Braves Sign Joe Thurston; Vazquez Won't Cross the Rocky Mountains
by gondeee on Dec 18, 2009 3:18 PM EST
in Free Agents
159 comments
A few tidbits of information today. First off, from Mark Bowman we learn that the Braves have signed light-hitting utility man Joe Thurston, who last year was with the Cardinals, to a minor league deal with an invite to spring training. Thurston is mainly a second baseman, but he's made himself more valuable in recent years be learning to play the outfield and most recently learning to play third base (though, not that well). He's played a tad bit of shortstop in the minor leagues, but mainly he'll be in camp competing for the second utility infield position.
In the same blog post, and later in a front page post, Bowman quotes a source who confirms that it is highly unlikely that Javier Vazquez would waive his no-trade clause to go to a West coast team. I tackled that rumor and debunked it last night, albeit with out a "source," I instead used logic. It's good to know that Javy is still interested in remaining in Atlanta beyond next season. I'd like to see that happen, but of course, all of this is predicated on the Braves moving Derek Lowe.
Speaking of Lowe, I expect that we'll begin to hear another team mentioned more frequently in trade rumors with Lowe -- the New York Yankees. They seem to be tackling one off-season priority at a time, and after acquiring Curtis Granderson and now signing Nick Johnson, many people expect them to focus on starting pitching. The Braves are rumored to have long been interested in Nick Swisher. If they can swing Lowe for Swisher, then that may free up the Yankees to go back and try to re-sign Johnny Damon, another move that is seemingly in the Yankees interest.
Another team that may be looking for more starting pitching is the Cubs, who just freed up a bunch of money by trading Milton Bradley. I'm not sure how they would match up in a trade with the Braves, though, as they don't seem to have any surplus at a position the Braves need to fill.
I also continue to hear that free agent Xavier Nady and the Braves are close to a deal, and that only lingering medical questions about Nady are holding up the deal. Getting Swisher and Nady would seem to wrap up the principal needs of the Braves off-season, and set us up with a good and deep team heading into spring training. One name that I haven't heard mentioned with the Braves, but one I'd like to hear mentioned is Troy Glaus. He's a year removed from a fantastic season, and while he would primarily play first base, he would be an excellent third base insurance policy against Chipper Jones getting injured.
The Braves front office also officially announced, via a press release, that the team has signed six minor league free agents this off-season. The list includes left-handed pitcher Mariano Gomez, catchers Orlando Mercado and J.C. Boscan, infielder Joe Thurston and outfielders Brent Clevlen and Mitch Jones. They join right-handed pitcher Scott Proctor, who signed in November.
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McLouth/Diaz
Prado
Chipper
Swisher
BMac
Escobar
Nady
Heyward
Looks pretty good to me.
In Frank Wren I trust.
(with Javy getting the ‘W’)
….crosses fingers.
Somebody around here is more anal than the mom on 7th heaven. Freakin' A. lol
(self-appointed President of Yunel's Cartel~~~)
by Chief Noc-A-Homa on Dec 18, 2009 3:30 PM EST up reply actions
…..and two, killer bunts.
Somebody around here is more anal than the mom on 7th heaven. Freakin' A. lol
(self-appointed President of Yunel's Cartel~~~)
by Chief Noc-A-Homa on Dec 18, 2009 3:38 PM EST up reply actions
I would say that if they get both Nady and Swish, then they keep Heyward in triple-A to start the season and let Diaz start in left, with Swisher in right. That provides more depth throughout the team and organization.
As long as Heyward plays the second half.
Somebody around here is more anal than the mom on 7th heaven. Freakin' A. lol
(self-appointed President of Yunel's Cartel~~~)
by Chief Noc-A-Homa on Dec 18, 2009 3:32 PM EST up reply actions
I would think so too
Plus, keeping MattyD in the lineup everyday makes us much more balanced…if not right-handed heavy. If McLouth hits leadoff and MattyD hits 6th, we would have a L/R/S/S/L/R/R/R
In Frank Wren I trust.
power and a high OBP. who else would do it better? BMac really isn’t a cleanup hitter.
In Frank Wren I trust.
I agree,
Swish isn’t horrible at 4th. I’d much rather see Glaus any day, but Swish puts up LaRoche-like numbers, except with a little lower BA, perhaps cuz he strikes out a little more than Rochie.
