Game 33 Recap: Braves 3, Mets 4
by gondeee on May 13, 2009 8:28 AM EDT
in Braves Game Recaps
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PrintNerds! That was a sucky game... just plain sucky. We really pissed it away. Should Jurrjens have been sent out there for the eighth inning? Should the Braves have argued more forcefully about a blown stolen base call at third base? Should Jeff Bennett impole one more time with two outs can we flog him? These kinds of games really hurt -- add too many of them up in the loss column and the season might as well be over. The Braves just have to avoid these types of games in the future, really avoid them, I don't know if my heart can stand any more.
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dos hombres
Yeah, that’s kinda what I was thinking (about JJ in the 8th). I thought pairing of Soriano and Gonzo in the last two frames has been somewhat effective this year… but maybe I missed something? Still, even with the two runs, we had a chance to win it. I really don’t like blown saves.
So, what do you do when your closer doesn’t close?
Soriano had pitched 3 days in row. He needed a day off. He’s not Blaine Boyer ya know.
"Ohhhh Shit."-Bobby Cox, 3/28/09
Bennett was so much better last year. He couldn't find the strike zone to save his life...
so of course the ump isn’t going to give him that close call.
"The future is no place to place your better days." - Dave Matthews ~ RIP Roi
by Chief Noc-A-Homa on May 13, 2009 12:37 PM EDT up reply actions
1. Jurrjens should have been pulled after 1st baserunner allowed in 8th
2. Arguing calls doesn’t get them changed, even if they are awful
3. Doesn’t help
4. These games are going to happen, unless you are the Phillies and Brad Lidge last year and get crazy lucky. The real key is how does the team respond TODAY. If there was ever a time for the good JoJo to show, it is today. Not holding my breath, however.
Finally, even if we lose today, we finish up 5-5 against the division in the last 10, 3.5 games out of first. That’s not bad — certainly not worth selling your season tickets over.
on #2
Why is it out of the question for MLB to initiate a “challenge” system, where each manager is aloud to challenge one call per game? Do the umps really think they are right 100% of the time? And if so, then the Bravos are fucked for life. Because umps never give us close calls (in the big picture)
"The future is no place to place your better days." - Dave Matthews ~ RIP Roi
by Chief Noc-A-Homa on May 13, 2009 12:34 PM EDT up reply actions
Reason Why Smoltz's Beard Was Right: Game 33 Edition
Sure, it’s easy to blame Jeff Bennett. Maybe it’s even downright fun for some of you. But lets try to take a step back and find out the real reasons why we lost that game.
1. Kelly Johnson, 0-5 2 LOB
2. Jeff Francouer, 0-5 7 LOB
3. Jurrjens had no business staying in to face Reyes. Bennett should have been brought in then. Bobby Cox fail.
4. Gonzalez should have put Tatis away on the 0-2 pitch…instead he hits him. Then he follows it up by leaving a ball up in the zone for Luis Castillo to hit a sac fly. Awful (And before we start bitching about the leadoff 2B to Beltran…that was a great pitch, we just have to tip our hat to him for roping it down the line).
5. Chipper stealing 2B. What’s the point? You knew they were going to walk McCann with 1B opened up. Even with as hot as Casey has been hitting, I would have much rather had McCann in the batters box (I realize they could have pitched around Heap regardless, but that at least gives the pitcher a chance to make a mistake).
6. INTENTIONALLY WALKING ALEX FUCKING CORA WITH 2 OUTS. The guy has a career .315 OBP and .349 SLG. Why? This makes no damn sense? To make Manuel use his last bench player? To get K-Rod out of the game? No…you let Bennett make a pitch. If Cora beats you, that really sucks…but allowing him to reach base for free makes no sense. The more runners on base, the better chance you have of scoring…this is not rocket science. Bobby Cox fail.
Yes…Bennett was the statistical loser of the game. Yes…he happened to throw the final pitch, which was a ball. Yes…it is completely inexcusable to walk in a run. Yes…he should have thrown it right down the middle, even if it resulted in a grand slam. But Bennett has routinely been put in a position to fail all season, and last night was no different.
And complaining about the botched call at 3B on Beltran’s steal isn’t going to change anything. Reyes was safe on his triple attempt but the call went our way that time. Had he actually been called safe you never know how the remainder of the inning might have gone.
Also…to echo fphjr01 up above…if we pull ourselves together and get a win tonight we have a chance to go 6-2 on the roadtrip, which includes series victories against the Marlins, Phillies, and Mets. Last I checked, we hate those teams. Let’s get behind our boys and win this one tonight.
by Smoltz's Beard on May 13, 2009 9:53 AM EDT up reply actions
Just in case you meant to type “tonight” twice, I don’t want you to miss out.
