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Projections for Jeff Francoeur (FYF)

Plenty has been said this offseason about Jeff Francoeur.  Some good, but the overwhelming majority has been bad.  However, to my knowledge no one has yet done a post to specifically gauge projections for the 2009 season.  Will he be closer to the 2007 form when he hit .293/.338/.444 with 105 RBI's or his submarine season last year when he dropped to .239/.294/.359 with only 71 RBI's?

Let me just say that I completely understand that there are certain people that will take this as an opportunity to complain about how this has been talked about too much and this is a stupid post.  So to those of you I say please at least try not to send this into a downward spiral of off topic complaints that kills the post.  I have a genuine interest in seeing what other fans expect to see out of Frenchy.  He is an anomaly in that he had been so successful throughout his days playing baseball and last year he fell on his face. 

Obviously his inability to avoid pitches down and away led to the beginning of the slump that only got worse as his confidence dwindled and our confidence in him did the same.  But I have a hard time believing that an athlete that was so successful for so long before that could just forget how to play.  I am confident that he will win back the Braves fans this year and have a respectable season, although maybe not as productive as years past.

My Line on Francoeur for 2009:   BA: .277  RBI: 84  HR: 21

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70 runs, 25 doubles, 15 GIDP, 62 balls played off wall while playing RF, 15,000 autographs signed, 5 triples, 1 bunt, 0 IBB.

by drdonkeypunch on Feb 23, 2009 1:57 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

15,000 seems low.

www.dropoutproductions.com

by cbwilk on Feb 23, 2009 2:44 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

does the 1 bunt include any broken bones?

by chance13ga on Feb 23, 2009 3:05 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

15 GIDP?

FYF could do that in one series

by traphicg on Feb 23, 2009 5:17 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Come on now, he didn’t even lead the team last year.

SWAGGA LIKE BJONES, SWAGGA LIKE BJONES

by bigjoe on Feb 23, 2009 5:25 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

is hell frozen or did BigJoe just stick up for FYF

Heyward,Hanson,and Shaffer r ready now!! Why do you think they havent signed the "right handed bat"?

by fatazfoot on Jan 7, 2009 8:59 PM EST

by Swo12bv on Feb 24, 2009 12:37 AM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Great example of why people who hate bigjoe just don’t get it. He sticks up for logic.

www.dropoutproductions.com

by cbwilk on Feb 24, 2009 12:48 AM EST up reply actions   2 recs

green

No wonder nobody likes you, Tuttle... everything's a (Pujols) damn debate.

by royhobbs on Feb 24, 2009 8:50 AM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Escobar, 24
Francoeur, 18
Baby Jesus, 17

No wonder nobody likes you, Tuttle... everything's a (Pujols) damn debate.

by royhobbs on Feb 24, 2009 10:29 AM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Wow

Would’ve never guessed Esco. Thanks.

by WienerDog on Feb 24, 2009 10:33 AM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Escobar...

was the perfect recipe for GIDP’s last year. He was second in the majors (only too Derek Jeter) in groundball percentage, at 58.2%; hitting more balls on the ground than even Ichiro… Add to that that he is a slow baserunner coming out of the righty batter’s box, and he spent a good portion of the year batting second in the lineup.

He could wind up being the deity of GIDP if he keeps this up over a long career.

Tommy Hanson 4 ROY

by timmy3 on Feb 24, 2009 3:38 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

I'm too lazy to look it up

Just out of curiosity, how many did Jeter have?

"Break's over"

by VegasAces on Feb 24, 2009 3:48 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Jeter had 24 GIDPs.

Jeter bearly beat out Esco for the GB% crown.

Jeter was at .58285
Esco was at .58202

One additional grounder and Esco would have held the title.

Tommy Hanson 4 ROY

by timmy3 on Feb 24, 2009 4:01 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

So now...

do we call it an Esco, instead of a Vidro?

best defensive shortstop in baseball hahahahahahahahahah (omar visquel)

by mvandonsel on Feb 24, 2009 4:05 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

If he keeps killing worms the way he did last year, it’ll probably be appropriate.

Even though he’s a shortstop, he’s not exactly fleet-of-foot, and that extra step out of the righty box kills him.

Tommy Hanson 4 ROY

by timmy3 on Feb 24, 2009 4:08 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

I'd really hate to change the vernacular

But if you want to get granular, it could very well also be a “Tejada.”

No wonder nobody likes you, Tuttle... everything's a (Pujols) damn debate.

by royhobbs on Feb 24, 2009 4:10 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

I thought we called them

A Joneses?

"Success is not final. Failure is not fatal. It is the courage to continue that counts." - Sir Winston Churchill -

by justincredubil02 on Feb 24, 2009 4:24 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

You really haven’t been around too long. Its been a Vidro for as long as I can remember.

SWAGGA LIKE BJONES, SWAGGA LIKE BJONES

by bigjoe on Feb 25, 2009 12:26 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Vidros…

best defensive shortstop in baseball hahahahahahahahahah (omar visquel)

by mvandonsel on Feb 25, 2009 2:00 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

I think gondee arranged a projection ...