"Sometimes I wonder what'd it be like to be outside and not hear the birds chirping...I think it'd be kind of nice."
by alligatorimpersonator on Dec 18, 2009 3:37 PM EST up reply actions
Actually, the most comparable player to Swisher...
…I would think is Glaus. Glaus has shown more power, but they are both low batting average, high OBP guys.
good call
"Sometimes I wonder what'd it be like to be outside and not hear the birds chirping...I think it'd be kind of nice."
by alligatorimpersonator on Dec 18, 2009 4:02 PM EST up reply actions
Ignoring defense.
If Albert played in the AFL, they’d have to rename it the AZ/NM Fall League, based on where his homers landed.
Yes, ignoring defense...
…although it is hard to say how good Glaus is at first since he really hasn’t played it enough before.
But you also wouldn't assume he'd be much better than average.
Overheard in press box, from local reporter: 'If this Moore kid was any good, they'd be up 31-0 right now.'
--Darin Gantt, on CAR@NE
by MichaelProcton on Dec 20, 2009 2:48 PM EST up reply actions
Lineup
1 Escobar/McClouth
2 Escobar/Prado
3 Chipper
4 McCann
5 Swisher (1b)
6 Nady (RF)
7 Diaz/Escobar
8 Diaz/Prado
I’ll take that. Heyward steps in for Diaz at some point with he and Schafer spelling anyone in the OF.
by playertobenamedlate on Dec 18, 2009 3:38 PM EST up reply actions
Esco better not be hitting 1st or 2nd. He’s so much better when he’s agressive in the count and the top of the order isn’t the place for that.
In Frank Wren I trust.
Seriously. We’ve learned from our mistakes. Yunel bats near the bottom where, in turn, he cleans up.
Somebody around here is more anal than the mom on 7th heaven. Freakin' A. lol
(self-appointed President of Yunel's Cartel~~~)
by Chief Noc-A-Homa on Dec 18, 2009 3:44 PM EST up reply actions
My bad
Good point. McClouth then Prado.
by playertobenamedlate on Dec 18, 2009 3:49 PM EST up reply actions
I'd take an 886 OPS in the cleanup spot...
and it’s actually his best mark at any place in the lineup.
Overheard in press box, from local reporter: 'If this Moore kid was any good, they'd be up 31-0 right now.'
--Darin Gantt, on CAR@NE
by MichaelProcton on Dec 20, 2009 2:49 PM EST up reply actions
Who plays first? I hope ur kidding about this lineup. This line will not
Win the world series if that’s ur intent. We need a real cleanup hitter ppl!
Swisher, Nady,Juan Rivera, are not cleanup hitters. Below is the lineup we need;
Nate CF
Prado 2B
Chipper 3B
Haloday LF
BMac C
Rivera RF
LaRoche 1B
Escobar SS
P
We have to get rid of Lowe to do this
by AlRoBraves95 on Dec 20, 2009 2:21 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
I hope he works on halodays.
Overheard in press box, from local reporter: 'If this Moore kid was any good, they'd be up 31-0 right now.'
--Darin Gantt, on CAR@NE
by MichaelProcton on Dec 20, 2009 2:51 PM EST up reply actions
I couldn't come up with anything funny
Haloday sounds like some kind of x-box tournament, but it wasn’t really relevant.
You’re suggesting that the Braves get Rivera, LaRoche, AND Holliday? We must have got rid of Lowe and Vazquez then, either that or Ted bought the team.
And plus, we don’t need that lineup to compete. I’ve posted this before, but the Braves were 2nd in the NL in runs scored after the all-star break in ‘09, after getting rid of all of the holes in our lineup. With our pitching staff and 2nd in the NL run production, we don’t need Holliday, Rivera, and LaRoche.
"Sometimes I wonder what'd it be like to be outside and not hear the birds chirping...I think it'd be kind of nice."
by alligatorimpersonator on Dec 20, 2009 2:56 PM EST up reply actions
Isn’t the Cubs getting Carlos Silva, who is actually owed more money ($24MM versus $21MM). How is that saving them money?
Other than that, good write-up.
-Yellow Jackets, Braves, Falcons, Hawks, and Thrashers fan!
You’re right, but the Mariners gave the Cubbies 9 million in cash I believe.
"Sometimes I wonder what'd it be like to be outside and not hear the birds chirping...I think it'd be kind of nice."
by alligatorimpersonator on Dec 18, 2009 3:38 PM EST up reply actions
because Silva might play for them, unlike Bradley
and I believe they are getting a good bit of money.
