Francouer is good...dont give up on him yet
by CornerThug on Jun 19, 2009 9:20 AM EDT
75 comments
Ok. I'm new to this blog thing, but I'm going to jump right in and take a position that apparently goes contrary to EVERYONE on this site.
I like the potential of Frenchy as a player. My main arguement is this: he's still quite young! He's 25 years old and still has to be considered a raw talent. His defense is great and he may have the best RF arm in the game right now. I think his incredibly successful introduction to MLB has been detrimental to his development. Could we really expect to have an Albert Pujols-like hitter?
I've been a Braves fan for all of my 21 years on this planet and I am just as frustrated as the next guy with this abismal hitting performance by the Bravos. However, my ideal strategy would be to give Frenchy more time to improve himself. A season and a half of poor hitting and now we're throwing him under the bus? Lets ride it out this year (unless we can get a Crime Dog type trade with someone who immediately makes us playoff contenders) and go get some big bats in the offseason.
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Contrary to what most think
IMO, his career started rolling downhill even in his “brilliant” rookie season. Yeah, I got caught up in Frenchymania when he had 4 homers in like 10 games, but after July, the strikeouts started rising, and just the vibe of his shining star began to lose its luster. By the time the playoffs rolled around, he was just kind of average, but he had padded his SSS enough to where it still ended the season with an impressive .300/14HR campaign.
2006 was a glimpse at the more true FYF, but with some teams legitimately having not seen him yet still were victimized, which led to his high 29HR/103RBI output, but he struck out a ton. 2007 was definite improvement, and despite the power shortage, he was always coming up with the big hits in that season, which was incredible for him. 2008 to now has been the worst yet.
I’ve been patient with him longer than most here, but I hit my tipping point earlier this year. I like him as a person, but I don’t want him on the Braves in the long term.
No wonder nobody likes you, Tuttle... everything's a (Pujols) damn debate.
by royhobbs on Jun 19, 2009 9:31 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Concerning Frenchy
I have been one of FYF’s biggest supporters on this site since I joined it last year. But I said all along that if he hadn’t turned it around by the All-Star break this year, that it would be time to trade him for a six-pack of Milwaukee’s Best, a bucket of chicken, or whatever else we could get for him… one or two mid-level MI prospects would be nice.
Well, here we are, less than a month away from the ASB… and Frenchy is still stinkin’ up the joint like Parliament playing on Soul Train with the air-conditioning broken. Getting time to cut bait on the man.
by Chopaholic on Jun 19, 2009 9:33 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
trade him for a six-pack of Milwaukee’s Best, a bucket of chicken, or whatever else we could get for him
I think at this point we are talking a .40 of Natty Light and a 4-piece McNugget.
"Actually, Justin was right."
by bigjoe on May 15, 2009 9:04 AM PDT
by justincredubil02 on Jun 19, 2009 9:42 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Not even a 6 piece. Oh, how the mighty have fallen.
by soup du jour on Jun 19, 2009 9:59 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Dibs on one of the nuggets
…Before Eddie Perez gets at ’em.
"...Braves tie! ...Braves tie! ...Braves tie!"
by The Keith Lockhart Era on Jun 19, 2009 12:06 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
mmmm… chicken. It always comes back to the chicken.
by Bmacbandwagon on Jun 19, 2009 11:46 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
A. Welcome to the site, thanks for participating.
B. You’re wrong about Frenchy. His mental approach to hitting and his physical application of that are both flawed, and at least two major league hitting coaches could not correct those things.
by gondeee on Jun 19, 2009 9:35 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
WOW. The rare callout by gondeee on a fanpost. You know he means business.
by yondaime4 on Jun 19, 2009 11:42 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Here's my question to you and those of your ilk?
What would make you think that “just giving it more time” will help? Has it helped so far?
Remember, kids...don't ever let facts get in the way of your argument.
by MichaelProcton on Jun 19, 2009 9:42 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
me and my ilk
It has not helped so far. What I meant was, give him to the end of the year and then send him packing if he hasnt show significant improvement. I dont think that we can get a more productive RF than Frenchy by this trade deadline without giving up too much minor league talent.
by CornerThug on Jun 19, 2009 10:17 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Well
Whether the rest of those of us whom are against Francoeur like it or not, he’s probably going to get the “more time,” that you’re suggesting, unless a trade for another OF occurs, because the team is just completely abhorred to the idea of Diaz or Brandon Jones playing in RF on a regular basis.
No wonder nobody likes you, Tuttle... everything's a (Pujols) damn debate.
by royhobbs on Jun 19, 2009 10:22 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Frenchy has stolen away SEVERAL opposing runs with his arm.
