Braves' Soriano Accepts Arbitration
by gondeee on Dec 7, 2009 11:55 PM EST
in Free Agents
266 comments
The Atlanta Braves off-season just got a bit more interesting. Reliever Rafael Soriano has decided to accept arbitration and remain with the Braves for 2010, according to Jon Heyman of SI.com. Through arbitration, the Braves will likely end up paying Soriano anywhere from $6.5 to $8 million for next season. With $10 million plus already committed to Billy Wagner and Takashi Saito, it is likely that the Braves will explore ways to trade Soriano -- something they would need his approval for from now until the middle of June.
With Soriano likely relegated to a setup role in the early innings, he and his agent may be inclined to ask for a trade. In fact this could have been the strategy all along -- to take the guaranteed money and let the Braves do the leg work in finding another team that needs his services.
Fitting his salary into the bullpen certainly seems outside of the budget of the Braves, so if they cannot trade him something else will have to give. This could affect who they tender contracts to next month, as someone like Kelly Johnson may no longer be affordable. They could also choose to trade both Derek Lowe and Javier Vazquez to free up salary space, attempting to land a cheaper starting pitching option in return for one.
Soriano also risks being cut in spring training and his salary not being guaranteed. There are some fancy baseball rules behind that (which I'm sure we'll learn in the coming days), but surely he and his agent gave that some thought.
Of course, if the Braves keep Soriano and are able to fit him into their payroll, then the Braves suddenly have the best bullpen in baseball -- a nice commodity for a manager who loves to use his bullpen.
The biggest impact here is how this move will affect the other moves the Braves may be planning. The next couple of days will be interesting, to see if Atlanta makes any trades to free up salary. The Braves other free agent who was offered arbitration, Mike Gonzalez, has apparently declined arbitration.
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I said this somewhere else, is this necessarily a bad thing outside of the monetary hole we dug ourselves?
(Yunel is still the Queen of Hearts)
by GoBravesNY on Dec 7, 2009 11:59 PM EST via mobile reply actions
hell no
our bullpen is sick nasty now.
BWag
Saito
Soriano
Moylan
EOF
Medlen
plus Kimbrel waiting in the wings along with other guys like Valdez, Hyde, Acosta, etc.
If we can get rid of DLowe’s contract, we’ll be just fine.
In Frank Wren I trust.
I never said I like him. He’s a pathetic excuse for a relief pitcher.
Bobby likes him tho, and that’s all that really matters.
In Frank Wren I trust.
He is really nasty…once he gets the control under control, he should be fairly effective.
"My team of nine guys who hit like Albert Pujols and never ever bunt just beat your team with one Shane Victorino 472 to 3."
by justincredubil02 on Dec 8, 2009 12:31 AM EST up reply actions
Oh yeah, he has the stuff…hes just stupid when he goes on the mound. He’ll go 0-2 on a guy and then throw a fastball down the middle of the plate
In Frank Wren I trust.
that would be McCann’s fault for calling that pitch or are u saying he cant locate his fastball properly
Heyward,Hanson,and Shaffer r ready now!! Why do you think they havent signed the "right handed bat"?
by fatazfoot on Jan 7, 2009 8:59 PM EST
I'm with you on this justin...
Acosta has had his share of bad innings, but the man has show some good stuff at times too. Just a matter of gaining consistency. I also noticed that it seemed most of the time he found trouble were in multiple inning outings after he came back for more.
Or as gondee indicates...
maybe we move Javy AND Lowe, which isn’t ideal, but both cost more than Soriano. Then a pitching staff looks like…
Starters—
Hudson
Hanson
Jurrjens
Kawakami
Medlen
Bullpen—
Wagner
Soriano
Saito
Moylan
O’Flaherty
Logan/Valdez/Kimbrel/Hyde/Proctor/Abreu/Reyes/etc
get a long relief and lefty in the final two spots out of Boone Logan, Lee Hyde, Luis Valdez, Craig Kimbrel, etc, and that’s not a bad staff, especially if KK pitches like he did last year and Medlen steps up. It’s much thinner than we’d like as far as potential injuries are concerned, but then we are cost conscious here and that just goes hand in hand with the salary limits.
hopefully if we trade both, we get a starter back, no?
"If I have asthma, they won't let me scuba. And if I can’t scuba, then what’s this all been about?? What am I working toward??"
We need a 1B and cleanup more...
but yeah, a potential starter could certainly be in the return package. just thinking out loud with what we already have though.
Not a bad idea and I like you thinking Mr. Sanchez
However I just don’t think we are going to move both of our starting pitchers just to keep one bullpen guy. I honestly think that Soriano wants a trade but didn’t want to go through the leg work of trying to find a team on the free agent market. Alot of guys are wanting to be in ATL this year b/c we have a chance to be a great team and it is Bobby’s last season.
Long the bullpen though should they decide to keep Soriano b/c it would be the best in ATL history.
by Holty_Panthers_Fan on Dec 8, 2009 9:29 AM EST up reply actions
Also
Maybe Wren can go back to Vasquez now and negotiate an extension, backloading it and cutting 2010 by a few mil. Maybe something like $44M/4, with $9M in 2010.
I think as long as he gets more years, the MLBPA won’t complain.
If Albert played in the AFL, they’d have to rename it the AZ/NM Fall League, based on where his homers landed.
Not a bad thing outside of the monetary hole we dug ourselves.
The bad thing is, of course, the monetary hole we dug ourselves.
Not really
Is not as if those big contracts are impossible to move. I think the main reason that Soriano acepted is because the price would go down on him if another team had to give up a first round pick. Now that they don’t have to we can trade him for next to nothing worst case scenerio. I am not sure what to think of Lowe and Vasquez. I love to keep Vasquez rather than Lowe (although I like both) but we would get a LOT more for Vasquez and from his track record I don’t see him having as good a season as he had last year.
Soriano can be moved...
…assuming he agrees, which is anticipated. I just don’t think we’ll get a return as good as the draft picks, although it is possible. We will see. It just sort of gums up the works for a bit. If Lackey would sign sooner rather than later, that would really help.
im fine with that...
seeing as draft-picks are commodities that are relative to how you use them, all these trade scenarios that are being spoken of are much better than giving up other players in a trade or cash.
What if...
As part of agreeing to waive his no trade rights, the agent may ask the team whom trades for Soriano to agree not to offer Soriano next offseason. That would further decrease the Braves leverage.
Well, Shit...
…That is all…
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An extra trade piece in a relievers market, this is going to be
An interesting off-season…..