Just wondering
IF we got Nady and Swish, who would play 1B and who would play LF? Would Nady man 1B cause of his surgery?
In Frank Wren I trust.
I think that could go either way.
I don’t think there is much fielding difference, but Nady might need to play first early on if his arm is not totally recovered enough to throw from the OF. Since Swisher can play right, it would probably by Nady at first, Swisher in right, and Diaz in left.
Swisher is the better defensive guy
Nady has never been very good defensively. I’d stick him at first base.
Plus an extra 50 points of career slugging. And I suspect that he’s got a good chance of finishing above his career averages next year, if not quite as good as 2008. Not really any evidence to support it, but a suspicion that his career year wasn’t that far above his true talent level.
He’s definitely an offensive upgrade over Kotchman, but not as good as LaRoche. But with his health situation, he’s almost certainly cheaper than LaRoche, even with Boras representing him.
not necessarily by market standards
nobody is saying he is an elite first basemen, but with the other available options he could prove to be a great bargain in that he will most likely outperform his contract.
if you look at him as a prototypical 1B then his bat is a little light but compared to some of the options that are out there, (especially with some of the unreasonable asking prices) for the he has a chance to give the most bang for your buck.
basically all i’m asking is if you’d rather have LaRoche @ 10mil or Nady @1-2mil in this particular case I’d take Nady
The thought of losing Vazquez makes me sick.
The Braves really need to do all they can to hang on to Javy and re-sign him to a long-term deal. Vazquez would be a great ace to our young studs and is much better than keeping Lowe. Obviously I’m preaching to the choir and most of you agree with that. As for Troy Glaus, I think his health would be an issue seeing as he missed 132 games with shoulder surgery and hurt his oblique when he returned from that last year.
Nady is the same thing. I worry about his ability to stay healthy and how bad we would be if he turns out not to be healthy with money tied up in him. I’ll re-state what I said on a Fan Post last night in that I would be happy with an outfield of Diaz, McClouth and Heyward. The Braves really need to go after a power first baseman. Heck, if the Sox end up acquiring Gonzalez from San Diego, then re-sign LaRoche. At least he’s a reliable option that proved to be a tremendous boost to our lineup next year.
That's a good question...
I like Nady healthy too, but he scares me. I think he had the operation in June-ish (I could be wrong), and the surgery usually takes 12-14 months to recover. Not only that, but he had multiple ligament replacement, which has a lower success rate.
"Sometimes I wonder what'd it be like to be outside and not hear the birds chirping...I think it'd be kind of nice."
by alligatorimpersonator on Dec 18, 2009 3:52 PM EST up reply actions
The last I heard about him was that he was going to start working out in February but it didn’t say when he would be ready to play.
As of October, he was supposed to be full go by the start of ST.
Overheard in press box, from local reporter: 'If this Moore kid was any good, they'd be up 31-0 right now.'
--Darin Gantt, on CAR@NE
by MichaelProcton on Dec 20, 2009 2:54 PM EST up reply actions
He could have been ready a lot earlier because he hurt the elbow on April 15th but didn’t have surgery until late June. I would assume he would be back in late May early June. This is also his second surgery on that elbow. He another in 2001.
Oh...
And TJ isn’t as big a deal for position players (particularly if he’s playing infield) as it is for pitchers. I’ve seen as little as nine months needed.
Overheard in press box, from local reporter: 'If this Moore kid was any good, they'd be up 31-0 right now.'
--Darin Gantt, on CAR@NE
by MichaelProcton on Dec 20, 2009 2:54 PM EST up reply actions
I’ll pass on Swisher. His OBP would be good but an AVG around .250 is not that appealing. You pay guys like that to get hits and drive guys in not to walk. He is a terrible hitter with RISP hitting just .227 with 3 HR’s in 119 at bats and 20 of his 29 HR’s were solo. I know that trading Lowe will be tough but I would rather add a prospect and get someone better than take Swisher.
im not crazy about him either
but if we could get him for DLowe, I’d be all for it.
In Frank Wren I trust.
I disagree.
I don’t think hitting with RISP is more than statistical noise; players, over the long run, tend to have numbers in line with their career averages, it is more a luck thing. (For example, don’t expect Escobar to be nuts with RISP this year like he was in 2009.)