This is truth.
"The future is no place to place your better days." - Dave Matthews ~ RIP Roi
(self-appointed President of Yunel's Cartel~~~)
by Chief Noc-A-Homa on Jun 19, 2009 10:28 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
But how many has he cost us at the plate?
Remember, kids...don't ever let facts get in the way of your argument.
by MichaelProcton on Jun 19, 2009 11:38 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Frenchy has enough inning ending GIDP w/ RISP each month to make up for those runs. And come on, although an assist is hella (hecka) awesome, that’s not what makes a ballplayer.
by traphicg on Jun 19, 2009 12:45 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
this
Remember, kids...don't ever let facts get in the way of your argument.
by MichaelProcton on Jun 19, 2009 1:55 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
or with his glove?
"Actually, Justin was right."
by bigjoe on May 15, 2009 9:04 AM PDT
by justincredubil02 on Jun 19, 2009 2:14 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
lol
Just saying. Jesus. I roll my eyes every time he steps up to the plate as well.
"The future is no place to place your better days." - Dave Matthews ~ RIP Roi
(self-appointed President of Yunel's Cartel~~~)
by Chief Noc-A-Homa on Jun 19, 2009 5:58 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
He's fighting pretty hard to keep his job right now. I'll give him that.
Other than his last string of hits, he’s looked pathetic at the plate though.
"The future is no place to place your better days." - Dave Matthews ~ RIP Roi
(self-appointed President of Yunel's Cartel~~~)
by Chief Noc-A-Homa on Jun 19, 2009 10:23 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
I've got a ~1000 PA sample size that says FRANCOEUR IS NOT GOOD.
Oh, Bobby.
by sdp on Jun 19, 2009 10:31 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
I'm embarrassed to say this but...
your sample size is quite large and impressive…
by rhinoskin on Jun 19, 2009 10:51 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
+1
The New Punchout for Nintendo Wii......get it
by bravesguy311 on Jun 22, 2009 12:52 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Oh man
Welcome to the site dude. While not everyone on the site has given up on Frenchy, you won’t find many who do anymore.
He is still 25, but he has had plenty of time in the bigs to prove himself. The raw talent has always been there, but after 4 years enough is enough. He is not good. It is time to give up.
by Andy Braves Fan on Jun 19, 2009 11:54 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
maybe i'm just an optimist
I bet Frenchy finishes with decent numbers at the end of this year.
I have NO firm support for making this statement, it is merely a gut feeling.
If he finishes poorly, I will wear something incredibly embarrasing to the last Braves home game of the season.
by CornerThug on Jun 19, 2009 12:01 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
For him to finish with decent numbers, he’d have to OPS like 2.000 for the rest of the year. I’m sorry, I was a FYF apologist all the way up until a month and a half ago, but I can’t support him anymore. He’s a nice guy, but he’s a terrible baseball player.
"At least he didn’t nail the bitchy fat girl from Hell's Kitchen."
www.dropoutproductions.com
by cbwilk on Jun 19, 2009 12:08 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
and since when did u start referencing stats and numbers in ur posts… i feel confused
Heyward,Hanson,and Shaffer r ready now!! Why do you think they havent signed the "right handed bat"?
by fatazfoot on Jan 7, 2009 8:59 PM EST
by Swo12bv on Jun 19, 2009 11:29 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I’ve been rolling like this for a while. You gotta come correct around here. Seriously though, OPS is the shit, it’s a stat that pretty much says all the important stuff a player can do.
"At least he didn’t nail the bitchy fat girl from Hell's Kitchen."
www.dropoutproductions.com
by cbwilk on Jun 20, 2009 3:59 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
If he goes .280/15/50 the rest of the season...
I feel like that would be a huge success for him. Ain’t saying it’s gonna happen, but I think that would be a basic benchmark for second half success. When you drive the bar down so low, bringing yourself back to a Michael Tucker-level of offensive production actually seems a bit impressive.
"...Braves tie! ...Braves tie! ...Braves tie!"
by The Keith Lockhart Era on Jun 19, 2009 12:14 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Well no shit, 15 HRs and 50 RBI over the course of 90 some games would be successful for 75% of the MLB…maybe more. But as you said, it’s not going to happen. He has 15 HR in his last 219 games…you have to be realistic here.
by Smoltz's Beard on Jun 19, 2009 12:22 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
If he goes 15/50 from here out, I we would win the division
by dlkinser86 on Jun 20, 2009 10:05 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
michael tucker, good ole days. lol
"A Tar Heel Born and a Tar Heel bred, and when i die ill be a Tar Heel dead."
by mad_dog_maddux on Jun 19, 2009 12:22 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
man I miss Michael Tucker. I miss Jermaine Dye more.
by yondaime4 on Jun 19, 2009 11:44 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
MIchael Tucker is a dick.
