Where does Arodys rank?
by Rocky1013 on Dec 23, 2009 8:09 AM EST
30 comments
Where will he be falling in the ranks of our prospects? I will admit to knowing nothing about him, but if he was traded I would expect at this point he'll be 4th. There is a chance he is more highly thought of than Teheran, or slightly behind Minor.
Also does anyone else thinks this is also a positive for how far along they consider Minor in his development? He could be showing them a lot (composure, work ethic, and such) and saying that if injuries mount he would be available late this season to help out if pressed. I expect him to start off in AA this season, with a good shot to be the 5th starter in 2011.
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Do you rank Minor above Teheran?
I think scouts may praise Teheran a bit more than Vizcaino, but Arodys has a better minor league track record. Teheran’s body is a bit more projectable and it looks like his secondary stuff is a bit more advanced, but other than that I can’t think of any reason to prefer him to Arodys. I would tentatively rank Vizcaino as our best pitching prospect.
I mix your Melk with my cocoa puffs, Melky Melky cocoa puffs.
We several reports yesterday that said Vizcaino was similar to Teheran but a little behind him. I’d say for now it’s worth putting him behind Teheran, if only because we know Teheran and Vizcaino is a little unknown to us, and ahead of Minor, if only because Vizcaino’s ceiling seems higher.
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He's somewhere in the top 20...
his numbers sound similar to Robinson Lopez (21 here), Randall Delgado (7), and Julio Teheran (3). Delgado is a year older at 20 next season with Lopez, Teheran and Vizcaino being 19, but they all seem to have similar scouting reports (strong fastball that should improve as they physically mature, with secondary pitches in various stages of development). Vizcaino actually had numbers that look better than both Lopez and Teheran in both ERA and K/9, among others. I thought Lopez was a bit under rated, but that is 4 pretty strong arms for Rome/Myrtle next year. Those two staffs are gonna be disgustingly stacked.
I’d have him fourth behind Heyward, Freeman, and Teheran and right ahead of Minor
by McCann's the Man on Dec 23, 2009 12:15 PM EST reply actions
why? Minor I can somewhat understand because he’s safer and closer to the majors but Delgado?
by McCann's the Man on Dec 23, 2009 3:46 PM EST up reply actions
5th for me
Behind Heyward, Teheran, Freeman, and C. Betancourt. I could see a good argument for him being anywhere from 4-8, though. He’s certainly not a better prospect than Heyward, Teheran, or Freeman.
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Ben Badler from BA has him 3rd
just ahead of JT.
I used to like Frank Wren...not anymore. I want John Schierholz back!
Interesting.
Haven’t seen anybody else willing to put him ahead of Teheran.
Overheard in press box, from local reporter: 'If this Moore kid was any good, they'd be up 31-0 right now.'
--Darin Gantt, on CAR@NE
by MichaelProcton on Dec 23, 2009 9:08 PM EST up reply actions
Met that guy at a ballgame last year. He’s nice, but he’s wrong on this one.
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Why?
As far as I can tell, Teheran and Vizcaino are both very young and very highly touted. Vizcaino appears to have had better numbers, at least last year. I can certainly see Vizcaino being just above Teheran.
Haven’t seen Vizcaino, so I can’t really say with certainty, but everything I’m reading makes it sound like Teheran has better stuff. Results aren’t that important when you’re talking about 2 19 year olds who haven’t played a full season yet. Frankly, I hope this argument continues for the next 20 years while they’re battling with Tommy Hanson for the Cy Young every year.
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reply fail...
Vizcaino hasn’t had the shoulder issues Teheran has had, is listed a bit heavier so you assume thicker to handle the workload, and has a greater K/9.
The weight thing doesn’t matter much right now, since they’re both growing. Maybe when they’re 22 it’ll be something to revisit. And we don’t know what kind of injury issues Vizciano has has because we haven’t been following the Yankees minor leaguers as closely. You could make the argument that he had some issues this year because he only made 10 starts, compared to the 14 Teheran made. And this has nothing to do with Teheran ending up at Rome since the seasons end just about the same time. Teheran threw 81 innings this year, Vizcaino has thrown 86 in 2 seasons. Right now, Teheran is more durable.
As far as Ks, how about K/BB? Teheran, 3.82 compared to Vizcaino, 3.57. Still, stats aren’t as important.