I also think you are discounting the value of walks in the middle of the line-up. If he walks that means McCann (usually) gets to bat with even more runners on base. I think the most productive way to structure a lineup would be to put the guy who doesn’t walk last among your capable hitters (i.e. 8th is you have a loaded lineup, or 7th if say Diory is playing) because then a walk doesn’t help as much because the person hitting behind is fairly worthless. But batting fourth and walking gives the number 5 hitter more chances, which is a good thing if your #5 hitter is good.
dunno, but I’d bet that if one actually undertook a detailed statistical analysis, although most players would have long-term RISP numbers closely in line with their career batting averages, a significant minority of players would be identifiable as true clutch, exceptionally good run producing hitters.
I disagree
I would bet that you better hitters actually have a better AVG with RISP than without. I know for me it always added an extra incentive and my BA with bases empty was by far the lowest of all my BA statistics.
If you weren't trying your absolute best every at bat...
…why were you playing at all?
What is the point?
Overheard in press box, from local reporter: 'If this Moore kid was any good, they'd be up 31-0 right now.'
--Darin Gantt, on CAR@NE
by MichaelProcton on Dec 20, 2009 2:56 PM EST up reply actions
If RISP hitting could make a player.
Francoeur wouldn’t suck.
Overheard in press box, from local reporter: 'If this Moore kid was any good, they'd be up 31-0 right now.'
--Darin Gantt, on CAR@NE
by MichaelProcton on Dec 20, 2009 2:56 PM EST up reply actions
Hell I’ll take Swish just in the club house. That guy could be an interesting spark in the Braves club.
by McCann and McWill on Dec 18, 2009 4:47 PM EST up reply actions
You pay them to have successful ABs.
A walk gets another baserunner and moves any other guys on base forward. I see that as plenty successful.
Overheard in press box, from local reporter: 'If this Moore kid was any good, they'd be up 31-0 right now.'
--Darin Gantt, on CAR@NE
by MichaelProcton on Dec 20, 2009 2:55 PM EST up reply actions
I agree about Lowe
We need his bad contract off the books, even if we just get prospects in return. The prospects could still allow us to put together a good trade for a first baseman better than Swisher.
I totally agree.
If we can get all of Lowe’s contract off the books, maybe we could make a push for Bay. I would still be unlikely, but at least possible.
I don't think Bay is a good fit.
He wants too many years and is already defensively challenged. By the end of his contract, it would be an albatross.
But...
The Mets think he plays good defense. I mean, he played center field for the Pirates back in 2006.
That's good.
They can sign him and be stuck with the bad contract in a couple of years. It wouldn’t be the first stupid contract that the Mets have doled out, lol.
Let's see...
Beltran, Delgado, Santana, K-Rod, Perez, Castillo
What do all those guys have in common, besides bad contracts? HAHA!
Fondness for Thai food?
Overheard in press box, from local reporter: 'If this Moore kid was any good, they'd be up 31-0 right now.'
--Darin Gantt, on CAR@NE
by MichaelProcton on Dec 20, 2009 2:57 PM EST up reply actions
The best part about getting Nady and Swisher (hypothetically speaking) would be the flexibility of both players to play 1st, and OF
I thought hurricane season was over........
Trade targets?
The whole dump Lowe and pursue someone else worries me. I’m just not sure who is out there for us to sign or trade for any more.
I’ve got us out of the market for Holliday and Bay and no one else on the FA market is really an impact bat. Figgins has signed. Nick Johnson has signed. Garret Atkins has signed.
For trades I doubt we could get Adrian Gonzales or Miguel Cabrera. Who am I missing as a trade target? Is Dye much better than Swisher?
Derosa? Glaus? I’ve read eveything I can put my eyes on with this blog, DOB’s and Bowmans and nobody out there really excites me. A Swisher Nady combo is my favorite realistic option.
I have this worry in my gut that we’ll get stuck without a chair when the music stops and wind up with someone like Garret Anderson again.
by playertobenamedlate on Dec 18, 2009 3:57 PM EST reply actions
There are plenty of other options out there...
…LaRoche, Delgado are the most obvious ones. I would be okay with Nady and Swisher, if only because we have Heyward waiting in the wings and between the two of them we should get at least one solid first baseman.
We do need to dump Lowe because we can’t afford what we need with his salary on the books. The sooner we can, the more players still available, the better.
Delgado can straight mash
do you know what his health situation is?
"Sometimes I wonder what'd it be like to be outside and not hear the birds chirping...I think it'd be kind of nice."
by alligatorimpersonator on Dec 18, 2009 5:23 PM EST up reply actions
He was supposed to have started playing in the PRWL recently...