"At least he didn’t nail the bitchy fat girl from Hell's Kitchen."
www.dropoutproductions.com
by cbwilk on Jun 20, 2009 3:59 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
ok, doesn’t change whether or not i thought he was a better player than the OFs we have now. I’ve never met the guy so it doesn’t really matter to me.
by yondaime4 on Jun 20, 2009 11:25 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
At this point, I'd take Chris Tucker in right field.
by Bronn on Jun 20, 2009 11:08 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
You reckon’ ? We’d probably be looking pretty good right now if we still had DYE . I miss the guy too .
by princecharming on Jun 20, 2009 11:36 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Flailing or no, you still gotta root for the guy...
As long as he puts on that Braves cap, I’m gonna root for him. He’s like 7 for his last 22, which while not Ruthian is an improvement. The main thing that worries me is that I’m really not seeing any power in his swing. His warning-track flyout in Cincy yesterday looked like he got all of it, and it wouldn’t even go out of that bandbox. His doubles power seems to be turning into choppy singles power and I’m fairly certain he still has a lower slugging percentage than Bobby Dews.
"...Braves tie! ...Braves tie! ...Braves tie!"
by The Keith Lockhart Era on Jun 19, 2009 12:10 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Yeah, but it was ALMOST A HOME RUN!
Micah Owings was SO scared!
Remember, kids...don't ever let facts get in the way of your argument.
by MichaelProcton on Jun 19, 2009 12:43 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Cheering for or against him isnt the issue
none of us hope he fails. I am amazed at how often people think this. We all WANT him to hit a HR every at-bat. We hate it when he strikes out or GIDPs.
The problem is that we have come to expect him to fail. We don’t hope for it or cheer when it happens (as evidenced his Moniker), but we all know that it probably will happen.
Right now, anything positive in terms of contribution from Frenchy is a bonus.
"Actually, Justin was right."
by bigjoe on May 15, 2009 9:04 AM PDT
by justincredubil02 on Jun 19, 2009 3:52 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Ha...I cheer some times.
If only because it proves me right to whatever idiot that was trying to argue with me about the guy’s merits.
Remember, kids...don't ever let facts get in the way of your argument.
by MichaelProcton on Jun 19, 2009 4:34 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Well put
Nobody wants Frenchy to fail… He just does. It sucks.
by Andy Braves Fan on Jun 19, 2009 4:43 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
If FYF could just figure out how to play 81 games a year in a phone booth he might...
Lead the league in doubles.
"...Braves tie! ...Braves tie! ...Braves tie!"
by The Keith Lockhart Era on Jun 19, 2009 1:30 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
yeah i was continuely on Frenchy side in the past hell even in the offseason i said give him another chance he is ONLY 25. Its apparent that he is either done or just needs a new change of scenery i figure he is done though. Unless some other Hitting coach can get him on track which i guess is a possibility but its obvious he is done with the Braves. Maybe we can at least get a solid spec for him from a Gm that thinks their hitting coach can fix him but im not even countin on a solid spec for him. This guy has changed his stance, changed all kinds of stuff. And before he is completely done with baseball he will prolly change his stance even more. Its over for him.
braves#1
by rockybull on Jun 19, 2009 1:47 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Another hitting coach (one of the best in the league) gave it his best shot...
And we’re at the same place we were.
Remember, kids...don't ever let facts get in the way of your argument.
by MichaelProcton on Jun 19, 2009 1:56 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah, and that other hitting coach called Francouer up recently and cussed him out for forgetting everything he taught him.
"Ohhhh Shit."-Bobby Cox, 3/28/09
by 10-4 on Jun 19, 2009 3:39 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
But that's on Jeffrey, right?
Remember, kids...don't ever let facts get in the way of your argument.
by MichaelProcton on Jun 19, 2009 4:35 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
right.
"Ohhhh Shit."-Bobby Cox, 3/28/09
by 10-4 on Jun 19, 2009 10:14 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
From the Jayson Starke chat today
Ryan (Buckhead)
Braves have a somewhat surplus of pitching right now. Why not throw Chris Medlin and Francoeur Billy Beane’s way for Holliday? If Wren doesn’t get another bat, a good one, Braves aren’t making the playoffs.
Jayson Stark
Here’s the hangup there: Francoeur has no value right now, the way he’s playing. And he isn’t exactly a Moneyball kind of guy. Do you really see Billy Beane trading for a hitter who swings at every pitch he sees?
