New Outfield Option
by jack dein on Feb 10, 2009 4:40 PM EST
80 comments
The Orioles finalized the contract with Ty Wiggington today. That leaves them with a crowded outfield and they already have a DH. That brings me to a guy that I think that we could get cheap and he would add a power bat to our lineup.
Luke Scott is going to be a man without a position this season. He is already signed for 2009 at $2.4M. He does have questions about whether he can hit left handed pitching or not but if he struggles we can always let Matt Diaz play against lefties. Last season was the first that he got over 400 at-bats and he performed well. He had a .257 average, a .336 OBP, and .472 SLG. In 475 at-bats he 23 home runs and 65 RBI. He had 54 extra base hits last year. He is also a left fielder having played in 106 games there last year. He's not a great fielder but he is serviceable. He's not terribly old at just 30 years old.
I think that one of Morton, Reyes, or Parr plus a prospect or two would be plenty to get him. The biggest reason I have brought this up is because we seem to have no interest in Dunn, and while we have had interest in Abreu for awhile it seems with his price this low if we really wanted him we would have signed him by now. I don't see the Cardinals as a trade option mostly because I think that they would want to much for Ludwick and they don't seem to want to trade him.
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Why?
Why would Wren want to give up a pitcher with any upside for a platoon player over 30? Maybe Parr, but anybody else seems like way too much for me.
by Andy Braves Fan on Feb 10, 2009 4:47 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
This is Nick Swishers wife
/debate
60% of the time, it works every time
by ATLandUNC on Feb 10, 2009 11:33 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
how much debated can be had…. she is unagreeably hot
Heyward,Hanson,and Shaffer r ready now!! Why do you think they havent signed the "right handed bat"?
by fatazfoot on Jan 7, 2009 8:59 PM EST
by Swo12bv on Feb 11, 2009 10:49 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
no words…should…have sent…
I guess I should be one to talk.
There's nights that I can't even walk.
There's days I couldn't give a fuck.
And in between is where I'm stuck.
by Smoltz's Beard on Feb 11, 2009 10:51 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I officially change my opinion
Swisher or Bust.
by FineHamAbounds on Feb 11, 2009 1:49 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
That's more like...
Swisher AND bust, if you know what I mean!
Hey-OH!
by mburris1 on Feb 11, 2009 1:55 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Poppa Burgandy!
I guess I should be one to talk.
There's nights that I can't even walk.
There's days I couldn't give a fuck.
And in between is where I'm stuck.
by Smoltz's Beard on Feb 11, 2009 2:01 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I'd pop a something!
"Success is not final. Failure is not fatal. It is the courage to continue that counts." - Sir Winston Churchill -
by justincredubil02 on Feb 11, 2009 2:05 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
im so telling ur wife
Heyward,Hanson,and Shaffer r ready now!! Why do you think they havent signed the "right handed bat"?
by fatazfoot on Jan 7, 2009 8:59 PM EST
by Swo12bv on Feb 11, 2009 5:04 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Something tells me Scott will be back in LF by June…the “three CF” idea is great and all, but if Pie can’t hit again this year I hardly think Baltimore will keep trotting him out over Scott. Wigginton may well end up at third if Mora struggles or gets hurt as well, again opening up a slot for Scott to be an everyday player.
I'll handle u in spring training - phil413
by mattdiaz4life on Feb 10, 2009 4:51 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
The biggest reason I made this post is not only that I think Scott is a good option but because everyone is so set on either Dunn, Abreu, Swisher, or Ludwick and these players have been available for a long time and we haven’t made a trade or signed them yet. I think that we need to start looking at other options for this position.
by jack dein on Feb 10, 2009 4:55 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
I think it’s pretty likely that Wren has explored every option available to him, whether or not it’s been discussed on the fine Talking Chop threads.
I'll handle u in spring training - phil413
by mattdiaz4life on Feb 10, 2009 5:03 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
This. Not really that interested in giving up anyone for a platoon player.
Going to be interesting to see which rabbit Wren pulls out of his hat…if any.
I guess I should be one to talk.
There's nights that I can't even walk.
There's days I couldn't give a fuck.