But I can’t find any appearances listed for him.
Overheard in press box, from local reporter: 'If this Moore kid was any good, they'd be up 31-0 right now.'
--Darin Gantt, on CAR@NE
by MichaelProcton on Dec 20, 2009 3:00 PM EST up reply actions
Nady's is not an answer...
…to all of our problems, but a good stop-gap OF until Heyward is ready, which could be as soon as opening day. Then, he makes a pretty good fourth OF/back-up first base type.
But he had one really good offensive 1H!
If Albert played in the AFL, they’d have to rename it the AZ/NM Fall League, based on where his homers landed.
Or,...
5 seasons over 300 at bats, 3 have been a little above average, and another very good, with the remaining season his first full year. He’s had more than one good first half.
Agreed. I always look for sub-1 WARs for my corner outfielders.
If Albert played in the AFL, they’d have to rename it the AZ/NM Fall League, based on where his homers landed.
Last healthy year,...
his WAR was a 4. If healthy, he’s a nice bridge to Heyward.
by Mr. Sanchez on Dec 19, 2009 12:35 AM EST up reply actions
Yes, he had one great half a season that produced a WAR well above anything he’d ever produced before.
WAR takes into account defense as well as offense..
take a look at what he does at the plate, it’s not “worthless”. It’s above average. He’s nothing like Casey Kotchman, who got much of his value defensively and was a drain at the plate. Nady, when healthy, is a solid hitter. If healthy, he’s at worst an average player to fill a spot until Heyward arrives before moving to the bench. At best, he’s an OPS over .850. Not healthy, Heyward comes up sooner. At $1-3m, he’s a good risk/reward.
in 05, 06, and 07 his OPS+ is
104
102
108
By the very definition of OPS+, that makes him above average at the plate.
See here....
http://www.hardballtimes.com/main/statpages/glossary/#ops+
“An OPS+ over 100 is better than average”
How do you figure he’s “awful and will be a complete waste of money”, especially considering you don’t know how much money he’d cost? To compare his to Kotchman is absolutely laughable.
Ah, using 100 OPS+ as the average for a corner outfielder. Great idea.
Other “above-average” outfielders from 2007 include:
Luis Gonzalez, 104
Austin Kearns, 103
Shawn Green, 103
Jeff Francouer, 102
If Albert played in the AFL, they’d have to rename it the AZ/NM Fall League, based on where his homers landed.
derived mostly from his ability to get on base...
not hit for power. They’ll be in different spots, asked to provide different things. One is better at giving that than the other. If you think Nady and Kotchman are comparable offensively, then enjoy.
“By the very definition of OPS+, that makes him above average at the plate.”
“http://www.hardballtimes.com/main/statpages/glossary/#ops+
"An OPS+ over 100 is better than average"”
If you don’t value the ability to get on base, then you probably shouldn’t be using a stat that derives a big chunk of it’s value from the ability to get on base.
thank you for failing to see what was said...
similar ops+ derived in a different manner. But if you can’t see the different between Kotchman and Nady, then leave your head up your ass.
LOL
I love the way that you’ve gone from latching on to OPS+ as PROOF that Nady is above average to dismissing it when it shows something that you don’t like.
“B-but, they got the stat in different ways!”
The entire point of OPS+ is to show the relative offensive value of a player. How they get that value is irrelevant to the final result of the stat. If you think OPS+ is evidence that Nady was “above average” offensively then you also have to accept that Kotchman’s shows that he was also “above average” offensively.
which the stat shows...
Kotchman was above average by OPS+ because h’es excellent at getting on base, and though he lacks slugging he’s good enough at getting on base to make up the difference. Nady gets it in the opposite manner, he’s not that good at getting on base but can hit with pop, so the slugging covers the on base. Both “above average” according to that stat, but for different reasons. And the reason that matters to us is we are wanting someone with slugging more than obp, thus Nady is a better fit.
Neither is a good fit, that’s why we got rid of Kotchman in the first place.
League average production out of First Base is actually below average for the position.
Who said he's 1B?...
Personally, if he comes out like he did that half season in Pittsburgh, he can play all year. Otherwise, I’d assume he’s the half season space filler until Heyward/Schafer are ready before becoming a nice bench piece the other half.
He’ll play 1B because we have OF options but no 1B options, he’s also coming off his second TJ, so it’s probably not in his best interests to be in the OF right away either.