PS Mike is Gone-Zo
by AlRoBraves95 on Dec 8, 2009 12:05 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
Yeah, really. We gave him the option and it was well within his rights to accept.
Plus, I think Wren sees this as a win/win as we may actually get more in a trade than two shot in the dark draft picks.
Who knows, maybe Soriano did the Braves a solid.
Very true
I don’t know why some people are freaking out. He is going to be traded. He just pick up the option because a team giving up picks would have lower the contract he would get but he still is very valuable and we will easily get rid of his contract even if we don’t get anything back of value. So offering him arb was without a doubt very smart. Now WHY not to LaRoche is beyond me?
Problem is that there is a glut of closer/shut down relievers on the market
Even minus Soriano, Waggner, and Saito. Teams won’t be as willing to trade if there are options available that only cost money.
by Andy Braves Fan on Dec 8, 2009 12:25 PM EST up reply actions
Interesting note with the Braves doing the all the leg work. Still find it hard to imagine that Soriano would have had trouble finding a job. Oh well, LETS TRADE HIM FOR PUJOLS.
by McCann and McWill on Dec 8, 2009 12:03 AM EST reply actions
I dunno what the freakin out is about, this is one mean bullpen…prolly the best i can remember. so what if it is gonna be expensive, this is Bobby’s last year people!
Just package up Lowe, KJ and a prospect and get us a real bat now.
also what’s all this talk about bmf in the 6th? im sure he will see some 8th innings…it aint like saito is young.
besides paying about $25MM for our bullpen, it’s great. IMHO, we have the best pitching in baseball now.
And as long as we clear up some money by trading DLowe or KK, we’ll be fine.
Don’t fret people…Frank Wren still has 3 months.
In Frank Wren I trust.
They said today that KK is not on the trading block, but that Lowe and Vaz were.
"My team of nine guys who hit like Albert Pujols and never ever bunt just beat your team with one Shane Victorino 472 to 3."
by justincredubil02 on Dec 8, 2009 12:07 AM EST up reply actions
I just noticed that a Rafael has screwed us each offseason >_>
by JasonHeywardisGod on Dec 8, 2009 12:04 AM EST reply actions
Hey I am not whining I’m just stating something
by JasonHeywardisGod on Dec 8, 2009 12:39 AM EST up reply actions
noticing a Rafael has screwed us each offseason wasn’t supposed to be something serious, im glad we didnt sign furcal cuz he obviously sucked this year and with rafael, it makes this offseason a little more exciting so no I am not whining :D
by JasonHeywardisGod on Dec 8, 2009 12:59 AM EST up reply actions
Haha, so Furcal did us a solid just like Soriano may just have. So…. I’m still not following how they screwed us.
Well
at the time of both transactions, all brave fans including myself were furious over it and thought we got screwed but in reality its probably good!
by JasonHeywardisGod on Dec 8, 2009 1:11 AM EST up reply actions
i know
I wish we still had Horacio…
"Hey Fat Kid...the monster is right behind you! RUNNNN!!" -The Host
by bwellnjonesco on Dec 8, 2009 11:46 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
+1
"SIGN PUJOLS OR FIRE WREN" ~ Swo12bv
by Smoltz's Beard on Dec 8, 2009 11:49 AM EST up reply actions
I’m sure the Braves have been planning for this. I very much doubt that Soriano is with the Braves to start Spring Training. I have heard recently that the Orioles were interested in him. Not sure what their money situation is but if we took a player that cost a few million and a prospect back the Braves would go for it.
Valverde declined, so Houston may be an option too. Anyone know if Street accepted Colorado’s offer?
"My team of nine guys who hit like Albert Pujols and never ever bunt just beat your team with one Shane Victorino 472 to 3."
by justincredubil02 on Dec 8, 2009 12:07 AM EST up reply actions
Carlos Lee for Sori and Lowe?
by AlRoBraves95 on Dec 8, 2009 12:12 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
I hope not.
"My team of nine guys who hit like Albert Pujols and never ever bunt just beat your team with one Shane Victorino 472 to 3."
by justincredubil02 on Dec 8, 2009 12:14 AM EST up reply actions
How about Berkman?...
I’ve read he may be on the market somewhere (can’t remember where). Maybe Lowe/Sori/Mejia or Gerry Rod or RSF and another prospect for him?
I wouldn’t mind old Lance in a Braves uni.
"My team of nine guys who hit like Albert Pujols and never ever bunt just beat your team with one Shane Victorino 472 to 3."
by justincredubil02 on Dec 8, 2009 9:37 AM EST up reply actions
Despite Berkman's high salary...
…Lowe + Soriano is still significantly higher and the Astros are cutting payroll, not adding to it. Furthermore, Berkman is a fixture there and unlikely to be moved. Finally, even if the Astros wanted to do it, Berkman would have to agree; he is well past 10/5 territory.
I think I read somewhere that Lee is old and fat and costs too much.
If Albert played in the AFL, they’d have to rename it the AZ/NM Fall League, based on where his homers landed.
haha, this
"SIGN PUJOLS OR FIRE WREN" ~ Swo12bv
by Smoltz's Beard on Dec 8, 2009 11:08 AM EST up reply actions
Luke Scott is entering his first year of arbitration. He made $2.4M last year. Hit .258/.340/.488 with 25 HR’s in 449 at bats. Only big drawback is that he bats LH. Seems decent enough as a corner outfielder. If they through in a prospect like Brandon Waring would be nice.
props on this call
I saw him play last season against the Yanks…BTW with Burnett on the mound he crushed a HR to right center…and made an impressive play in the OF…I think he would hit a few more dingers in the NL.
Has experience at 1st...
although not sure how much of an option he’d be there. In the least could be a nice righty/lefty platoon with Diaz after Heyward comes up.
buying super high on him though
at this point during any of the last 3 years we could have gotten him for nothing. I’d like to see a little bit more of him before we let the orioles fleece our farm system.
I think it would just be for...
…Soriano, not prospects.
i dont think they'd do that straight up...
especially with the potential difference in salary. Even though soriano could earn as low as 6.5mil he could also earn as high as 8 mil, (unless he gets traded before the arb. hearing/agreement)
that means for this trade to happen the orioles would be trading a cheaper, higher impact hitter, for a more expensive reliever.