LOL…we have Rosterbation and a smack-down of FYF in the same question. I love it.
"Actually, Justin was right."
by bigjoe on May 15, 2009 9:04 AM PDT
by justincredubil02 on Jun 19, 2009 4:10 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
I’m amazed Stark dignified that with a response.
by Smoltz's Beard on Jun 19, 2009 4:28 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
At least he spelled Francoeur correctly.
by Sparhawk on Jun 19, 2009 5:11 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I don’t see how so many people mess up Medlen into ‘Medlin’. If you ever seen his name in type, ‘Medlin’ just looks wrong.
by soup du jour on Jun 19, 2009 5:41 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I just don’t get how you can read six letter name and spell it wrong later.
I mean it’s only six letters it’s not that difficult.
Q: If on-base pct is so important then why don't they put it on the scoreboard? -Failcoeur
A: Because the Braves don't want to show their fans how bad you suck.
by timmy3 on Jun 21, 2009 3:24 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
The question isn't necessarily whether or not Frenchy is "good"...
The bigger question is whether or not Frenchy is worth the $5M he will get in arbitration next year. The Braves can’t wait forever for Frenchy to “develop” at that price.
"I've never complained about it. I'm thankful to have a jersey." Mark DeRosa, 22 Aug 2007
by DeRoMyHero on Jun 19, 2009 5:45 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
does he really get 5M next year?… he got mid 3s this past offseason becuase he had that decnet RBI and avg from 07 hangin out there… this offseason he will have 08 where he was the worst OF in baseball and 09 where he wasnt significantly better (maybe in some ways worse)… I would expect a decline in his arb nbr…. but that presupposes he goes to arb if he was smart he would take any numebr the braves throw his way (although presumably he would miss whatever they threw)
Heyward,Hanson,and Shaffer r ready now!! Why do you think they havent signed the "right handed bat"?
by fatazfoot on Jan 7, 2009 8:59 PM EST
by Swo12bv on Jun 19, 2009 11:34 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I don't recall a player ever going to arb and ending up with a pay cut.
He might not get $5 mil, but I bet he could get $4 without an argument just because of the added year of service time. If he doesn’t really show signs, I don’t think we could possibly do anything but non-tender him.
Remember, kids...don't ever let facts get in the way of your argument.
by MichaelProcton on Jun 20, 2009 2:47 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think the minimum increase he can get is 15%, which would put him at 3.88 mil
by bigjoe on Jun 20, 2009 12:48 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I’d riot.
Q: If on-base pct is so important then why don't they put it on the scoreboard? -Failcoeur
A: Because the Braves don't want to show their fans how bad you suck.
by timmy3 on Jun 21, 2009 3:25 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
If he’s suppose to get that much in arbitration , wouldn’t it make just that much more sense to go ahead and put him in a deal somehow just so we don’t have to pay that much to someone who clearly doesn’t deserve it ?
by princecharming on Jun 20, 2009 11:49 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Doesn't matter if nobody wants him...
And we can always non-tender him if we hang on to him and he’s still worthless by the end of the season.
Remember, kids...don't ever let facts get in the way of your argument.
by MichaelProcton on Jun 21, 2009 12:20 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
The only thing that would save Failcoeur is a complete breakdown and remaking of his entire stance and swing mechanics….and it’s probably already too late for that.
by ronniemac03 on Jun 20, 2009 11:16 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Actually, they tried.
Remember, kids...don't ever let facts get in the way of your argument.
by MichaelProcton on Jun 20, 2009 1:02 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
And .248 – 4 – 30 – .284 – .337 is the best that he can give?
Yeah, this will be his last in an ATL uni….you can’t waste anymore cash on that lack of production.
by ronniemac03 on Jun 20, 2009 6:58 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Epic Failcoeur.
To this whole thread.
Q: If on-base pct is so important then why don't they put it on the scoreboard? -Failcoeur
A: Because the Braves don't want to show their fans how bad you suck.
by timmy3 on Jun 21, 2009 3:23 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
In Soccer they have "loans"
How about this script…we “loan” him out to a Japanese team…where a Zen master in hitting fixes his “Hole” he meets a pretty……sorry just had a flash back…LOL Instead of calling it Mr Baseball ….what would we call this re-make?? Mr Failbrave?
by bravestatoo on Jun 21, 2009 1:52 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
I mean, we could sell his contract off to a Japanese team...
It’s certainly happened before. Chris Resop, anybody?
Remember, kids...don't ever let facts get in the way of your argument.
by MichaelProcton on Jun 21, 2009 3:29 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
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