How much do you think he’ll sign for?
If he’s getting signed to start (at the begining of the season), you can bet that Boras is going to make sure he gets his guy paid like a starter and not a bench player.
And then there’s Bobby. Cox isn’t going to dump a vet bat from his lineup for a kid. Once you sign Nady, you have to assume that he is going to start the entire season, no matter how he plays.
his pay depends on demand...
not what Boras wants him to make.
And he may start at 1B, but I doubt he starts 150 games there.
"Cox isn’t going to dump a vet bat from his lineup for a kid."
Johnny Estrada, Brian Jordan, and Marcus Giles all disagree.
Overheard in press box, from local reporter: 'If this Moore kid was any good, they'd be up 31-0 right now.'
--Darin Gantt, on CAR@NE
by MichaelProcton on Dec 20, 2009 4:53 PM EST up reply actions
The only one who lost his starting job during the season was Jordan, and that was due to injuries as much as anything.
Estrada and Giles both remained the regular starter until the FO moved them after the season.
Fair point.
Of course Mondesi was Francoeur bad out there, and was still our regular RFer for 2 months.
Hi Raul!
How’s the politial career going?
If Albert played in the AFL, they’d have to rename it the AZ/NM Fall League, based on where his homers landed.
Pretty well, apparently.
He’s still in Congress in the DR.
Overheard in press box, from local reporter: 'If this Moore kid was any good, they'd be up 31-0 right now.'
--Darin Gantt, on CAR@NE
by MichaelProcton on Dec 21, 2009 9:44 PM EST up reply actions
That depends on how much money he costs.
If he signs for $2-3 million, that wouldn’t be so bad. I would cringe if the Braves paid him $5 million plus. That would not be good.
Cubs need more pitching? They just got Carlos Silva. WTF were they thinking.
Just saw the Mets signed Dessens.
Here are Pujols's stats: 1.000/1.000/4.000/5.000. That's right. He is batting a thousand, with a thousand OBP (naturally), and every hit has been a home run, and thus his OPS is a perfect 5.000.
Yes he is
Born and raised in Mexico, IIRC.
If Albert played in the AFL, they’d have to rename it the AZ/NM Fall League, based on where his homers landed.
Who would you want
Silva or Dessens? Or Mark Redman.
Here are Pujols's stats: 1.000/1.000/4.000/5.000. That's right. He is batting a thousand, with a thousand OBP (naturally), and every hit has been a home run, and thus his OPS is a perfect 5.000.
regarding swisher, nady, glaus, papa smurf...
any combination of the 3 provides flexibility for many positions and still leaves room for heyward on the opening day roster. glaus, nady, chipper, and heyward are all going to need their share of off time. diaz performs best when he’s primarily hitting lefties and spot starting on righties. the best case scenario would be the following:
1. braves trade for swisher:
2. braves sign glaus:
3. braves open the roster with heyward on the team.
chipper, glaus, heyward, and diaz play 80% of games (130/year on a rotational/matchup basis). heyward starts in right against all righties. diaz starts in left vs. all lefties. swisher rotates between left, right, and first, giving ample rest to 4 players. swisher gets a day off once every 5 games.
chipper, heyward, diaz, and glaus all end the year with 450-500 at-bats and ready to kick ass in the playoffs.
lineup:
mclouth
prado
chipper
glaus
swisher
mccann
heyward
escobar
bench: diaz, mitchum jones, infante, ross, thurston?
payroll: less than 92 million.
My opinion cant be wrong. It's my opinion. Those who don't like it can piss up a rope.
all good points…but if heyward is up, he’s playing everyday, in no way is he a platoon player and he needs as many AB’s as possible in his first major league season…he’s only had around 800 minor league AB’s, so its kind of scary how good he could after 600 or so more AB’s…just in time for the postseason :)
"Im a fullonrapist, I do men, women, autistic kids, children, the elderly." -Charlie Kelly
only righties?
I am on the train, but what is the logic of starting Heyward against righties and sitting him against lefties? If he is going to be our premier player for the next decade, he needs to hit lefties and sitting on the bench isn’t going to make that happen.
Were his minor league splits that bad?