Orioles are an interesting question
On the positive side, they were interested and he no longer costs them a draft pick or requires a multi-year commitment. That should make Soriano appealing. On the downside, the Orioles are not going to part with a good prospect for a one-year closer solution—-it’s not like they are going to compete in the AL East in 2010. If we just want to move Soriano for salary, they are probably a good destination (that is if Soriano is willing to go to a crappy team to close), but I doubt the return would be more valuable than the draft picks.
The O’s still have Chris Ray, right? Don’t know what they’d want with an $8M Soriano. And they have other needs more dire than closer, like the corner infield spots, unless they plan on using Wiggington at 3B and Aubrey at 1st.
(You know who would really good in Baltimore? Adrian Beltre.)
If Albert played in the AFL, they’d have to rename it the AZ/NM Fall League, based on where his homers landed.
You obviously didn't see Chris Ray pitch last year.
I had him on a fantasy team. Trust me, it was brutal. Absolutely horrific. I only mentioned the Orioles because they had considered signing Soriano before he accepted arbitration according to published reports. They do have the money to spend, the rub is that they are rebuilding, so they won’t want to part with younger cheaper players.
Yeah, I watched Ray a bit, and I do know he was pretty awful. I thought it was rust/undisclosed injury, but perhaps he isn’t the long term answer.
If the Orioles really want to pay $8M for the back-end of their bullpen on a sub-500 club, fine by me. I just doubt it, when they have so many more dire needs and Johnson/Ray in the mix, both of whom seem like passable answers (along with Meredith).
If Albert played in the AFL, they’d have to rename it the AZ/NM Fall League, based on where his homers landed.
are you talking about aubrey huff…. he is no longer with the Os
Heyward,Hanson,and Shaffer r ready now!! Why do you think they havent signed the "right handed bat"?
by fatazfoot on Jan 7, 2009 8:59 PM EST
Why?
"My team of nine guys who hit like Albert Pujols and never ever bunt just beat your team with one Shane Victorino 472 to 3."
by justincredubil02 on Dec 8, 2009 12:12 AM EST up reply actions
lol I don’t know. I really just don’t like spending THAT much on a bullpen when we already have limited funds. I know its a ridiculously good one, but still.
Cockchafer
I don’t like spending money either, but calling a dude a dick for getting $8M and a job is a little off.
"My team of nine guys who hit like Albert Pujols and never ever bunt just beat your team with one Shane Victorino 472 to 3."
by justincredubil02 on Dec 8, 2009 12:14 AM EST up reply actions
That figure is such BS too. he made like 2.5M last year, his salary this year was artificially inflated because the deal was heavily backloaded. But of course, arbitration doesn’t take logical shit like that into account, they just look at this year’s salary and jack it up another 2 mil.
I thought he made $6-ish last year…
"My team of nine guys who hit like Albert Pujols and never ever bunt just beat your team with one Shane Victorino 472 to 3."
by justincredubil02 on Dec 8, 2009 12:37 AM EST up reply actions
Should’ve looked it up before last post, but he made 2.75M in 08 with a spike to that 6.1 this year.
so what are you saying that he doesnt deserve 8M bc he made 6.1 in ’09 or bc he made 2.75 in ’08
Heyward,Hanson,and Shaffer r ready now!! Why do you think they havent signed the "right handed bat"?
by fatazfoot on Jan 7, 2009 8:59 PM EST
Yes. On a balanced deal, rather than a backloaded one, he’d have made 4M-ish this year, and we’d be talking about 5-6 in arb rather than 7-8. I’m just pointing out that backloading the deal artificially inflates his current year salary at time of arbitration, which is the only number they look at, thereby artificially inflating his arbitration salary as well.
The truth is, if he had the chance he would leave for greener pastures. He saw what was best for him monetarily, not that he loved the Braves so much he just had to accept.
Cockchafer
He didn’t want to play for braves, he wanted the money
by JasonHeywardisGod on Dec 8, 2009 12:24 AM EST up reply actions
I mean, if I had a choice between staying where I am now and making, say $800 K or moving to New York and getting $400 K for a year or even making the same $800 K, I don’t even think it would be a question, I’d choose to stay.
Now if New York was offering me $1.6 MM, then, yeah, I’d move because it’d be ridiculous not to.
depends on where you live
bc hte difference between 800k and 1.6M when taking into account tax brackets and cost of lviign
personally i wouldnt move to NY from FL for the money… i would be making only about 300k extra and its not worth the hassle of living in NY…although thats easy to say without the offer in front of me
Heyward,Hanson,and Shaffer r ready now!! Why do you think they havent signed the "right handed bat"?
by fatazfoot on Jan 7, 2009 8:59 PM EST
And now it's totally official
DOB said Soriano’s agent texted him and said they confirmed.
In Frank Wren I trust.
lol
he shoulda accepted just for kicks and giggles.
BWag, Saito, Soriano, Gonzo, Moylan, EOF, Logan, Medlen….
BOING!
In Frank Wren I trust.
a $30M bullpen…WOW.
"My team of nine guys who hit like Albert Pujols and never ever bunt just beat your team with one Shane Victorino 472 to 3."
by justincredubil02 on Dec 8, 2009 12:32 AM EST up reply actions
Trade Him to the Rays
Carl Crawford +Reid Brignac for Raffy and Ryan Church or Kelly Johnson
If they take KJ then Zobrist goes back to the outfield. If they take Church then Zobrist stays at second base and Jennings is platooned with him in June. The money matches up for both teams and neither team takes long term risks. This also gives the Rays the ability to call up some of their stud OF prospect jennings!!
STOP
Crawford>Sori and Brignac>Church, at least value wise.
You aren’t the czar of typographic emphasis
I'll SLOW DOWN
The match for needs is there. THE RAYS IMO ARE A POTENTIAL TRADE PARTNER IN REGARDS TO KJ, CHURCH, AND RAFFY. Maybe not crawford but I would ask. He’s not resigning with the Rays and everyone knows it. They might as well pick up a 2b and Closer while there at it. Zobrist is already the backup in all OF positions and could easily replace crawford defensively. The rays lose speed but Jennings would come up very soon and he is a legit OF prospect and the reason crawford won’t be resigned by the rays.
You’re both onto something. Maybe Crawford for Raffy and KJ, but not with Brignac thrown in. Although there’s probably a better deal to be found for Crawford if Tampa opens up the market on him, so I wouldn’t bet on it unless there’s some lengthy discussion first.
If you get crawford
you don’t need a power bat. you just need gap hitters and that’s what we have. To be honest I live in Tampa and I just love the guy. So yes I’m very bias on this one. He’s is such an awesome player and watching him run the bases is a seat filler in itself.
