that 1, Ryan Zimmerman, is a gold-glove-caliber guy.  It's also funny how Zimmerman's great glove almost counteracts Dunn's terrible one.  If the Big Donkey can somehow manage to become a mediocre first baseman, the Nats infield defense might not be that bad.  Of course, he's just as likely to put up a -25 UZR as a -5.

Here's the Nats' infield graph: 

4406771496_07749c5622_o_medium

This is an average-hitting infield that stinks defensively.  If Zimmerman gets hurt, though, that will hurt them a lot in both areas.  Any hopes that the Nats have of being respectable this year fall on him.  I think he'll be fine, but I still wouldn't bet on Washington winning more than 75 games no matter what--their pitching is just not good enough.

Wrap-up

The fans at FanGraphs tell us that the Phillies have easily the best infield in the NL East.  On paper, that is certainly true.  In reality, anything might happen.  I think it is likely that some team at least challenges them for infield supremacy this year--I just can't say who it will be.  My guess would be the Braves--I see the most upside there--but then, I might just be a delusional homer.

By the way, here are the WAR standings when you combine the figures from the starting pitchers and the infielders:

Phillies 36.0 WAR
Braves 34.1 WAR
Mets 30.4 WAR
Marlins 30.1 WAR
Nationals 23.8 WAR

Thanks for reading, everyone. I know these posts have been long; hopefully they've been informative. I look forward to hearing your input about how the Braves' infield stacks up to the rest of the division.

Poll
In 2010, which NL East team will have the highest combined WAR from its infielders?
Atlanta Braves
213 votes
Florida Marlins
26 votes
New York Mets
11 votes
Philadelphia Phillies
432 votes
Washington Nationals
4 votes

686 votes | Poll has closed

This FanPost does not express the views or opinions of Talking Chop.

Comment 35 comments  |  7 recs  | 

Do you like this story?

Comments

Display:

Well done again

thanks, i dont see how you can vote for the anybody but the Phills here though, unless you have some insider info about a certain object striking a certain Second Basemen in the future, ala Tanya Harding.

by Don Draper on Mar 6, 2010 4:50 PM EST reply actions  

Haha,

Nope, no inside info. I’d vote for the Phils too.

"Yeah, and I have an enchanted jock strap." -- Karl Karlson

by Jacob Peterson on Mar 7, 2010 9:26 AM EST up reply actions  

Thanks

I really like these posts, very well done. The spiderweb graphs are great.

by bighop on Mar 6, 2010 5:04 PM EST reply actions  

Thanks!

I love the Spiderweb graphs, too.

"Yeah, and I have an enchanted jock strap." -- Karl Karlson

by Jacob Peterson on Mar 7, 2010 9:26 AM EST up reply actions  

Me too. Reminded me of Tempest.

by Lizziebeth on Mar 7, 2010 11:26 PM EST up reply actions  

Awesome job, again.

When you posted the one on SP’s, I was wondering if you would do a series of these. Will you also be covering the OF and bullpens?

And I’d have to agree with the most of the projections, except for Glaus. If he gets that many PA, he’s going to hit at least 25 home runs. It may be the homer in me, but I’m expecting a good year from Glaus, because if he gets hurt or doesn’t produce, his career is essentially over. I think the pressure is on for him to have a big season. I’m expecting a .250/.350/.500 line with 30 home runs.

The third-base umpire ran into the outfield and retrieved the biggest chunk. "It's a f***in' potato."

by alligatorimpersonator on Mar 6, 2010 5:57 PM EST reply actions  

Glaus needs a huge season

Especially because of the 1B in the FA class next year. If he doesn’t produce, he’ll probably be done like you just said.

Omar Minaya is my hero!
"I'm not even allowed in Mexico."

by Scott Coleman on Mar 6, 2010 8:12 PM EST via mobile up reply actions  

I think Glaus is difficult to predict because of the injuries.

However, he certainly has a very good chance to exceed expectations.

by Andy Braves Fan on Mar 6, 2010 11:45 PM EST up reply actions  

Thanks.

I’ll definitely be doing one on the OFs, plus a short one on Catchers… The bullpens are a bit trickier b/c some guys don’t have a lot of votes and it can be hard to predict who’ll make the team, but I’m hoping to take a crack at it too.

As for Glaus, the line you give seems just about right to me.

"Yeah, and I have an enchanted jock strap." -- Karl Karlson

by Jacob Peterson on Mar 7, 2010 9:28 AM EST up reply actions  

Plus I think its just inherently difficult to predict relievers seasons anyway.

by soup du jour on Mar 7, 2010 10:46 AM EST up reply actions  

Right,

Just look at Brad Lidge. One year he’s the best reliever in the NL, the next year he’s the worst. An extreme example, obviously, but there are precious few relievers (especially non-closers) who are reliable and reliably healthy.

I’ll probably put a post up just for completeness, but basically there’s no way of projecting with any certainty, so I’ll have to put an even bigger disclaimer on that one.