And in between is where I'm stuck.
by Smoltz's Beard on Feb 10, 2009 5:08 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
He was given a very limited chance to hit lefties and maybe if he gets more of an opportunity he could prove to hit them. Plus he’s going to add good power.
by jack dein on Feb 10, 2009 5:12 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Pretty big maybe if you ask me. The power against RH is good, no doubt, but his career slash stats against LH are not doing anything for me.
I guess I should be one to talk.
There's nights that I can't even walk.
There's days I couldn't give a fuck.
And in between is where I'm stuck.
by Smoltz's Beard on Feb 10, 2009 5:23 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Thats why we would still have Diaz around in case he failed. I just think there are limited options left and I really don’t want to enter the season with who we have now.
by jack dein on Feb 10, 2009 5:27 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Diaz is a terrible plan B, no offense.
I guess I should be one to talk.
There's nights that I can't even walk.
There's days I couldn't give a fuck.
And in between is where I'm stuck.
by Smoltz's Beard on Feb 10, 2009 5:42 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I meant if Scott can’t hit lefties then Diaz could start against lefties and Scott against righties. Diaz isn’t a horrible option keep in mind that if we don’t bring anyone new in Diaz will be a platoon option anyway.
by jack dein on Feb 10, 2009 5:48 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Even in that regard I can’t endorse Diaz. He’s got great stats against LH for his career, for sure, but they come along with a .351 BABIP…even for someone with as good of a LD% as Diaz has, that just doesn’t sit right with me. Maybe someone can point something out that I may be overlooking.
I guess I should be one to talk.
There's nights that I can't even walk.
There's days I couldn't give a fuck.
And in between is where I'm stuck.
by Smoltz's Beard on Feb 10, 2009 5:56 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
In his two years that he was used as a platoon player and pinch hitter only he seemed to perform very well. Last season was pretty much a waste for him which shows that he isn’t an everyday player. Besides with Scott on the team he would be in the same role as he would be without Scott. It just goes to putting a better player in the platoon with him.
by jack dein on Feb 10, 2009 6:03 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I understand how it works. All I’m saying is that it isn’t out of the realm of possibility that his 500 odd PAs against LH for his career is influenced by a BABIP that is unstastainable. We’ll have to wait and see, but I’m not willing wager any sum of money on Diaz.
UNLESS I’M FUCKING WRONG (can anyone pull the actual show this is from?)
I guess I should be one to talk.
There's nights that I can't even walk.
There's days I couldn't give a fuck.
And in between is where I'm stuck.
by Smoltz's Beard on Feb 10, 2009 6:49 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
FYF’s favorite HBO show… Deadwood.
by Mark Lempke on Feb 10, 2009 7:09 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
+1
That’s FYF’s favorite HBO show!? God damnit…
I guess I should be one to talk.
There's nights that I can't even walk.
There's days I couldn't give a fuck.
And in between is where I'm stuck.
by Smoltz's Beard on Feb 10, 2009 7:11 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Cocksucker
No no no—my stepdad loved that show, and they said that word so much, that he started calling the show “cocksucker”.
"…aren’t worthy enough to hold his (Pujols) ass cheeks apart while Playboy models wipe him with thousand dollar bills after he craps out the cure to whatever previously-incurable disease." by royhobbs 1/7/09
by buzzdeadwax on Feb 10, 2009 7:43 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
It kinda makes sense, in a way.
by soup du jour on Feb 10, 2009 10:01 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Scott
is set to be the O’s DH.
Formerly Uncle Charlie of Minor League Ball
by Yakker on Feb 10, 2009 5:15 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
False. Huff is playing first base.
Scott would be a great addition. .353 wOBA the past two years, projected for that by most projection systems, several runs above average defense based on UZR and PMR, etc. Very good contract too.
Certainly better than running out Diaz/B. Jones and if we could get Scott for Morton and a prospect I’d certainly do it.
by 17843 on Feb 10, 2009 6:43 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Scott for Morton AND a prospect? No thanks.
I'll handle u in spring training - phil413
by mattdiaz4life on Feb 10, 2009 8:46 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I’m convinced Brandon Jones could put up more or less the same numbers as Scott for six times less money.