If we want Diaz in against lefties, there should be a better way to do that than bench Heyward.
by hollerin' brave on Dec 18, 2009 5:11 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
regarding heyward...
as far as body is concerned, heyward is young enough that he can probably withstand a 162 game season, but i disagree that heyward will be starting everyday if he is on the team. getting acquainted to a 162 game season has to be hard on a rookie, especially a 20 year old, not physically, but mentally. bringing the kid up and giving him 450-500 at-bats is not the worst idea in the world.
heyward doesnt just start againts righties. if glaus sits, swisher goes to 1b, heyward starts. on lefties, heyward gets all starts. days when swisher sits, heyward starts. days when chipper sits, heyward starts. days when diaz sits, heyward starts. in my plan, heyward starts about 80% of the time, and is power off the bench for the other 20 percent.
5 players for 4 positions: chipper, heyward, diaz, swisher, glaus
each starts 4 out of 5 games and each is power off the bench for the other game. aside from what will be an obvious injury to one of those players, its a flawless plan. on a 4 plate appearance average, each player would receive between 480-540 plate appearances for the year.
My opinion cant be wrong. It's my opinion. Those who don't like it can piss up a rope.
I disagree.
I think it’s funny how people think Heyward will make an immediate impact. I realize that he is destined for stardom, but he’s only 20 years old. Justin Upton, for example, got called up when he was 19, and he struggled badly. He is starting to come around, but he’s been in the league for over 2 years now.
My point is that we should probably just play it safe and start Heyward in AA or AAA. If he gets called up and struggles, it could ruin his confidence.
I don’t think the Braves will bring Heyward up before he is ready, and I don’t think that even if he struggled that it would ruin his confidence. Heyward is regarded by many as having a really good head on his shoulders. Here’s a quote from him:
“Mentally, for one you’ve got to always understand it’s just a game,” Heyward said. “The struggles you have, it’s an opportunity to learn, make an adjustment. You take it as it comes at you. I trust my swing, my abilities, my hands. The mindset going in, the way you get more comfortable, is knowing you’re going to get another opportunity.”
(taken from si.com)
"Sometimes I wonder what'd it be like to be outside and not hear the birds chirping...I think it'd be kind of nice."
by alligatorimpersonator on Dec 18, 2009 10:47 PM EST up reply actions
Heyward isn't your average prospect
I feel like he will have an immediate impact, much like Hanson has had. Heyward is not your every day prospect and has lit it up everywhere he’s been. I say he makes the opening day roster and packs an immediate punch in our lineup.
by WNWDOTCOM on Dec 19, 2009 11:52 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
He isn't going to start in AA.
That’s for sure. He was in AAA at the end of last season (true, AA had finished), and, let’s face it, he has absolutely nothing left to prove at AA. He’ll be in Gwinnett or Atlanta after we break camp.
Agreed… I think the guy needs to play for Atlanta on day 1. All the signs are there that the Braves want to do this very badly and for the past 6 months they have been trying to down play it.
-----
Braves Fan Since 1982. Go Braves!
"All opinions welcome..."
By the way… All the signs are there for Kimbrel as well. They brought him all the way up to AAA in 2009. Clearly the guy has the arm, and I believe he can strike out major league hitters right and left now—the question is whether or not he has the control to perform at the major league level.
-----
Braves Fan Since 1982. Go Braves!
"All opinions welcome..."
I think it will come down to spring training for both of them
If Heyward mashes, he start in Atlanta. Likewise, if Kimbrel shows good or even decent control, he gets the last spot in the pen. If he has control like he did in the AFL, he starts in Gwinnett.
It's probably also important to note that he struggled with nagging injuries for a decent part of last year.
Overheard in press box, from local reporter: 'If this Moore kid was any good, they'd be up 31-0 right now.'
--Darin Gantt, on CAR@NE
by MichaelProcton on Dec 20, 2009 3:04 PM EST up reply actions
There are two points there...
…one is that he got them, which most players do from time to time. The second is that the Braves were in all likelihood very conservative with him and he would have played through those types of injuries in the majors.
And then we have Jordan Schafer 2.0?
Overheard in press box, from local reporter: 'If this Moore kid was any good, they'd be up 31-0 right now.'
--Darin Gantt, on CAR@NE
by MichaelProcton on Dec 20, 2009 9:48 PM EST up reply actions
Delgado..
There’s not alot of guys that are out there that could be plugged into the 4th spot for us. Delgado is one of the very few. Yes, he was injuried last year but he is a year removed from a 38 HR year, 115 RBI’s and a line of .271 .353 .518. He’s been decently healthy throughout his years. I think he’d be extremely motivated to get back at the mets and NL East. He’d provide protection for Chipper and BMac would excel behind him. I think he would take a 1yr with a option for a 2nd. Was recently injured with his him so his cost i would imagine be in the single digits. Yea so what he lefty he’s would be the bat we would need and the corner spots in the outfield could be filled by RH’ers.