"Yeah, and I have an enchanted jock strap." -- Karl Karlson

by Jacob Peterson on Mar 7, 2010 1:32 PM EST up reply actions  

Great stuff. I will disagree and say I don’t think Escobar is going to throw up a 6-WAR season. That’s All-Star level stuff. I think Escobar kind of is what he is (which isn’t a bad thing).

by eaheckman10 on Mar 6, 2010 9:12 PM EST reply actions  

Well,

I don’t think he will, only that he could. I’d say 5-WAR is much more likely, but I am expecting big things.

"Yeah, and I have an enchanted jock strap." -- Karl Karlson

by Jacob Peterson on Mar 7, 2010 9:28 AM EST up reply actions  

damn

that Chase Utley is quite a ballplayer. He really is the key to the Phillies success this year, as much as Halladay is, because that lineup is really not the same at all without him just like the rotation is a mess without Doc.

That is one of the things about the Braves squad that I like. It is no longer the Chipper show.

One last point, if this is a series that you are doing, what is your plan for Catcher? You clearly didn’t include catcher in your infield rankings, which may have changed the numbers quite a bit. I am curious, is catcher going to stand alone?

by Andy Braves Fan on Mar 6, 2010 11:49 PM EST reply actions  

schneider > mccann (better d)

we already know about the catchers.

Omar Minaya is my hero!
"I'm not even allowed in Mexico."

by Scott Coleman on Mar 6, 2010 11:55 PM EST up reply actions  

Interesting you bring that up about catchers...

if catchers were included, the Braves and Philly would be neck and neck. Fans predict McCann to be a 5.4 WAR player and Carlos Ruiz a 2.6 WAR player. If you add that to the IF WAR totals, that puts the Braves infield at 21.2 WAR and the Phillies at 22.4 WAR – only a 1.2 difference.

The third-base umpire ran into the outfield and retrieved the biggest chunk. "It's a f***in' potato."

by alligatorimpersonator on Mar 7, 2010 2:14 AM EST up reply actions  

Yes,

I’ll be doing a separate one on catchers… This post was too big to include them. But, obviously, the Braves have a huge advantage there. Not just McCann over Ruiz, but also Ross over Schneider (haha, take that schneider > mccann guy).

"Yeah, and I have an enchanted jock strap." -- Karl Karlson

by Jacob Peterson on Mar 7, 2010 9:30 AM EST up reply actions  

Anyone who doesn’t vote for the Phillies needs to have their head examined.

"My team of nine guys who hit like Albert Pujols and never ever bunt just beat your team with one Shane Victorino 472 to 3."

by justincredubil02 on Mar 7, 2010 1:33 AM EST reply actions  

Sadly,

This.

Omar Minaya is my hero!
"I'm not even allowed in Mexico."

by Scott Coleman on Mar 7, 2010 2:03 AM EST via mobile up reply actions  

The right side of their infield

Is worth nearly as much as everyone else’s full infield.

by Bronn on Mar 7, 2010 1:16 PM EST up reply actions  

That is just simply amazing. Howard and Utley are two of the best in the game, and it sucks that they play for our biggest competitor.

"My team of nine guys who hit like Albert Pujols and never ever bunt just beat your team with one Shane Victorino 472 to 3."

by justincredubil02 on Mar 7, 2010 4:41 PM EST up reply actions  

Yeah really

it’s like I want to like Chase Utley cuz he’s such a good ballplayer, but I just…can’t.

The third-base umpire ran into the outfield and retrieved the biggest chunk. "It's a f***in' potato."

by alligatorimpersonator on Mar 7, 2010 5:26 PM EST up reply actions  

Personally, I like Utley, Victorino, Werth and Howard a LOT. I would LOVE it if any of them wore the tomahawk at some point during their good years.

"My team of nine guys who hit like Albert Pujols and never ever bunt just beat your team with one Shane Victorino 472 to 3."

by justincredubil02 on Mar 7, 2010 7:03 PM EST up reply actions  

Victorino is a decent player, but he's such a giant douche.

I think the highlight of my season last year was the beer incident in Chicago. It couldn’t have happened to a better guy.

Pinella: Where th f*ck was that pitch at?
Ump: Lou, don't you know that you're not supposed to end a sentence with a preposition?
Pinella: Where the f*ck was that pitch at, a$$h*le?

by Stephen Schmidt on Mar 7, 2010 7:45 PM EST up reply actions  

True

Tho I think he’s one of those guys who is only a D-Bag when he isnt on your team.

"If I have asthma, they won't let me scuba. And if I can’t scuba, then what’s this all been about?? What am I working toward??"

by Doghnut on Mar 7, 2010 8:54 PM EST up reply actions  

I feel this way too. I have no idea why people hate him so much. He is one of the best CFers in the game, and is one of those “true ballplayer” types.

"My team of nine guys who hit like Albert Pujols and never ever bunt just beat your team with one Shane Victorino 472 to 3."

by justincredubil02 on Mar 8, 2010 12:19 AM EST up reply actions  

One incident sums it up for me.

Going out of your way to throw elbows is douchey. People can call it heads up all they want, but the manner in which he executed it was fairly low class.

