Why not Eric Hinske?
by GouldisGold on Dec 18, 2009 8:49 PM EST
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I know we all want a big name to patroll right field to be the bridge to Heyward, or maybe even Heyward himself, but why not a low-cost platoon to keep his seat warm? Matt Diaz is a good player, but he can't hit righties that well, so he is best suited for a platoon role. What we would need is a guy who can hit righties well, and there is one available in Eric Hinske. He's not the flashiest player around, but he gets the job done.
Here are his stats: <http://mlb.mlb.com/stats/individual_stats_player.jsp?playerID=400134>
Notice the power he supplies. This past year he hit 8 home runs in just 190 at bats. He can also steal a few bases, too. He has had double-digit steals four times in his eight-year career. He can take walks, too, as his .336 career OBP against his .254 average suggests. And on top of his production, he will come very cheap. The Pirates signed him for about $850k last offseason, I believe. And if that isn't enough, he has been to the World Series three straight years.
I haven't heard his name mentioned much at all yet, and he is a possible solution. As I said before, we could platoon him with Diaz until Heyward gets the call, and I think that platoon would be productive.
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Hinske isn't a bad option...
…if we just want a bridge to Heyward that we can stick in a fourth OF/platoon with Diaz role. That way we can get the best first baseman we can without money as an object (assuming we move Lowe) and have the money not to worry about money demands of draft picks. I would be okay with that. Nady could do the same thing, but would be more expensive and harder to bump for Heyward.
Maybe as a stopgap soultion...
She’s coming off of Tommy John surgery and is prolly gonna want a multiyear contract tho. I’d rather have Hinske.
Wren Be Praised.
WWFWD?
by !Vive la Francoeur! on Dec 18, 2009 10:04 PM EST up reply actions
Franchise player.
"...Braves tie! ...Braves tie! ...Braves tie!"
by The Keith Lockhart Era on Dec 19, 2009 1:07 PM EST up reply actions
So all this talk about putting Diaz into a platoon role has me wondering this: What does this guy have to do to convince you folks that he has earned a shot at being a starter?
In 2009 his statline was .313/.390/.488, for an OPS of .878. In 425 PAs he hit 13 HR and drove in 58 runs. For his 7 year career he has hit .310/.358/.459/.817. Folks seem to fixate on his splits, saying he is weak against right-handed pitching. But in 2009 he hit .255/.349/.400/.749 against righties in 273 PAs. I can live with that, especially given all the left-handed pitching our division rivals will be sporting next year.
If the team decides that Heyward needs to stay stashed in AAA for the time being (maybe keeping his powder dry for a June call-up in 2010), he can play in RF, as evidenced by the 66 appearances he made at that position last year. If Heyward makes the team out of ST he can start in LF. Should Schafer make the team as a starting CF, McLouth becomes a possible trade piece.
Face it: Diaz has earned his shot as a starter next season. If it doesn’t work, we could always have McLouth take his place…or one of our other AAA prospects. Our as I said above, trade McLouth in a package for some other fill-in-the-blank player. In the meantime, take the money and sigh an 1B to be our “big bat.”
"Brian McCann will be guest starring as Bizarro in Smallville this fall. See, he has to put his glasses on to become Superman." -by Rhyno18 on Aug 4, 2009 5:52 PM EDT
If you wanna get technical, he was the starter in 2008, and that didn’t turn out too well. I’m all for giving him another shot, but to say that he never got a chance is just silly.
He deserves a shot more than McLouth does
McLouth does NOT need to be leading off, he doesn’t hit as well or get on base as well as MattyD, and his splits are even worse. Matt is at least mediocre against righties, McLouth against lefties hits to a .244/.318/.393/.711 line in his career, and last year he hit a paltry .230/.309/.379/.688 against them. It’s a fallacy that we consider Matty a platooner/backup but we act like Nate is an awesome everyday CF. In a perfect world, the two of them would platoon in left, but we need a centerfielder for that to happen.
Until and unless...
…we get another centerfielder, McLouth has to play every day or get spelled a few times by Infante. And the centerfielder market isn’t that good now that Cameron has signed. Actually, it pretty much sucks, with Marlon Byrd the overpriced but best one left on the market.
The thing is, he’s not even that great of a centerfielder. If Schafer has a good spring I’d rather see him get another shot out there, with Nate and Diaz platooning in LF (assuming Heyward wins his job). But I know reality will never work that logically. If Schafer has anything short of an astounding spring he’ll be in AAA to start the year, and the odds are 50/50 whether we have Heyward out of the gate. Marlon Byrd I do not want, and word is the Cubs are charging for him, so i hope they can get to him before FW can sign him. There really isn’t a CF option anywhere, unless you want to try your luck with Scott Podsednik or Coco Crisp, and I don’t. Unless Schafer earns his starts, I understand why we’re stuck with McLouth for defensive reasons, but that’s no excuse for allowing him to lead off. There are better candidates for that, and McLouth can hit anywhere from 6th-8th instead (maybe 5th against righties).