You can go as slow as you want
but “needs” means jack diddly when the value isn’t there. Example, the Cardinals “need” a LF and an SP. Does that mean they would take Church and Lowe for Pujols?
You aren’t the czar of typographic emphasis
So add some prospects...
Crawford isn’t Pujols, and the Rays actually have him on the trading block. Maybe Sori for BJ straight up?
I’m not going to comment on all that other than to say I’ve seen Brignac a lot the last few years with Durham and he’s a very impressive player. He’s gotten better too, which is always a good sign.
I wrote a novel, it's about baseball, you should buy it: https://www.createspace.com/3407939
www.dropoutproductions.com
Can I have a hit
of whatever you’re smoking? The Rays would laugh their asses off at that.
by Blue or CONKZILLA on Dec 8, 2009 8:41 AM EST up reply actions
Ironic prediction of the night
By the end of May Saito and Wagner hit the DL and Sori takes over as closer and everyone on here complaining suddenly starts posting how thankful they are that he accepted arb.
You aren’t the czar of typographic emphasis
More realistic prediction
Sometime before ST Sori and his agent quietly requests to be traded. Guaranteed Wren obliges.
You aren’t the czar of typographic emphasis
What if Sori hit the DL in April...
had a minor mishap in ST and decided to take surgery and shut it down for the season, against doctors advice.
Still don't see this as a bad thing
If he had declined, he would probably have ended up with like the Yankees, or with a team that has a protected pick. So we’d end up with a sandwhich pick and either the last pick in the first round or a second round pick (not completely absolute, of course).
As it is, we’re looking at one of three scenarios.
1) He gives the OK to trade him, in which case, Braves can actually set a price, instead of just taking whatever picks they end up with. So we can ask for players closer to be MLB ready, or guys who already have service time, maybe get a really good prospect we’ve been scouting back in return. A reliever on a one year deal for a reasonable salary is a decent trade chip, especially when he Ks 12 guys per 9 innings.
2) We don’t get the OK to trade him, but he gets shopped at the June 15 deadline. We’re out about $4 million but we get half a season of an awesome bullpen (plus, he’d be great insurance against injuries to Wagner and Saito). The other half year, we presumably get something helpful back for the playoff run.
3) We simply go forward with a kickass bullpen. Wagner and Saito are both injury risks, especially Wagner. Hopefully we end up moving Lowe’s salary, or KK’s, but between these three and Moylan, we should keep from having guys overworked. It’s pricey, but consider this: We had 21 blown saves resulting in 12 losses last year. But our fourth and fifth best RPs next year would be Moylan and EOF. Even if we had to go deep into the pen, we’re not running out Acosta or Bennet or Vladimer Nunez.
I like your thinking, my man.
Nicely put.
by get swoll yunel on Dec 8, 2009 1:54 AM EST up reply actions
This.
Except for the fact that we’re not moving KK.
Oh, and this is all dependent on unloading Lowe’s contract. Otherwise we won’t have the money to pick up the bat we desperately need, which IMO was our biggest need coming into the offseason.
All the comments on Wagner and Saito having possible injuries...
seem to ignore than Soriano is as much if not more of a risk in that regard.
Really?
Wagner just missed essentially an entire season following elbow surgery, and he’s 37 years old.
Takashi Saito will be 40 when the season starts.
Soriano DID miss most of 2008 following elbow surgery, but he threw 75.2 innings in 2009 without any problems. He’ll be 30 next year, so I can’t see him as a bigger injury risk than two much older pitchers.
Soriano, however,
had several injuries prior to the 2007 elbow surgery as well, while Wagner was pretty healthy his whole career before his surgery. Saito, I am not sure about. They are all pretty risky, IMO.
You can say those two are better rested though...
since they got fewer innings last year. And Soriano pitched much worse in the latter months of the year (not bad mind you, just much worse compared to his unhittable first half). Combine his work load, with his late season and multiple injury past make me think he’ll go down for a significant period 2010, or at best 2011.
I wouldn’t say he had zero problems. Weren’t there a couple instances were he was unable to pitch in particular games?
"SIGN PUJOLS OR FIRE WREN" ~ Swo12bv
by Smoltz's Beard on Dec 8, 2009 1:30 PM EST up reply actions
That would be a great deal imo, he will most likely bounce back
by JasonHeywardisGod on Dec 8, 2009 12:40 AM EST up reply actions
the man can barely walk????
I watched him in person at 22 games last year. He’s not coming back unless he is a part time dH like AJ with the rangers last year. Just not happening.
No
The Rays won’t pay that much for a reliever. They are looking at guys like Calero and Lindstrom
by Blue or CONKZILLA on Dec 8, 2009 8:45 AM EST up reply actions
The Rays would take a bucket of balls for Burrell...
or at least they are making out that way. They don’t have a closer either, I almost guarantee the Rays would do that deal. But would we? Besides, they’ve been talking Milton Bradley for Burrell for a little while now.
Burrell played 1st as a rookie, but wouldn’t expect him to be able to play there. Still, with only one year left on his deal, and it seems the salary matches Soriano’s, and they could use a closer. Interesting idea.
Yeah, the Rays would take Soriano for Burrell in a heartbeat.
And it would work for us. He is a right-handed bat we need. And we can slot him in as our DH. Whoops.
Not that I am a big fan of defensive metrics, they are still not 100% reliable, but I do note that per fangraphs, Burrell’s fielding in 2007 was 6 or so runs worse than Garrett Anderson in 2009. That’s a scary thought.
I think for the Cubs,...
it’s maybe he regains his Phillie self, or at worst they waste one season of paying Burrell for wasting multiple years of paying Bradley’s deal.
That's what is stalling the deal.
The Rays want the Cubs to even out the money, the Cubs don’t want to give that much money. The thought of watching Burrell try to deal with the winds in the outfield at Wrigley, however, is priceless.
FanGraph's UZR had his defense
About average last year.
At any rate, I figure he’s got at least one good season at the plate left in him.
No offense
but stats can be misleading sometimes. I told everyone last year that we should go after Edwin Jackson but everyone called me crazy. Told me all the stats and how I was retarded because of his stats the past two year.
I’m just going off my gut feeling and the 22 games I watched him (burrell) in last year. He is really horrible and doesn’t have bat speed anymore. I’d be interested to know how many innings he played last year in the field as I didn’t see but one
Yes, but the UZR numbers prove it...
…and it is what we already know—-defensively, Pat Burrell makes a league-average DH!