Pinella: Where th f*ck was that pitch at?
Ump: Lou, don't you know that you're not supposed to end a sentence with a preposition?
Pinella: Where the f*ck was that pitch at, a$$h*le?

by Stephen Schmidt on Mar 8, 2010 12:39 AM EST up reply actions  

A note about the Mets 1st base situation

According to both Omar and Jerry, Ike Davis was going to be given a good look there too, and he’s been far superior to both Jacobs and Murphy so far this spring. Even if he doesn’t break camp with the Mets, theres a good chance he’ll be their primary 1st baseman this season.

Pinella: Where th f*ck was that pitch at?
Ump: Lou, don't you know that you're not supposed to end a sentence with a preposition?
Pinella: Where the f*ck was that pitch at, a$$h*le?

by Stephen Schmidt on Mar 7, 2010 3:31 PM EST reply actions  

Good point

I didn’t include Davis because guys with no MLB experience can’t be projected and so he has no votes. Plus, at the time I started compiling the data, Davis had yet to perform some of his ST feats of strength. He’s obviously the Mets 1B of the future, but I don’t think he’s ready just yet. (Not that that means anything to the Mets brass.) If he makes the team to start the year, you might be looking at a Jordan Schafer-type situation. Well, not that bad. But I think a Murphy/Tatis platoon is better for now.

"Yeah, and I have an enchanted jock strap." -- Karl Karlson

by Jacob Peterson on Mar 8, 2010 10:22 AM EST up reply actions  

Who voted for the Nats and why? lol

But the Phils are clearly number 1 here, but as mentioned before it is solely based on how godly Utley is. Just like the quality of their starting pitching is dependent on Doc. If Utley of Halladay go down, the Phils are screwed.

by MatM on Mar 7, 2010 11:02 PM EST reply actions  

Very true.

People talk about “most valuable” players all the time, but Utley has got to be #1, right? What other 2B does what he does. And given the Phils’ lack of SP depth, losing Halladay would be nearly as bad.

"Yeah, and I have an enchanted jock strap." -- Karl Karlson

by Jacob Peterson on Mar 8, 2010 10:24 AM EST up reply actions  

yeah bc of Utley’s position and his outstanding abilities…he is clearly the MVPNNP (Most Valuable Player Not Named Pujols)

Heyward,Hanson,and Shaffer r ready now!! Why do you think they havent signed the "right handed bat"?

by fatazfoot on Jan 7, 2009 8:59 PM EST

by Swo12bv on Mar 8, 2010 5:42 PM EST up reply actions  

Utley is far superior to Hanley IMHO…maybe going forward that will change…but for reference sake

Utley since 2005 has never posted below a 6.8 WAR, his next lowest was 7.6

Hanley’s last two seasons were just above that at 7.3, and 7.2… his two before that were below 6 (but i dont really count them bc he was so young and still developing)

I dont think Hanley’s defense is gonna get markedly better, and his offesnse can’t get much better..so i predict Hanley as around 7 WAR for the rest of career, until he gets to 3B, where it will probably decrease as he loses the positional boost from playing SS

I realize its a ridiculous argument, bc they are both amazing and I’d much rather have either of them, opposed to the guys we have currently on our team…but i figured i would elucidate my feelings

Heyward,Hanson,and Shaffer r ready now!! Why do you think they havent signed the "right handed bat"?

by fatazfoot on Jan 7, 2009 8:59 PM EST

by Swo12bv on Mar 9, 2010 3:50 PM EST up reply actions  

HanRam

can actually improve. He hasn’t hit his peak yet. Utley will be entering hi 30’s.

by Andy Braves Fan on Mar 12, 2010 10:35 AM EST up reply actions  

Comments For This Post Are Closed


User Tools

Welcome to the SB Nation blog about Atlanta Braves.

FanPosts

Community blog posts and discussion.

Recommended FanPosts

Ncclovebaseball_small
Feb Off Season / Off Topic

Recent FanPosts

Avatar_small
Talking Chop Free Agent Tracker
Small
The Not So Prestigious TC Fantasy Baseball League
Kingsizehomer_small
TC Fantasy Baseball Rd 5
791_small
If the Braves ever left Atlanta
Spo_bs_atlantabraves_1006_small
OT (kindof): 2012 Fantasy Baseball Rankings
0d5f240abb4da413f70e6a7067006f9c_small
upcoming season
Small
2012 Minor league staffs
Small
Baseball > Football. George Carlin explains why
Family_photos_004_small
What to do after Chipper is gone?
Small
Wren and 2010 (that rhymes)

+ New FanPost All FanPosts >


Managers

Gondeee_small gondeee

Editors

Heis3_small Scott Coleman

Sid_small SCrebel10

Authors

My_hair_is_a_bird-257x300_small yondaime4

Dsc01731_small royhobbs

Mccann__brian_small cbwilk

Chris_and_harrison_at_braves_game_small Atlanta_Chris

Avatar_small TonyAlmeyda

12475953_small Jacob Peterson

Prado-walk-off-diamondbacks_small moorebraves

Moderators

Ale0p82caaer6rx_braves_patch_3_small HEYJUDE