SWAGGA LIKE BJONES, SWAGGA LIKE BJONES
JOE-BO FOR THE BENCH IN 09
by bigjoe on Feb 10, 2009 9:18 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I find that funny. Brandon Jones would not put up anywhere near the same numbers as Scott. He would cost less money but Scott is also a proven major league player and Brandon Jones is not. In a full season with 500 at-bats Scott would have around 25 home runs and Jones would have around 12 home runs. Not to mention Jones is a wild card right now. He hasn’t had that many at-bats in the majors and the few that he has had he hasn’t done much with. Scott is coming off of two pretty good seasons in limited time.
by jack dein on Feb 10, 2009 9:27 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I’m driving the BJONES bandwagon. I fully expect a .270/.350/.450 season from him this year.
SWAGGA LIKE BJONES, SWAGGA LIKE BJONES
JOE-BO FOR THE BENCH IN 09
by bigjoe on Feb 10, 2009 9:35 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I wouldn’t mind Jones getting the chance to be an everyday player but if he struggled right at the start he would be pulled and that would be it.
by jack dein on Feb 10, 2009 9:40 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I actually think you’re right on this. Scott took forever to show what kind of player he is; if Jones got the chance early, I don’t think it would take long at all before he was putting up similar numbers. They’re pretty similar players.
www.dropoutproductions.com
by cbwilk on Feb 11, 2009 1:24 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Its kind of a jumbled mess they have but I think that Mora will play third, Huff will DH, and Wiggington will play first.
by jack dein on Feb 10, 2009 6:52 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
I thought the plan was Scott at DH, Huff at first, and Wigginton spelling those guys and Mora while Scott occasionally played left. Basically using them all a lot.
www.dropoutproductions.com
by cbwilk on Feb 11, 2009 1:25 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
This
Wigginton is clearly the odd man out, not Scott.
Formerly Uncle Charlie of Minor League Ball
by Yakker on Feb 11, 2009 2:17 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Why is wiggington the odd man out, I would bench scott in favor of wiggington anyday, if he is healthy he has power
by bravesrbaseball on Feb 11, 2009 2:52 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I’m just telling you what’s likely to happen, based on everything the O’s are saying publicly and privately.
Scott is also likely to outpeform Wiggington in LF with both bat and glove.
Formerly Uncle Charlie of Minor League Ball
by Yakker on Feb 11, 2009 4:09 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
maybe with the glove but wiggington has better power numbers
by bravesrbaseball on Feb 11, 2009 4:14 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
There are plenty of other things one can do with a bat besides hit HRs.
See their career wOBA numbers.
Formerly Uncle Charlie of Minor League Ball
by Yakker on Feb 11, 2009 4:17 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
why don’t they just let BJ have the job? They can’t spend to get a sure thing so let’s just wing it. Plus you can’t go wrong with a good BJ.
by rocket8188 on Feb 10, 2009 7:59 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
hehehe he said BJ then job…. thats funny
Heyward,Hanson,and Shaffer r ready now!! Why do you think they havent signed the "right handed bat"?
by fatazfoot on Jan 7, 2009 8:59 PM EST
by Swo12bv on Feb 10, 2009 8:45 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I’m beginning to think our roster is already set. It seems if we were going to make a move, we would have already done it. Certainly we aren’t waiting for the prices to drop on guys who’s stock has already plummeted.
Question for the thread. Are we moving Jason Heyward to left? Francouer, if he rebounds, is only 25. Can only play one right fielder at a time.
by kalesi on Feb 10, 2009 8:32 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
I think we can worry about that in two years. LF and RF are the same position anyway.
I'll handle u in spring training - phil413
by mattdiaz4life on Feb 10, 2009 8:45 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
YES
That’s why their posistion adjustments are the same on fangraphs. You need to have the exact same skill set to play either of the corners, although most people perfer their RF to have a stronger arm.
by bravesfan91 on Feb 11, 2009 9:46 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
no by the time Heyward is ready Francoeur will most likely be gone, because he’ll bolt after his arbitration years are up… i dont see the Braves signing him long term. Although if for some reason he played really really well and then Heyward came up at the same time… most likely Heyward would play LF…. seeing as Francouer has one of the strongest OF arms in baseball (strongest didnt say best)
Heyward,Hanson,and Shaffer r ready now!! Why do you think they havent signed the "right handed bat"?
by fatazfoot on Jan 7, 2009 8:59 PM EST
by Swo12bv on Feb 10, 2009 8:47 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I was actually really shocked at how good Heyward’s arm is. But, it’s not as good as Frenchy’s, and, assuming he loses the unnecessary muscle weight, he’s still gonna be a more agile defender than Heyward, who looks like a good bet to slow down with age.