That's one season
for a guy who’s been a really good hitter in his career, and just turned 33. He’s four and a half years younger than Chipper Jones.
and Chipper is 4 and half times more awesome
Heyward,Hanson,and Shaffer r ready now!! Why do you think they havent signed the "right handed bat"?
by fatazfoot on Jan 7, 2009 8:59 PM EST
I'm just pointing out
That it’s unlikely he’s lost that much bat speed, as some have suggested, because he’s much farther back in the age curve.
the age curve has more variable than just age… specifically skill set. Burrel is not and never was an athletic guy whihc would lead to his curve being sharper on the backside.
im not saying this is true, but this is a pretty good argument to supplement his supposed lack of bat speed.
Heyward,Hanson,and Shaffer r ready now!! Why do you think they havent signed the "right handed bat"?
by fatazfoot on Jan 7, 2009 8:59 PM EST
I remember last year reading an article about how guys with the three true outcome skill set tend to decline suddenly and rapidly. Basically once the bat gets a little slower, the power tails off, which leads to trouble getting walks as pitchers start challenging them more.
So the choice is between Burrell at $9MM who was horrible last year, or Soriano at $6.5 – 8 MM, who was pretty good last year … I have to go with the guy who was good and will be a bit cheaper.
He always did a LOT better at home than away when he was with the Phillies. Getting him out of the bandbox seems to have hurt him.
by FineHamAbounds on Dec 8, 2009 2:53 AM EST up reply actions
IDK
But I hope its soon before I lose mind over anticipation on what we will do
by JasonHeywardisGod on Dec 8, 2009 1:36 AM EST up reply actions
Soriano will cooperate on a trade...
… I the feeling I’m getting is that teams were interested in him (the Orioles seemed particularly so), but I’m betting that the Two Draft Pick thing was a bug-a-boo. So he took the sure money, but now it’s probably down to a sign-and-trade kinda deal. The big question for me is how fast can that get done so that other matters can be dealt with?
Meanwhile, on the subject of “get a big bat” — can we name the “big bats” that are actually possibly available?
i still stand by my
Lowe + Soriano + KJ
to the Yankees for
Nick Swisher and Austin Jackson
the Yankees then go sign Holliday and sign Damon to an incentive-laden deal and they’re done. remember, Joba and Hughes are going into the Rotation and the Yanks need a reliable arm. KJ needs a change of scenery and being the super-utility guy on the Yanks could help him. We get a LF, a future LF and salary relief. Lowe allows the Yanks to wave bye to Pettite (who just rejected their initial bid).
by apoxonbothyourhouses on Dec 8, 2009 1:31 AM EST reply actions
I think it’s a touch of wishful thinking to hope the Yankees take both our bad pitching contracts off our hands in one fell swoop.
You do realize that Jackson was the 27th rated prospect in baseball this year. The Yankees really want to cut payroll this year and taking on roughly $28M for the 2010 season alone isn’t really doing that. Plus Petitte is more than likely going to be with the Yankees next year.
you do know
that they don’t project him to be anything more than Mike Cameron-lite? or do you trust websites more than scouts? Jackson has regressed the past 2 years and he WAS the 12th rated just last year and is now 27. Seems to me that he may never hit enough to be anything more than a 4th Outfielder.
Pettite has rejected the first offer and I think he retires for real this time is the Yankees balk on his asking price (a very real possibility even with your logic). They will need a younger (somewhat), steady #3 starter who gives them 220 innings and 4.20 ERA in that park. That is Lowe. They offset some of the cost by trading Swisher and we throw in Soriano for Jackson.
Yankees want to cut payroll? ha. they said the SAME THING last year and proceeded to sign Tex to the 64h largest contract EVER (after they had just signed CC to the 4th biggest contract ever)
by apoxonbothyourhouses on Dec 8, 2009 6:05 AM EST up reply actions
I know everyone is getting upset over Soriano accepting the arb offer
But what I really want to know is what exactly is the payroll expected to be next season? Does $95-97 million sound reasonable?
Also can someone give me a rough estimate of what the payroll is looking right now (after the Wagner/Saito/Soriano signings)?
by SmithnCompany on Dec 8, 2009 2:38 AM EST up reply actions
My best guess, and strictly off the top of my head:
1B – Empty
2B – Prado/KJ – 5M combined
3B – Chipper – 15M
SS – Yunel – 1M (I think he is still less than that though)
C – McCann – 5M (I can’t remember what his extension contract gave him…I think it is backloaded though)
OF- McLouth – 7M?
RF – Diaz – 2M?
LF – Church – 4M
Bench – Ross – 2M
Bench – Infante – 2M
SP – Vaz – 12M
SP – KK – 8M
SP – Huddy – 9M
SP – Hanson – .5M
SP – Lowe – 15M
BP – Medlen – .5M
BP – Soriano – 8M
BP – Saito – 5.5M (Worst case, 3.5M best case)
BP – Wagner – 10M worst case, 7M best case
BP – Moylan – 1.5M?
BP – EOF – .5M?
BP – Logan – .5M?
That all totals up to about 105M without a 1B or 2-3 more bench players.
"My team of nine guys who hit like Albert Pujols and never ever bunt just beat your team with one Shane Victorino 472 to 3."
by justincredubil02 on Dec 8, 2009 9:46 AM EST up reply actions
not that it matters, but ur wrong (and u suck)
Chipper is making 13M
McCann is 5.5M
McLouth is 4.5
KK is 6.667M
which means we are at an even 100 M abouts
Heyward,Hanson,and Shaffer r ready now!! Why do you think they havent signed the "right handed bat"?
by fatazfoot on Jan 7, 2009 8:59 PM EST
dang…you gotta admit though, for early in the morning and without looking anything up, that was pretty damn good!
How’s that exam prep coming along? Are you finding good info here on TC?
"My team of nine guys who hit like Albert Pujols and never ever bunt just beat your team with one Shane Victorino 472 to 3."
by justincredubil02 on Dec 8, 2009 10:01 AM EST up reply actions
McLouth is over 10 M....
…iirc. And Church at 4 million is traded/non-tendered.
no McLouth is 4.5M
http://mlbcontracts.blogspot.com/2005/01/atlanta-braves_15.html
Heyward,Hanson,and Shaffer r ready now!! Why do you think they havent signed the "right handed bat"?
by fatazfoot on Jan 7, 2009 8:59 PM EST
Wow, I thought he was much more than that...
…although the site you link says 5.0 M.
That’s what makes him such a great deal for us – his price-tag is low.