Today’s game starts at 12:30.
Damn…good call, I was on a roll and forgot. Although I think it’s actually 1:10
by Smoltz's Beard on May 13, 2009 10:22 AM EDT up reply actions
All of this is correct
And despite the outcome of the game, I’m not miserably pissed about it. No, not because I don’t care, but because there’s nothing more that can be done at this point, no matter what, the umps, Bennett, the LOBs, whatnot, there’s no turning back the clock, and all we can do is move on. Besides, with the amount of people already pissed off and claiming that they’re going to start taking lives or vandalize things, I feel kind of calm, like a Hindu cow.
Think about it – it’s not like the Braves lost to a bad team. The Braves lost to:
• Bobby Cox
• 3B ump Greg Gibson, and HP ump Andy Fletcher, requiring us to earn four outs in the 9th
• Bobby Cox
• Carlos Beltrán, who some might not like to admit it, is a really, really good player. Better to lose to guy of his caliber than like losing to the Nationals 10-1 with Pete Orr hitting a cycle off our ace pitcher.
I’m not going to suggest everyone to relax, it’s beyond cliché and because nobody wants to hear that. But the fact that the Braves have put together such a fine road trip is being lost in the midst of one crappy loss. It’s not like it’s going to be the one loss that prevents the Braves from going 162-0 or something.
Today’s going to be a good day, hopefully. Jo-Jo Reyes should realize the vast outfield of Dominos Pizza Field is on his side, and hopefully have a good outing and continue to pound the strike zone.
No wonder nobody likes you, Tuttle... everything's a (Pujols) damn debate.
Also, I agree with all of your points and don’t hate Bennett as much as most people around here do.
Intentionally walking Alex Cora with two outs is unbelievable. I really have no idea what Bobby was thinking. His bullpen management left something to be desired last night. Bringing in Moylan to face one hitter, who is left handed, while your LOOGY is warmed up and ready? Then, after he walks that one batter, you bring in your LOOGY to face a switch hitter? You just burned two valuable bullpen arms in a very close game. Moylan should have been the guy starting the 10th inning, not Bennett.
But, why the crap do you intentionally walk Alex Cora with Ramon Castro and CARLOS BELTRAN waiting to hit right after him. EPIC FAIL.
I wonder how many people from Amazin’ Avenue are lurking around here today, feeling the satisfied satisfaction of watching the opposition’s fans grinding over their manager’s inability to manage a late-game scenario instead of their own.
Perhaps bigjoe should debut his authoring with a post entitled “Sorry, I just can’t let go of intentionally walking Alex Cora.”
No wonder nobody likes you, Tuttle... everything's a (Pujols) damn debate.
I’m trying to decide which is worse, letting Feliciano pitch to Diaz or intentionally walking Alex Cora?
This argument has so much depth is amazing.
On the surface, both resulted in their teams losing, but Cora walking didn’t directly impact the outcome as Feliciano pitching to Diaz did.
I’d say Feliciano pitching to Diaz was worse, but barely.
No wonder nobody likes you, Tuttle... everything's a (Pujols) damn debate.
I just find it funny since Monday I was so thankful that Cox was my manager instead of Manuel, and then he turns around and makes a huge bonehead move. I thought he was making so much progress. Such is baseball.
by Smoltz's Beard on May 13, 2009 10:50 AM EDT up reply actions
The mere fact that Manual said he was more afraid of bringing in a righty and having Bobby pitch hit with GA than having Diaz face Feliciano makes it much, much worse.
There's lots of blame to go around for last night's loss.
Some may think I have a hardon to blame Bennett too much, I don’t feel the loss is entirely his (per the great points by others above) but his stats are not comforting.
Per the Braves site this morning on the game recap:
“Jeff Bennett, who entered the game with a 1.98 ERA despite allowing opponents a .448 on-base percentage”
It’s one thing to come in with men already on base and not always get out of it, but to allow the opponents an OBP of .448 once you’re there is not good.
If they’re not on base, they’re less likely to score.
I’m hopeful for today’s game.
I want to leave New York with a series win in our pocket and wipe the awful taste of last night’s loss out of our mouths.
I don’t want to argue with you anymore…but please try and understand that the .448 OBP is inflated quite a bit because of hits like the one Reyes got last night…infield singles, bloop hits, etc. He’s walking way too many people, no doubt. His LD% is really high, no doubt. But some of the hits he has given up are really fluky, he’s also striking out batters at a pretty high rate, and his ground ball tendencies are pretty damn good.
I think he would be a much better pitched if Cox would actually give him a chance to succeed. It must suck to constantly be used in a mop up roll…
by Smoltz's Beard on May 13, 2009 10:33 AM EDT up reply actions
Were we arguing?