A guy who was 6th in the majors in UZR isn't that great of a CF?
How do you figure? Also, Byrd is apparently not a target of the Cubs. Podsednik is apparently closer with them than Byrd is, and Crisp is hot and heavy with SD. And, by the way, who is this leadoff savior you propose?
Overheard in press box, from local reporter: 'If this Moore kid was any good, they'd be up 31-0 right now.'
--Darin Gantt, on CAR@NE
by MichaelProcton on Dec 19, 2009 7:47 PM EST up reply actions
Diaz had a .390 OBP last year, Yunel was .377… Neither is the prototypical leadoff man, but both are big improvements over McLouth. Diaz has the speed to steal more bases, but we’ve never put him in a lineup spot that warranted trying to develop and use that part of his game. He might not steal quite as many as McLouth, but there’s a lot more to leading off than SBs, and the fact he gets on base more often (and thus sets the table) is a huge step in the right direction. Nate’s a middle-to-back of the order bat, he’s not suited for leading off.
You forgot to mention that he was dead last in CF defense in 08 according to the Fielding Bible. He’s not as bad as he was that year, but he’s not 6th best in the majors either. With his arm and offensive line, he profiles as a corner man/platoon mate, not a starting centerfielder.
Remember that Diaz's career OBP...
…is .358. We can’t expect a repeat of last season, but a solid .355-.365 OBP is probably sustainable. We just don’t have a great leadoff hitter on the roster, but that’s okay—-if we have a bunch of good but not great hitters we can cobble a decent run total together even without a great lead-off guy.
He’s a career .384 OBP against lefties, and Yunel is that weird brand of guy that hits better against righties than lefties, even though he’s right-handed, and he’s a career .382 OBP mand against righties. Both of those marks are better than McLouth, whose OBP against righties is .350 and against lefties is not worth mentioning. I know Bobby isn’t a fan of platooning a lineup spot like that, but having a couple of guys who get on base nearly 4/10 times at the top of the order would be a boon, especially compared to McLouth’s meager table-setting ability. I still don’t know if I truly want to see Yunel moved out of an RBI-type lineup position given how he developed and blossomed there last year, I’m just saying that the option is there, and I WILL say with confidence that there’s no excuse not to have Diaz leading off against every lefty. Period.
Yeah, Diaz had blazing speed...
ten years ago. But you’re right. McLouth is garbage. We should probably ship him out to make room for Brandon Jones.
Overheard in press box, from local reporter: 'If this Moore kid was any good, they'd be up 31-0 right now.'
--Darin Gantt, on CAR@NE
by MichaelProcton on Dec 19, 2009 10:13 PM EST up reply actions
I never said he was garbage. I said he has worse lefty/righty splits than Diaz, and doesn’t have the defensive prowess to stick in center. I said I’d rather give Schafer another shot at center and platoon Nate in left with Matty. He’s not garbage, but he is overrated. He’s pretty bad against lefties and doesn’t warrant an everyday job, least of all in the leadoff spot, with the numbers he puts up against almost half of the competition.
When we got McLouth,
I thought he was supposed to be a stud in the field. Didn’t he have a Gold Glove in center? Was that a Jeter-like GG or something?
"Sometimes I wonder what'd it be like to be outside and not hear the birds chirping...I think it'd be kind of nice."
by alligatorimpersonator on Dec 20, 2009 2:43 PM EST up reply actions
He did win a gold glove.
But nobody actually expected anything studly out of him. He’s above-average, but not super.
Overheard in press box, from local reporter: 'If this Moore kid was any good, they'd be up 31-0 right now.'
--Darin Gantt, on CAR@NE
by MichaelProcton on Dec 20, 2009 4:47 PM EST up reply actions
Actually, that was one of Wren’s selling points to the fans- “we got a gol glove centerfielder”- so I wouldn’t say that no one expected him to be good. And he’s not above-average. He’s got decent range but a pretty flimsy arm, and if you average his career defense according to the various metrics, he’s somewhere between a little below average to average.
Jeter-style gold glove. In 08 he was one of if not the worst fielding CFs in baseball, and I read a quote (months ago, forgot where) that his receiving that GG was one of the biggest blunders in the history of the award.
Still, nothing comes close...
…to Palmeiro winning it one year in the AL on reputation alone—-as he played about 20 games in the field and the rest as DH that year.
The Yankees now have three CFs: Melky Cabrera , Brett Gardner and Granderson. Cabrera and Gardner could be available. Both are plus defensive players.
The more I think about it, the more I like Cabrera. He’s a switchhitter with moderate extrabase power and only 25 years old. Career stats here.
What about Lowe (and all of his contract) plus a non-top 5 pitching prospect for Cabrera. Deal or No Deal?