"My team of nine guys who hit like Albert Pujols and never ever bunt just beat your team with one Shane Victorino 472 to 3."
by justincredubil02 on Dec 8, 2009 10:04 AM EST up reply actions
do u want to question me one more time about this….where are u getting these nbrs from?
Heyward,Hanson,and Shaffer r ready now!! Why do you think they havent signed the "right handed bat"?
by fatazfoot on Jan 7, 2009 8:59 PM EST
you just made me do a literal chuckle.
"My team of nine guys who hit like Albert Pujols and never ever bunt just beat your team with one Shane Victorino 472 to 3."
by justincredubil02 on Dec 8, 2009 10:06 AM EST up reply actions
I got 5 M...
…from the linked spreadsheet from the site you linked. For 2010 it says $5.0 M.
your link says 5.000
or maybe your screen shows a different table than me. But I read clearly “$5,000,000” next to McLouth under 2010, followed by “$7.000” for 2011, and “$1.250” under 2012 (which I assume is if we don’t take the option).
Huh?...
did you read that right? Maybe you were reading last year’s #, but what you just linked says $5, not 4.5.
we are looking at Nate McLouth right in 2010
unless my computer is playing tricks on me it clearly says 4.5
Heyward,Hanson,and Shaffer r ready now!! Why do you think they havent signed the "right handed bat"?
by fatazfoot on Jan 7, 2009 8:59 PM EST
this is his contract
09:$2M, 10:$4.5M, 11:$6.5M, 12:$10.65M club option ($1.25M buyout)
2010 & 2011 salaries may increase by $0.5M ($0.2M each for Gold Glove or All Star selection in previous season, $0.1M for Silver Slugger)
he didnt win any of those awards last year, so i dont know why he would get the increase..unless there is an unlisted provision which increases the salaries
Heyward,Hanson,and Shaffer r ready now!! Why do you think they havent signed the "right handed bat"?
by fatazfoot on Jan 7, 2009 8:59 PM EST
Well done.
Your website did say salary plus incentives. They just didn’t note that he had already failed to reach them. Where did you find the exact contract terms on there?
scroll down the page...
it has snippets on individual players in addition to the linked spreadsheet.
gotcha...
just saying the spreadsheet indicates different. So I got no clue which is the true assessment. Perhaps the Gold Glove and All Star appearance in 2008 added on to the other salaries and it’s a bump each subsequent year after he wins them. Perhaps his signing bonus was pro-rated and factors in each season.
I don’t know, but it’s curious how the site seems to contradict itself.
thats what i thought, too but thats not what the contract says…maybe they are just being conservative (although they have Soriano listed at 6.5 when its more liekly he gets the 8 he is seeking)
Heyward,Hanson,and Shaffer r ready now!! Why do you think they havent signed the "right handed bat"?
by fatazfoot on Jan 7, 2009 8:59 PM EST
that is not the actual contract...
if you’ve seen the real document, then by all means, I’ll take your word for it.
But that just says “previous” season, no immediately preceeding season, so he did win a GG and make an AS game in a previous season. So I guess it’d depend on the specific language there, but that $200,000 + $200,000 bumps you from $4.5 to $4.9 (or essentially five). It also makes no mention of how the signing bonus is doled out. It could very easily be prorated over each of the 3 guaranteed years (09/10/11), and splitting $1.5 between the 3 gives you exactly that $500,000 difference between the $4.5 listed salary and $5 mil number on the spreadsheet.
But basically, without seeing the actual deal, we don’t know what the specific language is, and while I appreciate Colt’s and feel it is probably the best source out there, it is by no means definitive and 100% infallible.
also...
I notice that Omar’s salary in the spreadsheet reflects his 2009 salary, not what they list as his 2010 salary on the main page. So clearly, the thing isn’t 100% accurate, or in the least hasn’t been fully updated yet. It’s a good source, but again, certainly not infallible.
I stand corrected.
Humbly. For once, don’t get used to it. ;)
Colts is always great....
Think you may be a little high on KJ/Prado, as well as Esco (although I wouldn’t be shocked if after we trade and make our moves, we focus on extensions of Esco, Jurrjens, and Hanson to buy out most of their arb eligible years). Shave off 2 from Chipper (13). McCann is a $5.667 (5 and 2/3). McLouth is 5, he bumps to 7 next year. I’d flip the numbers for Diaz and Church. Ross and Infante are a shade below 2 (Ross 1.6, Infante 1.85). Shave off another mil combined from Vasquez and KK. Again, the chances Saito and Wags both hit their incentives is slim, as the language seems to set it as an either not both situation, and it becomes almost non-existent if you add a 3rd potential shut down arm on the back end with Soriano.
That said, when you add 1B and the rest of the bench, you probably still end up a little over $100m depending on that 1B deal.
KJ/Prado – KJ will get about 3.5-4 through arb and Prado is at about 1M, right?
I could look it up, but I am too lazy at the moment…
"My team of nine guys who hit like Albert Pujols and never ever bunt just beat your team with one Shane Victorino 472 to 3."
by justincredubil02 on Dec 8, 2009 10:03 AM EST up reply actions
wouldn't Prado still be at the minimum?...
as Esco was this past year? That cuts him down to $400,000. And who knows what KJ gets, or if he works out a deal pre-arb. With his starting job last year taken away and the early slump taking his #s way down because of that lack of late playing time, I don’t think he gets quite the raise you indicate.
what does an arb hearing look at is it just ur previous seasons performance or is it an accumulation of your previous work or the past two years…. does anyone know?
Heyward,Hanson,and Shaffer r ready now!! Why do you think they havent signed the "right handed bat"?
by fatazfoot on Jan 7, 2009 8:59 PM EST
i think it’s pretty fair actually, i think the only reason the braves hang up first is if their set on a right handed bat
"Im a fullonrapist, I do men, women, autistic kids, children, the elderly." -Charlie Kelly
*they're
grammar police coming on STRONG
by apoxonbothyourhouses on Dec 8, 2009 8:35 AM EST up reply actions
Come on
I’m positive Frank Wren considered the possibility of Soriano or Gonzalez accepting arbitration, and I’m sure he had a backup plan in mind. Although now, if we can successfully deal Lowe, I’m all for keeping Soriano and our expensive bullpen.