SB, I must say you are a very patient and understanding fellow when it comes to Bennett, and I admire your support for him. I’m simply not on the Bennett bandwagon just yet.
I hope his stats (justified or not) improve. After all, he IS a Brave and I want us to do good.
I dunno…I feel like last night in the game thread I was losing my mind and you might have received the brunt of it. If so I apologize.
by Smoltz's Beard on May 13, 2009 10:51 AM EDT up reply actions
Resting, as any hard-throwing relief pitcher should be doing after three-straight days of pitching.
No wonder nobody likes you, Tuttle... everything's a (Pujols) damn debate.
Can we call the outfield a failure already and find some replacements? I’m thinking:
- release Anderson
- sign Edmonds to a minor league deal and if he looks good at Gwinnet swap him with Schafer
- trade Francoeur + Morton or Reyes + whatever low minor league prospect they like to Chicago for Dye
- call up Brandon Jones to platoon with Diaz in LF
Because god knows, we just got a windfall of 8 million to pay for Dye this year.
"If on-base percentage is so important, then why don't they put it up on the scoreboard?"
President, CEO, and chairman of the Brandon Jones fan club. PLEASE COME BACK! PLEASE COME BACK! PLEASE COME BACK!
I don't know the answer
But I thought the team doing the cutting was still on the hook for most of the salary, and if the player gets picked up somewhere else, then a portion of it is covered by them. Kind of like Andruw Jones being paid by the Dodgers for the next 4-5 years while the Rangers only have to pay him league minimum in the meantime.
The most important aspect of cutting a player, is the all-important roster spot that is now open for either a new acquisition, or the call-up of a promising young talent. You can’t always put a price tag on getting a glimpse of the future.
No wonder nobody likes you, Tuttle... everything's a (Pujols) damn debate.
And of course, I completely forgot about the immense salary of Morton & Reyes cmoing off the books
"If on-base percentage is so important, then why don't they put it up on the scoreboard?"
President, CEO, and chairman of the Brandon Jones fan club. PLEASE COME BACK! PLEASE COME BACK! PLEASE COME BACK!
Outfield is a problem, but
there aren’t a lot of good options to pursue to fix it. If you take a look at FA outfielders for 2010, and subtract career backups and guys who are old / suck, you end up with:
Ankiel, Jason Bay, Mike Cameron, Holliday, Andruw Jones, Xavier Nady
Ankiel — obtainable, but plays CF, we would have to move people from their natural positions
Bay — probably resigned by BoSox, and if not will probably be $15M+ player
Mike Cameron — available, but again a CF, and isn’t all that great
Holliday — Boras client so think near-Texiera money, Yankees will have Matsui and Damon’s salary freed up to throw at him
A Jones — do we really want him back?
X Nady — coming off TJ surgery, so he will be more obtainable but riskier
So there you have it. The other options is to pursue someone via a trade, and that means giving up more prospects. We have some pitching surplus, but you have to give up something good to get something good — in other words JoJo / Morton / etc aren’t bringing in top talent for the position.
Plus, we alos got fucked when the umps called "fan interference"....
when McCann’s whopper really just hit the railing and bounced back down to the field. That should have gotten us in another run, and when that didn’t happen…..my stomach turned. The Braves don’t have the best track record in extra innings.
"The future is no place to place your better days." - Dave Matthews ~ RIP Roi
by Chief Noc-A-Homa on May 13, 2009 12:36 PM EDT reply actions
Oh, I didn't. Those umps gave the Mets every benefit of the doubt
(which is expected, but still….I can stay pissed about it)
"The future is no place to place your better days." - Dave Matthews ~ RIP Roi
by Chief Noc-A-Homa on May 13, 2009 12:40 PM EDT up reply actions
It still hit the railing above the orange line, so i think thats still a ground rule double.
"Ohhhh Shit."-Bobby Cox, 3/28/09
Deep breath, everything will be alright.
People will come Ray. The one constant through all the years, Ray, has been baseball. America has rolled by like an army of steamrollers. It has been erased like a blackboard, rebuilt and erased again. But baseball has marked the time. This field, this game: it's a part of our past, Ray. It reminds of us of all that once was good and it could be again.
(hopefully) +1
It just infuriates me that arguing umps missing calls is a moot point, in itself. It shouldn’t be like that, especailly when you’ve got 10-11 Northern teams vs Us. All those umps know what the fuck they’re doing…..sort of. They cost us another Series in ’96….or ’99. One of the two.
"The future is no place to place your better days." - Dave Matthews ~ RIP Roi
by Chief Noc-A-Homa on May 13, 2009 12:54 PM EDT up reply actions
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