Lot of scattered thoughts on this one- 1) If they have any interest in him at all, Lowe ought to get it done himself. Melky is no superstar, and he shouldn’t warrant additional prospects when they’re getting a highly serviceable MLB starting pitcher in return. 2) UZR has him and McLouth roughly equal defensively. 3) His splits are much nicer, not much difference between pitcher-handedness, but that doesn’t change the fact that his overall line is pretty underwhelming, except maybe his doubles power. All that being said, if we can get him to dump Lowe’s salary, I’d do it I think, beacuse we can maximize the effectiveness of McLouth and Diaz platooning them, he can hold down the back of the order (that is, the 8-hole) on any given day and you know exactly what to expect from him, but I think in the long run he’d turn into another Church- a servicable but unexciting regular who is keeping the spot warm for Schafer. Still though, that might be worth it to get rid of Lowe’s contract, depending on what if any other offers we get for Lowe.
Aren't corner OFs SUPPOSED to hit better than CFs?
Overheard in press box, from local reporter: 'If this Moore kid was any good, they'd be up 31-0 right now.'
--Darin Gantt, on CAR@NE
by MichaelProcton on Dec 19, 2009 7:40 PM EST up reply actions
My point being he’s not that great a defensive asset in CF, and probably belongs in left as soon as we can get a CF in place, and when/if that happens he’s ideally suited to platoon with a guy like Diaz given his splits, not start everyday. Hell, he shouldn’t start ANYWHERE every day given those splits, but he’s the everyday CF right now out of necessity.
2008? 140 plate appearances? Aren’t you one of the guys always getting on others about small sample sizes? Doesn’t it work both ways?
I wrote a novel, it's about baseball, you should buy it: https://www.createspace.com/3407939
www.dropoutproductions.com
He was playing every day before his blew his knee out. He was struggling against lefties, and doing absolutely abysmal against righties. He obviously would have improved his numbers against righties a little bit, but a 33% strikeout rate doesnt inspire confidence.
by bigjoe on Dec 19, 2009 5:38 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
I’m not saying he was playing well, or even that he would have improved, but to say that 42 games was “his shot” just seems silly, especially since he played well this year in more games. His shot was at the end of 09 and he succeeded.
I wrote a novel, it's about baseball, you should buy it: https://www.createspace.com/3407939
www.dropoutproductions.com
on a scale of 1 to suck
that sucks. the braves don’t need more so-so players. they need major production not patch work.
So Brian McCann, Javier Vazquez, and Tommy Hanson are so-so patchwork players? Give me a break, even with minor tinkering this offseason, the Braves are going to have one of the best pitching staffs in the majors, and an offense getting major contributions out of every position on the field, including notoriously weak positions like C, 2B, and SS. Not to mention, we’ve got some of the best prospects in all of baseball likely less than 6 months away from the bigs…some “patchwork so-so players” is exactly what the Braves need.
And with the exception of Holliday and Bay…the rest of the free agent pool is “patchwork so so players” so who are you proposing the Braves sign?
You do realize...
that we were 2nd in the NL in runs scored after the All-Star break after we rid ourselves of our huge lineup holes and replaced them with McLouth, LaRoche, Prado, and Church, right? With our starting staff and bullpen, we don’t need a player with “major production”, because we produce quite nicely with the guys that we have now (assuming we resign LaRoche and get an outfielder equivalent to Church).
As much as the Braves want someone like A-Gon or whoever, it really is unnecessary.
"Sometimes I wonder what'd it be like to be outside and not hear the birds chirping...I think it'd be kind of nice."
by alligatorimpersonator on Dec 20, 2009 2:51 PM EST up reply actions
Laroche the power answer for less then 12 million!
Above 12 million you have Bay and Holliday and many others by trade.
Laroche and someone like Nady, Dye or Swisher in the ouftield would make us contenders.
Gotta love that rotation and bullpen.
by Dutch Braves Fan on Dec 20, 2009 3:49 PM EST up reply actions
If we resign LaRoche and then get Swisher, that’s 50+ home runs right there. I still don’t understand why some people think we need just one “big bopper.”
"Sometimes I wonder what'd it be like to be outside and not hear the birds chirping...I think it'd be kind of nice."
by alligatorimpersonator on Dec 20, 2009 4:04 PM EST up reply actions
Way to go alligator,
Besides when one of the two get hurt you still have half the production. Of course if you sign Bay or Holliday and someone like Garko you will also have about 50 homers but if Bay or Holliday gets hurt you are stuck with a non producing bat.
by Dutch Braves Fan on Dec 21, 2009 6:21 AM EST up reply actions
A backup . . .
Hinske is a roster filler. He neither hits righties or lefties strong, both about the same. Decent fielder and bench player with a little bit of power. If they want him to take Norton swings and misses a who on the bench I could see that. To spell first, left and right, a little bit, but to be honest would rather see Infante get those ab’s. To platoon Diaz they need to find someone who hits righties a little and I believe that was why they were trying to trade with the Angels for Rivera.
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