I imagine it’ll be forthcoming.

But if you want a completely arbitrary guess at how he’ll do, I say: .274/.300/.378 with 21 HRs and 87 RBIs.

"He's getting better, but he's not there yet ..."
- Bobby Cox (talking about Boyer)

by FrankyWren on Feb 23, 2009 2:24 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

A .378 SLG with 21 HRs?

That would be pretty hard to do…

by get swoll yunel on Feb 23, 2009 3:31 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Yeah ...

I probably should have gone .050 to .75ish higher.

"He's getting better, but he's not there yet ..."
- Bobby Cox (talking about Boyer)

by FrankyWren on Feb 23, 2009 3:37 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

I don't know about this year but

I’ll make a not-so-bold prediction and say that he will not be in ATL next year

by RehabReject on Feb 23, 2009 2:41 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

If he DOES have a turn-around year

would he be asking for $10M during his next offseason?

"Success is not final. Failure is not fatal. It is the courage to continue that counts." - Sir Winston Churchill -

by justincredubil02 on Feb 23, 2009 2:43 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

I personally think that he is to hard to predict. He can go from having to good seasons in 2006 and 2007 and then have one terrible season in 2008. He could just as easily have a good season in 2009 or have another bad season. I don’t think he will be as bad as last year but there are about a thousand different ways his season could go.

I’m with rebab I think that even if he does have somewhat of a bounce back year I still think we should trade him. By his 3rd year of arbitration his salary is going to be around $10 million and I really don’t think that he will ever be worth that.

by jack dein on Feb 23, 2009 3:15 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

.000/.000/.000 560 K 0 hits

by MatM on Feb 23, 2009 3:33 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

Gets my vote.

"Debated ya right not one person agreed with me" by ATLsportsfrk on Dec 27, 2008 6:31 PM EST

by scstrato on Feb 23, 2009 4:26 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

sadly, I think bobby might actually play him enough to accomplish it…

by Doghnut on Feb 23, 2009 6:30 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

You're

looking good so far, maybe a few off on the Ks

60% of the time, it works every time

by ATLandUNC on Feb 25, 2009 5:11 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Projection: he’s going to be in Lake Buena Vista at this time next year.

SWAGGA LIKE BJONES, SWAGGA LIKE BJONES

by bigjoe on Feb 23, 2009 4:21 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

*NOT

SWAGGA LIKE BJONES, SWAGGA LIKE BJONES

by bigjoe on Feb 23, 2009 4:21 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

I wouldn't say "so successful"

You act as if Frenchy’s previous seasons were incredibly productive. His 1/2 season in 2005 was, but 2006 his 29 HRs were pretty well offset by his .293 OBP, notably only a .001 difference from this year. That is an OPS+ of 86, well below average.

His “great” 2007 season wasn’t really all that great either. He was really only just barely above average with an OPS+ of 103.

I think the problem is that we all over-value the guy. He has been at best average, and at worst HORRIBLE.

That said, my prediction for this season: .260/.320/.425. that is a .745 OPS. I’ll guess 20 HR’s. I’ll also venture to guess 100+ strikeouts. IE, he will be just below average, however many Braves fans and the Braves FO will once again label him a superstar and face of the franchise. He is not a superstar, and he shouldn’t be the face of the franchise.

by Andy Braves Fan on Feb 23, 2009 4:43 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

if he is slightly above avg offensively, say a 103 OPS+ then he is pretty valuable as he is an above avg defender, save for last year

he UZR/150 in 06 was 5.8
and in 07 was 18.4

i think 07 was a lil high but still no reason to think he cant post a UZR/150 of around 10… that makes him like a 2 win player (i think) if u account for his 103 OPS +

Heyward,Hanson,and Shaffer r ready now!! Why do you think they havent signed the "right handed bat"?

by fatazfoot on Jan 7, 2009 8:59 PM EST

by Swo12bv on Feb 24, 2009 12:42 AM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Well...

CHONE has him projected for .276/.324/.445. Oddly enough, that’s one of the most optimistic projection available (CHONE is usually a bit more pessimistic than Marcels or BillJames). PECOTA sees a .275/.328/.444 line, damn near the same thing as CHONE. The issue is that even if he hits his 75th percentile PECOTA projection, that’s a mere .285/.338/.483 line.

One thing that jumps out about Francoeur’s plate discipline numbers from Fangraphs is that he swung at just as many pitches out of the zone in 2008 as he had in previous years but fewer pitches in the zone. In short, he took more pitches, but he was taking pitches he should have swung at and flailing at things he probably couldn’t hit. That being said, his contact numbers were up slightly and his LD% was up – that .230something average was quite unlucky. Still, though, his batted ball and contact data do not look like that of a .300 hitter at all. That’s a big problem when you don’t take walks.

The most troubling thing is the plunging HR/FB rate. From 2005 to 2008, he had HR/FB of 17, 15, 10% and 6.5%. That’s not the way you want the trendline going.