Seriously though.. having Moylan/Soriano/Saito/Wagner to pitch the 6-9 innings is game over after 5. And I’m pretty sure all 6 of our current starting pitchers are capable of going 5 innings on under 2-3 runs every time out. So if we can get a bat that can help us score just a tad bit more, we’re fine. Remember this, our pitching staff is going to keep the score low – we don’t need to score a TON of runs, just more than we did last year, which isn’t hard to top.
it's not game over after 5
it’s more like:
6th inning 3 up 3 down
7th inning heart attack
8th inning heart attack
9th inning 3 up 3 down
which makes me wonder: why did we sign Saito again?
by apoxonbothyourhouses on Dec 8, 2009 7:10 AM EST up reply actions
I’m positive Frank Wren considered the possibility of Soriano or Gonzalez accepting arbitration, and I’m sure he had a backup plan in mind.
He may have “considered” it, maybe like you “consider” the possibility of getting into a car accident on your way to work. It’s not likely, but if it happens, it’s gonna really F up my day.
His quick trigger over the weekend with those signings sent a message that said “we’re replacing you both. Don’t accept arbitration.”
I actually think this is a brilliant move on both parts… I still think we could sign someone with sori accepting.. remember these are all one yr deals…. and if we sign someone decent for first and LF we will bring in the fans again which is what has been lacking in ATL for years now.. stagnant fans used to winning.. well we are not used to it anymore… personally we missed out when we didnt jump after figgins.. but whatever… our bullpen allows us to win games that we would’ve won last yr with this current setup… and lowe is a great pitcher who just needed to adjust to the national league… if we can strecth the payroll to 100-110 mil for one to two yrs of winning…hopefully management would accept. We need one OB% guy and yes a right handed ab.. I like cameron… and wouldnt mind dye…. I also think cameron and nick johnson would be good fits… hell i would take a flier on delgado for year and cameron for two…
to the guy who thinks Austin Jackson is all that
http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2009/12/yanks-tigers-dbacks-discussed-blockbuster.html
like i said, they don’t think that highly of him in the Yankees Organization.
by apoxonbothyourhouses on Dec 8, 2009 8:11 AM EST reply actions
really?...
they nixed the deal because they wouldn’t include him, so I guess that means they think he sucks?
they nixed the deal?
i thought they hedged at including Hughes?
by apoxonbothyourhouses on Dec 8, 2009 11:43 AM EST up reply actions
and
actually, they didn’t nix the deal at all
http://twitter.com/BloggingBombers/status/6467867251
so i guess that means they think he sucks. or sucks more than people think he does.
by apoxonbothyourhouses on Dec 8, 2009 11:46 AM EST up reply actions
ps
it was the Tigers who nixed it, fwiw. but i like that you think the Yankees are all powerful.
by apoxonbothyourhouses on Dec 8, 2009 11:46 AM EST up reply actions
I hope this deal goes down.
If the Yankees get Granderson, they won’t be interested in Cameron. That will lower Cameron’s price and I likey me some Cameron.
Why does being willing to trade a guy mean they think he sucks? That doesn’t make any sense.
I wrote a novel, it's about baseball, you should buy it: https://www.createspace.com/3407939
www.dropoutproductions.com
i never once said they think he sucks
i said that from the scouting reports I’ve read, they don’t think that Jackson will develop much power. thus, he’ll be a .260/.310/.440 player. In other words, Cameron-lite.
does that suck? no. is that top-20 prospect projection? no. thus, he’s expendable. that would be a GREAT #2 hitter in front of Heyward for 3-5 years.
by apoxonbothyourhouses on Dec 8, 2009 12:31 PM EST up reply actions
but they do say
his Defense will be +
by apoxonbothyourhouses on Dec 8, 2009 12:32 PM EST up reply actions
I don't want a .310 OBP guy...
…hitting anywhere near the #2 spot. The question with Jackson is whether the power develops. If it doesn’t I think he is more Melky Cabrera mark 2 rather than Cameron-lite—-Cameron’s OBP’s are better than .310.
I don’t want a .310 OBP guy hitting anywhere near the #2 spot.
Yup.
"SIGN PUJOLS OR FIRE WREN" ~ Swo12bv
by Smoltz's Beard on Dec 8, 2009 1:31 PM EST up reply actions
At this point, if Wren moves Lowe in a package deal (which I believe he will), and we get a right-handed bat, and Terry P digs a little deeper next year, and Chipper has one more really good year, 2010 could be the Return of los Bravos.
Somebody around here is more anal than the mom on 7th heaven. Freakin' A. lol
(self-appointed President of Yunel's Cartel~~~)
by Chief Noc-A-Homa on Dec 8, 2009 8:59 AM EST reply actions
That’s really the one I’m worried about moreso than the others. I guess John, Frank, and Bobby know something we don’t. I hate blaming streaky hitting on a pitching coach, but you have to blame somebody.
Somebody around here is more anal than the mom on 7th heaven. Freakin' A. lol
(self-appointed President of Yunel's Cartel~~~)
by Chief Noc-A-Homa on Dec 8, 2009 9:24 AM EST up reply actions
ugh. HITTING coach. still not fully awake yet.
viva la edit button
Somebody around here is more anal than the mom on 7th heaven. Freakin' A. lol
(self-appointed President of Yunel's Cartel~~~)
by Chief Noc-A-Homa on Dec 8, 2009 9:26 AM EST up reply actions
any possibility
Of moving Soriano to the Yankoffs for maybe Swisher? also possibly adding either KJ or DLowe to taht same deal, to sweeten it, or to clear cap space, or to get a few prospects/draft picks?
…for anyone other than Frank Wren, maybe.
Somebody around here is more anal than the mom on 7th heaven. Freakin' A. lol
(self-appointed President of Yunel's Cartel~~~)
by Chief Noc-A-Homa on Dec 8, 2009 9:41 AM EST up reply actions
Think about this. How awesome is our FO players and Bobby that Rafa wants to come back rather than go out and get paid a lot more. I’m pleased
(Yunel is still the Queen of Hearts)
by GoBravesNY on Dec 8, 2009 9:48 AM EST via mobile reply actions
I think he came back because they didn’t think he could get more…I doubt 3 years in an organization is enough for someone to get some severe loyalty.
"My team of nine guys who hit like Albert Pujols and never ever bunt just beat your team with one Shane Victorino 472 to 3."
by justincredubil02 on Dec 8, 2009 9:49 AM EST up reply actions
Yeah, it was strictly an economic deal.
The market was not developing for Soriano, so he took the safety of arbitration. Per Wren before he accepted, Soriano will probably agree to be traded. The question is whether the return is worth more than the draft picks we would have gotten.