I'd take him, but not for anything long-term
He might work out for 2010 but I wouldn’t want him any longer than that. If he could play anywhere near where he was in 2008 (or 2006) I think he would be a tremendous asset for us. He could hold 1B until Freddie Freeman gets the nod to the majors.
Agreed but only if both are signed.
I believe the time is now and with the Angels seeming as if they are willing to sit around and not get anyone for their rotation that can be a top 3 rotation starter then I think it is time to shift gears to the Yankess.
Trade D. Lowe to the Yankees for Swisher str8 up as suggested here and I think the Nady signing is a lock assuming that Nady is healthy (elbow) and the combo and not Swisher alone would replace a RH Power Bat to bat 4th. The idea of Swisher or Nady carrying this team alone from the 4 hole is crazy.
A lineup with Nady and Swisher would be nice for sure but only if they are both added to the team and not one or the other alone.
by Holty_Panthers_Fan on Dec 18, 2009 9:50 PM EST reply actions
How does Swisher for Lowe provide salary relief to the Yankees?
I think a more likely scenario is getting Juan Rivera from the Angels and being forced to take Gary Matthews, Jr. as well.
by ClaudellWashington on Dec 19, 2009 12:09 AM EST reply actions
lol
Wren would be forced take GMJ’s contract in return for Lowe? I think not
by SmithnCompany on Dec 19, 2009 8:27 AM EST up reply actions
Since this is on the subject of Minor League news, both Juan Perez and Brian Barton have signed Minor League deals with the Dodgers, so neither will be returning to the organization.
I wrote a novel, it's about baseball, you should buy it: https://www.createspace.com/3407939
www.dropoutproductions.com
Thurston
Thurston has more than decent minorL #s .295BA/.380OBP, and
ok SO/BB ratio. Plays the entire field. 2009 was the only year where
he played ML for any length of time. for the role he would be competing
for, behind Infante, he could be a low cost addition to the bench.
I suspect Diory Hernandez and a few others may be in the mix
yet I am not convinced he deserves the light hitting label as yet.
History twisted
Before the 91 season we got another infielder from the Cardinals…one who provided clutch hitting, a little pop and clubhouse leadership. Oh if we could be so lucky, again!
Sorry just had to pull out the rose tinted glasses a little. The hurdle that is the Phills is just getting a little higher and though I have not gone into the panic mode the Clock on the wall is ticking….what will FW decide to do?
by bravestatoo on Dec 20, 2009 11:12 AM EST up reply actions
Aight aight. I see you. I'd do the same thing....
MATT DIAZ IS THE F**K*NG MAN.
They made me change my signature...
God damn
You just know there’s absolutely nothing going on when a blog doesn’t even have a single thing to write about.
Frank Wren, you’re pissing me off.
In Frank Wren I trust.
You know most front offices close up between XMas and New Year’s, right? Not gonna be a lot going on for awhile.
I wrote a novel, it's about baseball, you should buy it: https://www.createspace.com/3407939
www.dropoutproductions.com
I want Frank workin the phones 24/7/365!
Ha, just kidding. And yeah, I figured things would slow down for a week or two. It’s just a pain cause we haven’t really adressed any of our off-season concerns besides put two near-40 year olds in the bullpen.
In Frank Wren I trust.
Would the Braves take Melky Cabrera and a prospect for Lowe? They might.
- Tim Brown
Somebody around here is more anal than the mom on 7th heaven. Freakin' A. lol
(self-appointed President of Yunel's Cartel~~~)
by Chief Noc-A-Homa on Dec 19, 2009 9:21 PM EST reply actions
If they took on all of Lowe’s salary, absolutely.
by get swoll yunel on Dec 19, 2009 11:04 PM EST up reply actions
thats the thing
if any team agrees to take his whole contract, we should accept the deal, no questions asked.
In Frank Wren I trust.
Fox belongs in the AL where he went.
He can’t field, but he can hit.
Damn you Joe Thurston,
I keep needing a glass of water whenever saying your last name. If you make it to the big league club as a bench player/whatever, its gonna be a long year for me with multiple trips to the bathroom
I is for I can't wait for spring to get here- Matty D
(Yunel is still the Queen of Hearts)
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