www.dropoutproductions.com
by cbwilk on Feb 11, 2009 1:31 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Because he’s a HOSS
I'll handle u in spring training - phil413
by mattdiaz4life on Feb 11, 2009 2:02 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I get the impression, like kalesi, that our lineup is set FOR NOW. I think Wren is going to give bjönes a chance to win the job out of ST, especially now that it looks like the Angels are horning in on Abreu. If he doesn’t impress, then Wren will either sign the best FA left available or trade for Swisher/Nady/insert name here.
by soup du jour on Feb 10, 2009 10:06 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
I could be wrong, but does that say “horning”?
I'll handle u in spring training - phil413
by mattdiaz4life on Feb 10, 2009 10:24 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
There certainly has to be a reason we haven’t signed one of these guys. You would think signing a guy like Abreu in what would be a contract year would make sense. He’d play his tail off and hope to get a multi-year deal in 2010.
It just seems as though Wren is content. I can understand watching the market, but in a year this down what would be the hold up?
I think we might underestimate this pitching staff, though. If we are in the race come all star break, there will certainly be some teams looking to unload some payroll. And who knows, we might get a pleasant surprise in camp as one of these young kids might fit into a role nicely.
by kalesi on Feb 10, 2009 11:24 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
In my opinion the Braves looked at the same players we have been talking about for the past month and decided that they either cost to much in money or prospects or they just didn’t like them. All the players that have been discussed have drawbacks. Early in the offseason Abreu wanted to much money for a player who is on the decline plus he plays horrible defense. I don’t think the Braves wanted to add another high strikeout guy which is why Dunn isn’t here plus his bad defense. The Yankees asking price for Swisher was to high plus for a guy to have the kind of off year he had last year that raises questions. Nady and Ankeil are entering contract years and both will get big deals next year. Ludwick’s asking price was probably to high plus he could have just had a fluke year last year. The guy that I still think we should consider is Jermaine Dye but that should have happened during the Vazquez trade.
by jack dein on Feb 10, 2009 11:34 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I mean, just how much money/prospects/etc. do you throw at a one tool player?
Maybe I’m blinded, but I always seem to go along with Braves management. They very rarely get it wrong. We go into this season going “oh man, what about the outfield,” but how many times have we slapped our heads over a decision only to find it makes a terrible amount of sense. Chuck Thomas? Estrada for Millwood? Renterria for some kid none of us have ever heard of?
by kalesi on Feb 11, 2009 8:41 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Dye’s getting $12.5 MM this year and he would cost prospects, how does he make any sense for the Braves?
by Lennox on Feb 11, 2009 2:08 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
People are still just bitter we traded him for Keith Lockhart & Michael Tucker.
SWAGGA LIKE BJONES, SWAGGA LIKE BJONES
JOE-BO FOR THE BENCH IN 09
by bigjoe on Feb 11, 2009 10:52 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I’ve always looked back at that as a really great trade. Lockhart was the best pinch hitter probably in Braves history, and Tucker had a great season and allowed Andruw to work his way into the majors in a platoon. Plus it was like three years before the Royals got any return on Dye, and then he more or less immediately moved on to the Athletics. People are stupid.
www.dropoutproductions.com
by cbwilk on Feb 11, 2009 12:09 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I don’t think it was a bad trade either. We got 6 years out of Lockhart, paying him a total of under $4.5 million, and he was a decent enough bench player. We got 2 years out of Tucker that were league average, and turned him into Mike Remlinger and Bret Boone. Not too shabby
SWAGGA LIKE BJONES, SWAGGA LIKE BJONES
JOE-BO FOR THE BENCH IN 09
by bigjoe on Feb 11, 2009 12:29 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I thought you were on board too. I was pointing out before “those people” could even get a chance to bitch about that trade. “Those people” are stupid. Not you though buddy, you can just suck one.
www.dropoutproductions.com
by cbwilk on Feb 11, 2009 2:33 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Didn't we turn Denny Neagle into Bret Boone?
And that was before Neagle sucked one and before Boone was any good.