Looks like that's what happened
Teams scared off by having to give up the draft picks, so this way he can get traded away and possible sign an extension. Could this start a new trend with fringe-all-star players accepting arbitration on the condition they are to be traded afterwards?
The bigger stars wouldn’t have to worry so much about this, but those fringe players could end up attracting more clubs this way.
I think the trend will be more like the Penny deal...
…in that deal, the Cardinals agreed not to offer him arbitration if he is Class A.
The only danger to the Braves here is we are at Soriano’s whim on trades—-if he doesn’t want to go to a crappy club, for example, he could block a trade to Baltimore.
Agreed
Not that this is a “loophole” but if compensation picks are becoming such a hindrance, we’ll see more of this accepting arb and hostage business and the contracts you’ve mentioned. Upsetting.
JC’s take one it: http://www.sabernomics.com/sabernomics/index.php/2009/12/did-sorianos-agent-find-a-way-around-draft-pick-compensation/
Am I the only one who wishes the Braves didn’t have to worry about hurting Asian players feelings by trading them away? It’d be kind of nice to keep Soriano for the 8th and trade Saito instead…
"Sometimes I wonder what'd it be like to be outside and not hear the birds chirping...I think it'd be kind of nice."
by alligatorimpersonator on Dec 8, 2009 11:25 AM EST reply actions
Aren’t there other restrictions regarding trading a free agent that you just signed?
"My team of nine guys who hit like Albert Pujols and never ever bunt just beat your team with one Shane Victorino 472 to 3."
by justincredubil02 on Dec 8, 2009 11:28 AM EST up reply actions
I am pretty sure free agent signees...
…cannot be traded at all until June. Besides, Saito wasn’t that expensive anyway. If is paying almost market value for two closers that we can’t really afford.
Can’t be traded, period. Unlike with Soriano where we can trade him with his permission, right?
"My team of nine guys who hit like Albert Pujols and never ever bunt just beat your team with one Shane Victorino 472 to 3."
by justincredubil02 on Dec 8, 2009 11:45 AM EST up reply actions
That is my understanding.
Free agent signees, no trades period; arbitration acceptors, trade only with permission.
haha oh yeah
forgot about that free agent no-trade rule.
"Sometimes I wonder what'd it be like to be outside and not hear the birds chirping...I think it'd be kind of nice."
by alligatorimpersonator on Dec 8, 2009 12:07 PM EST up reply actions
why?
Yu Darvish will be posted in a year or two and wouldn’t it be nice to say we have been kind to and understand Japanese players and can pay you exactly what you want as opposed to NYC or LA?
it may be manipulating, but heck, it’s baseball.
by apoxonbothyourhouses on Dec 8, 2009 11:48 AM EST up reply actions
We won't have the money to get Darvish.
He is going to be a big, big market signee. I see a Red Sox/Yankees bidding war there and I don’t think we want to get anywhere near that kind of situation.
i actually see LA
due to their Japanese and Iranian population(s). However, if they can’t get this divorce finalized, it will be a Red Sox/Yankees bidding WORLD WAR 3
by apoxonbothyourhouses on Dec 8, 2009 12:29 PM EST up reply actions
I cannot keep up with all this
It would be awesome to see a flowchart, but maybe someone can boil it down a bit for me on here.
See if I’m close:
If we had not offered him arbitration, we would have lost some draft picks. So we offered arbitration, gambling that he would not accept and would move on to free agent market. Now that he’s accepted, we are on the hook for $8 mil or so for a year. We cannot trade him until mid June, unless he consents. Then there’s something about more draft picks by trading him or something. Or we can release him after spring training with just cause. Are there more draft picks gained or lost by doing this?
Ahh help! My head hurts!
by KoKo the Monkey (T-Bone) on Dec 8, 2009 11:28 AM EST reply actions
You are pretty much right, except...
…now that he has accepted arbitration, there are no draft picks involved anymore. If we trade him, we get what we get for him. He also has to approve any trade before June 16th.
If he plays hardball
What if we just waited till that deadline and traded him? We’d be calling his bluff and could then trade him anywhere. This is assuming he intends to decline a trade that would really work for us in the mean time. This may stop this crap from happening again.
But that hurts us as well...
…if we can’t clear his payroll obligation, we can’t feel our other needs, most pressingly at first base. (We can always hope for the best in the OF with Heyward or Schafer.) If we can fill our needs without an off-season trade, then trading him at the deadline would be pointless unless we got something we wanted in return.
That all being said, he will likely agree to a trade to a team that would use him as a closer.
he'll definitely be traded...
think about it this way, for however high Mike Gonzalez was ranked on the FA closer list he’s going to be that much higher now that he’s arguably the only elite reliever left.
that means that after the huge “K-Rod-esque” contract he gets from one team as many as 3-4 other teams who lost out will prob be willing to overpay in players, prospects, or even cash to get Soriano from us later during the winter.
Valverde is still out there as well.
He declined arbitration last night.
true but he made 8 mil.
as opposed to Gonzo’s 3.5, which to me makes less sense because i dont think he’s gonna get that anywhere other than houston.
his numbers are pretty good though, so I could be wrong.
Easy to Rebut
Gonzo is up there, but Jenks is available on the trade market, as are others.
by Andy Braves Fan on Dec 8, 2009 12:26 PM EST up reply actions
If we include trade availability...
you have to add Cordero from Cinncinati. If someone would take that contract, they’d give him away for a bucket of balls.
All those
and the free agents = the Braves are going to get their pants pulled down trying to trade Soriano and get his salary off the books.
by Andy Braves Fan on Dec 8, 2009 2:32 PM EST up reply actions
maybe it's just me but...
i see gonzo being far more sought after than valverde, just because his stats at a glance are better, he’s a lefty closer, and has proven much more durable than he this past year.
but perhaps i made an overstatement saying that he’s the only elite reliever being that Jenks and i believe, Houston Street are also going to be out there
stats are better?
I’d argue against that. I think Valverde is still a small step above gonzalez and don’t forget, they are the same age.
Gonzo was already above Soriano...
If I recall correctly, the top 7 Class A guys went…
Holliday
Bay
Valverde
Damon
Gonzo
Lackey
Soriano
not positive on 1-4, but 5, 6, 7 are right, and Soriano has no impact on Gonzo’s ranking since he was already above him.
See if I’m close:
If we had not offered him arbitration, we would have lost some draft picks.
Not quite…We would not have LOST draft picks, but we would not have gained any if he signed elsewhere…
"If I have asthma, they won't let me scuba. And if I can’t scuba, then what’s this all been about?? What am I working toward??"
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