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The great thing is,...
we have both. And Zeke Spruill, and Randall Delgado, and a healthy Brett Devall, and Robinson Lopez, and Carlos Perez, and Andy Otero, Mike Minor, JJ Hoover, Jacob Thompson, Cole Rohrbough, Tyler Stovall, Brett Oberholtzer, Matt Crim, Chris Master, Cory Rasmus, and Caleb Brewer. That’s a pretty good collection of starter, joining Jose Ortegano, as well as Tommy Hanson and Jair Jurrjens at higher levels at 23 or under.
I just got a baseball boner.
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I love this discussion.
I don’t know if I could rank the two—-Teheran and Vizcaino are very similar. Very young with very high upside. I love having two, because too many of those guys crap out. If they both make it and battle Hanson for Cy Youngs, that is just gravy. A very delicious gravy. I just might put Vizcaino ahead because of last year, but have no problem putting Teheran ahead. They are too similar to care who is in front of the other.
Yeah, this discussion is fun. My thing with last year is that Teheran pitched almost twice as many innings (81.1) as Vizcaino (42.1). Heck, Teheran had 37.2 innings for Rome, a level higher than Staten Island.
If we really want to look at the numbers, compare the Danville and Staten Island stats. At Danville, in 43.2 innings, Teheran had a 2.68 ERA, 0.98 WHIP, 7.4 H/9, 8 K/9, 5.57 K/BB compared to Vizcaino at Staten Island, 42.1 innings, 2.13 ERA, 1.15 WHIP, 7.2 H/9, 11.1 K/9, 3.47 K/BB.
Those are very comparable numbers, Vizcaino was striking out more guys, but fewer walks might indicate that Teheran has a little better handle on pitching right now. And, while they’re even at that level, the fact that Teheran was able to hold his own for almost the same amount of innings at a higher level is very impressive.
No matter how you slice it, lets be excited about these two guys.
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Not just those two guys...
but the near two dozen quality young arms we’ve got that should be starting next year in Mississippi, Myrtle, or Rome. I’m sure a couple clubs do, but it’s pretty tough for another organization in baseball to have a similar collection of talented starters coming up.
This so hard.
Overheard in press box, from local reporter: 'If this Moore kid was any good, they'd be up 31-0 right now.'
--Darin Gantt, on CAR@NE
by MichaelProcton on Dec 27, 2009 1:30 AM EST up reply actions
4th for me
Behind Heyward, Freeman, Teheran.. infront of Minor and Betancourt
- I miss Spooneybarger :(
shouldn’t, no way he comes in front of Heyward, Freeman, Teheran, Vizcaino, Betancourt, Minor, Delgado, Kimbrel, Spruill, Milligan, and Hoover. Plus there’s more that will likely come in front of him. As a guy whose ceiling is a SU man, he’s pretty limited as a prospect, but not without value
by McCann's the Man on Dec 25, 2009 12:52 PM EST up reply actions
Yeah, he’s kind of around the Todd Redmond territory. He’s talented and will be a contributor at the Major League level, but not a lot of long term star potential.
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I’d say he’s higher than Redmond just because he is left handed and he hasn’t been pitching all that long so the control should improve
by McCann's the Man on Dec 25, 2009 2:40 PM EST up reply actions
He’s also only a reliever, while Redmond is an innings eating starter. That would seem to cover the difference.
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Not in the bigs though...
Redmond may start for a Royals, Pirates or other club with no one else, but as a big leaguer, he seems best in a middle relief role. As relievers, Dunn seems to have the higher upside for left handedness and K stuff. He doesn’t seem like a Wagner or Gonzo and possible closer, but does look like he could be a top set up man as a lefty for the 7th/8th.
I’ve said numerous times in my reviews of him that I think Redmond will be best suited to the bullpen, but I’ve also said that he has the ability to be a back of the rotation innings eater, and that’s not just on a bad team, on any team he’d make a fine 4/5. Not on the current Braves team because our rotation is nuts, but he could if there was an injury. Dunn does not have this ability, he is strictly a reliever. If he can only provide half the possible innings that Redmond can, he’s inherently less valuable. If he has better stuff, which he does, then that probably splits the difference. Starters are more valuable than relievers, which is why teams always try to keep guys as starters before moving them to the pen.
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