"…aren’t worthy enough to hold his (Pujols) ass cheeks apart while Playboy models wipe him with thousand dollar bills after he craps out the cure to whatever previously-incurable disease." by royhobbs 1/7/09
by buzzdeadwax on Feb 11, 2009 3:44 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I looked it up
Tucker and Neagle for Boone and Remlinger. I didn’t understand the trade at the time—Boone didn’t impress me, and Neagle was a very good pitcher.
"…aren’t worthy enough to hold his (Pujols) ass cheeks apart while Playboy models wipe him with thousand dollar bills after he craps out the cure to whatever previously-incurable disease." by royhobbs 1/7/09
by buzzdeadwax on Feb 11, 2009 3:48 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I think the one year Boone didn’t do steroids was when he was in Atlanta.
www.dropoutproductions.com
by cbwilk on Feb 11, 2009 3:49 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
We got an incredible 1997 out of Neagle, but the wheels starting falling off in 1998. Everything across the board went up. So we jumped ship when the getting was good, and he never had an ERA below 4, a walk rate of under 3, and a HR rate of under 1 ever again.
Remlinger gave us 4 awesome years, so we can’t complain about him.
Boone was shit in 1999, and we turned him into Veras, Joyner & Sanders (while also dumping Klesko). Sanders was shit as Klesko’s replacement (for the only time in his career), Joyner was an adequate pinch hitter, and Veras turned into 2 injury plagued years, splitting time with…Keith Lockhart. See how I brought that all around again?
SWAGGA LIKE BJONES, SWAGGA LIKE BJONES
JOE-BO FOR THE BENCH IN 09
by bigjoe on Feb 11, 2009 3:59 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Man, we had a few years there where pretty reliable guys just shit the bed after coming to the Braves.
www.dropoutproductions.com
by cbwilk on Feb 11, 2009 4:01 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Except for the Big Cat. Dude was awesome
SWAGGA LIKE BJONES, SWAGGA LIKE BJONES
JOE-BO FOR THE BENCH IN 09
by bigjoe on Feb 11, 2009 4:05 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Man I loved him. That’s one dude I’ve never met that I’d love to. I’m still hoping for Eddie Perez to take over for Bobby down the line, cause he said Big Cat’s gonna be his hitting coach.
www.dropoutproductions.com
by cbwilk on Feb 11, 2009 5:18 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Dude coming back from cancer and homering in his first game back? Seriously epic stuff.
SWAGGA LIKE BJONES, SWAGGA LIKE BJONES
JOE-BO FOR THE BENCH IN 09
by bigjoe on Feb 11, 2009 8:59 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Plus, he just loved playing. Some guys are so serious and down and intense all the time, which is fine, but he was completely into the game and having a blast while he was doing it. Great player.
www.dropoutproductions.com
by cbwilk on Feb 11, 2009 10:36 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
+1 for the Big Cat. Always fun to watch.
Another guy that I always enjoyed watching was Marcus Giles. It seems pretty obvious that he was using something, but you could tell that he played his ass off in the field and when he was in the dugout he always was laughing at something. One of my favorite moments was right after we won the division the camera cut to the locker room with champagne waiting and the first two people to come in were Andruw wearing swimming goggles with Giles on his back piggyback style. Just made me laugh endlessly.
I guess I should be one to talk.
There's nights that I can't even walk.
There's days I couldn't give a fuck.
And in between is where I'm stuck.
by Smoltz's Beard on Feb 12, 2009 10:16 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Outfield
If the Braves want to make any more playoffs, a proven outfield will need to be aquired somehow. Sending a bunch of veteran minor leaguers out there isn’t going to work. Glavines money would have been better spent on an outfield player like Abreu. I like Glavine and all, but if your willing to let Smoltz walk for the good of the team, maybe its time to let Glavine go. Im saying that on the business end of course.
by wcubmac on Feb 11, 2009 4:08 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
I swear…if I have to open this thread one more time and scroll passed Swisher’s wife…
I guess I should be one to talk.
There's nights that I can't even walk.
There's days I couldn't give a fuck.
And in between is where I'm stuck.
by Smoltz's Beard on Feb 11, 2009 4:15 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
There is no such thing as an e-Kleenex.
No wonder nobody likes you, Tuttle... everything's a (Pujols) damn debate.
by royhobbs on Feb 11, 2009 4:38 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
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