Furthermore, Francoeur’s range has been dropping off. He scored out, according to UZR, as having +6.2 range in his rookie year. That’s down to -7 as of 2008. His arm, once the envy of outfielders everywhere, looked merely good last year.

Overall, I don’t know what to make of this guy. His power and fielding are showing rather disturbing downward trends and he’s still as hacktastic as ever. I for one think that the projection models are too optimistic – .265/.310/.430 seems right to me. His defense should rebound to slightly above average, but again, this is FYF.

If I were Bobby, I would give him one month before moving Anderson over to right field and giving Diaz and Blanco left.

by BraveBronco0121 on Feb 23, 2009 5:57 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

I'll handle u in spring training - phil413

by mattdiaz4life on Feb 23, 2009 6:35 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

?

You’re doing one of two things.

1. About to slit your wrists because FYF sucks so hard, or

2. Thinking I’m a little whiner because I’m down on him.

If #1, call your local suicide prevention hotline. If #2, SUCK ONE

by BraveBronco0121 on Feb 23, 2009 6:43 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

#1, but not quite as extreme as you posited

I'll handle u in spring training - phil413

by mattdiaz4life on Feb 23, 2009 7:09 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

That was completely uncalled for. Its always fun to pile on the “Jeff Francoeur sucks” bandwagon.

SWAGGA LIKE BJONES, SWAGGA LIKE BJONES

by bigjoe on Feb 23, 2009 7:38 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

No, seriously, #1.

I'll handle u in spring training - phil413

by mattdiaz4life on Feb 23, 2009 11:25 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

I’m actually in agreement with BraveBronco here for what I think Jeff will hit this year.

I really do hope he continues to work with Chipper on plate discipline and hitting, and I think he could become an above average player.

by Sparhawk on Feb 23, 2009 10:47 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Big bounceback year is my prediction.

Comeback Player of the Year. Gold Glove. Naysayers shocked into slack-jawed silence.

.286 avg, 42 doubles, 7 triples, 26 homeruns, 115 RBIs, 310 total bases, 60 BBs, 94 Ks.
.342/.478/.820.

Secondary prediction: Braves make playoffs.

Somewhat optimistic – agreed. Howling lunatic crazy – hardly.

by fandave on Feb 24, 2009 6:40 AM EST up reply actions   0 recs

.286 average…
Slash stats that don’t correlate.
I’m already in slack-jawed silence.

by mburris1 on Feb 24, 2009 1:41 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

OBP/SLG/OPS

No wonder nobody likes you, Tuttle... everything's a (Pujols) damn debate.

by royhobbs on Feb 24, 2009 1:48 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Yeah

But a .342 OBP for FYF?

Slack-jawed.

by mburris1 on Feb 24, 2009 2:16 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

It was .338 on '07 w/ only 42 BB in 696 TPA.

Is one extra walk per week unreasonable?

by fandave on Feb 25, 2009 8:09 AM EST up reply actions   0 recs

The one extra walk per week may not be unreasonable, but a .340 BABIP probably is

We should have signed Adam Dunn.

by Smoltz's Beard on Feb 25, 2009 9:58 AM EST up reply actions   0 recs

FYMF on a boat

.247 / .301 / .369

Benched by July.

60% of the time, it works every time

by ATLandUNC on Feb 24, 2009 5:03 AM EST reply actions   0 recs

Frenchy is baaaack.

Dropping the weight and working with Chipper will prove to be the right moves. I would imagine his fielding and PLUS PLUS arm suffered bc of the weight gain last year. I think his line will be more like fandave’s prediction than you think.

by tdoublem23 on Feb 24, 2009 3:20 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

I truly HOPE so!

I don’t think we can make any sort of run to the playoffs without Frenchy giving production.

"Success is not final. Failure is not fatal. It is the courage to continue that counts." - Sir Winston Churchill -

by justincredubil02 on Feb 24, 2009 4:25 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

He’s hitting cleanup this year

I'll handle u in spring training - phil413

by mattdiaz4life on Feb 24, 2009 6:00 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

i think jeff has a better chance of learning chippers hooters philosophy then his batting philosophy.

by heapofoatmeal on Feb 24, 2009 8:24 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

i dont know about that..

he really seems to be putting in the time and effort this year. last year all he did in the off season was lift weights and try to gain weight so he could try to hit 40 hrs.

if he is more balanced at the plate, drives outside pitch to right, and reacts well to inside pitches, he could certainly put up those numbers. he has the talent, we just have to find out if he has the plate discipline.

by tdoublem23 on Feb 25, 2009 11:32 AM EST up reply actions   0 recs

STACKER 2!

"Success is not final. Failure is not fatal. It is the courage to continue that counts." - Sir Winston Churchill -

by justincredubil02 on Feb 25, 2009 5:12 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Tommy Hanson 4 ROY

by timmy3 on Feb 25, 2009 8:09 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

This got a lol out of me.

I'll handle u in spring training - phil413

by mattdiaz4life on Feb 25, 2009 9:25 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

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