Talking Chop 2010 Community Top-25 Braves Prospects

by gondeee on Dec 14, 2009 11:00 AM EST in Prospect Reviews Comment 84 comments

Every year the community members here at Talking Chop are asked to submit their own top-25 Braves prospects. This year we had a record number of submissions, and some interesting results. Here are the Talking Chop 2010 Community Top-25 Braves Prospects:

Jason Heyward, OF
Freddie Freeman, 1B
Julio Teheran, RHSP
Mike Minor, LHSP
Craig Kimbrel, RHRP
Christian Bethancourt, C
Randall Delgado, RHSP
Zeke Spruill, RHSP
Cody Johnson, OF
J.J. Hoover, RHSP
Adam Milligan, OF
Brett DeVall, LHSP
Dimaster Delgado, LHSP
Jose Ortegano, LHSP
Cory Gearrin, RHRP
Cole Rohrbough, LHSP
Brandon Hicks, SS
Jacob Thompson, RHSP
Brett Oberholtzer, LHSP
David Hale, RHRP
Robinson Lopez, RHSP
Scott Diamond, LHSP
Tyler Stovall, LHSP
Andy Otero, LHSP
Benino Pruneda, RHRP

Some observations and the individual breakdown after the jump.

Observations:

I am apparently the only person who likes Todd Redmond as a prospect. Team USA performance people.
Julio Teheran almost snuck into second place ahead of Freeman.
I left off Edgar Osuna, who finished 17th, since he's now a member of the Braves-Central (aka the Royals).
I think there was some serious lobbying for Robinson Lopez and Andy Otero, both of whom snuck into the top-25. But not enough love for Caleb Brewer, who actually think more highly of.
No one outside of CB, Matt, and myself liked Matt Kennelly.
2010 draftees RSF and Mycal Jones barely missed the top-25, while Hale and Minor made the list.
Pitching dominated the list, including 9 left-handed starting pitchers (10 if you count Osuna).
Here is a link to last year's (2009) results.

Here is the full list. Click on it to enlarge. Sorry if it's still small, but I had to make it that way to fit it all on the print screen.

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Comments

im first ppl deal with it

by ccoolguy2003 on Dec 14, 2009 11:06 AM EST reply actions 0 recs

Now I see why they call u cool guy

MATT DIAZ IS THE F**K*NG MAN.
They made me change my signature...

by nick9314 on Dec 14, 2009 11:25 AM EST up reply actions 2 recs

+1

"SIGN PUJOLS OR FIRE WREN" ~ Swo12bv

by Smoltz's Beard on Dec 14, 2009 11:41 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

hahaha

Very nice.

by Sparhawk on Dec 14, 2009 12:00 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Thanks for contributing to the thread.

"My team of nine guys who hit like Albert Pujols and never ever bunt just beat your team with one Shane Victorino 472 to 3."

by justincredubil02 on Dec 14, 2009 6:57 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Me and yondaime4 were the only ones to vote for Matt Young. Represent.

Still think we’re all ranking Minor WAY too high.

http://www.capitolavenueclub.com/

by PWHjort on Dec 14, 2009 11:15 AM EST reply actions 0 recs

Agreed

Top Ten? Sure

Top 5? Eh… I like for a guy in the top 5 to have a bit higher ceiling than “Back end of the rotation starter.” I feel like he needs to be back behind Delgado and Spruill, despite having gone to the AFL.

by Bronn on Dec 14, 2009 1:26 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Jurrjens had that same supposed ceiling...

with Minor, let’s wait until he gets some time under his belt before putting a limit on his level.

by Mr. Sanchez on Dec 14, 2009 1:59 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

tells you the state of our minor leagues if you think Minor is too high.

I think he’s a bit high, but a lefty who knows how to pitch (not just throw) and projects to gain 3-4 mph on his fastball in the comings years is a pretty good commodity in any organization.

he could be Pettite or he could be Washburn. Either way, Minor is nothing to scoff at.

Yet, #4 IS high.

by apoxonbothyourhouses on Dec 14, 2009 11:22 AM EST reply actions 0 recs

since when does he project to gain 3-4 mph on his fastball

that would make him a top of the rotation pitcher if he did that.. and i dont think thats actually projected

Heyward,Hanson,and Shaffer r ready now!! Why do you think they havent signed the "right handed bat"?

by fatazfoot on Jan 7, 2009 8:59 PM EST

by Swo12bv on Dec 14, 2009 12:05 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

If he did, he’d have a fastball touching 95-96 on the gun. That would give him a better fastball than anyone in the rotation right now. Vazquez is at the point where he seldom hits 95 on the gun anymore. Hanson probably can, but as a starter, he doesn’t throw that hard.

So, that’s crazy.

by Bronn on Dec 14, 2009 1:32 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

this is what Im saying…no one has said he stands to gain that much on his fastball… and many say he wont add anything

Heyward,Hanson,and Shaffer r ready now!! Why do you think they havent signed the "right handed bat"?

by fatazfoot on Jan 7, 2009 8:59 PM EST

by Swo12bv on Dec 14, 2009 2:03 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

agreed

by Bronn on Dec 14, 2009 2:57 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

i read somewhere

that he is only around 190 lbs now at 6’4" (this from the Vandy site http://vucommodores.cstv.com/sports/m-basebl/mtt/minor_mike00.html This is old but he hasn’t put on THAT much weight). The projection is based on the fact that, in all likelihood, he will put 15-20 lbs on that frame in the next 5 years. Doing so would, most likely, add SOME velocity to his fastball. When he was signing, the Braves’ scouts said that it COULD be 3-4 but most likely 2-3.

by apoxonbothyourhouses on Dec 14, 2009 3:41 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

ps-

Corey Rasmus is going to be a player. He just needs to get healthy.

by apoxonbothyourhouses on Dec 14, 2009 11:23 AM EST reply actions 0 recs

I agree, but we have to see him healthy first.

by gondeee on Dec 14, 2009 11:29 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

I agree. I had him on my top 10 RH starters list. But still, need to see him healthy.

I wrote a novel, it's about baseball, you should buy it: https://www.createspace.com/3407939
www.dropoutproductions.com

by cbwilk on Dec 14, 2009 4:44 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

If he could only get healthy, he could be a good one.

by BravesWin on Dec 14, 2009 6:06 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Maybe if he gets healthy. I don’t think anyone thought of that yet.

by yondaime4 on Dec 14, 2009 6:19 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

“Pitching dominated the list, including 9 left-handed starting pitchers (10 if you count Osuna).”

Yeah, good grief there is a ton of pitching on the list: 19 arms to 6 bats.

by bbxxj on Dec 14, 2009 11:33 AM EST reply actions 0 recs

Except one of them is more of a “glove” than a “bat”.

http://www.capitolavenueclub.com/

by PWHjort on Dec 14, 2009 11:44 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Wow, no love for Thomas Palica.

He had similar numbers to Gearrin, and was a year younger at the same levels. Is there some scouting report that I’m missing or something?

by blindsided789 on Dec 14, 2009 11:44 AM EST reply actions 0 recs

Lefty with so so stuff. Gearrin is more impressive because of his stuff and delivery.

I wrote a novel, it's about baseball, you should buy it: https://www.createspace.com/3407939
www.dropoutproductions.com

by cbwilk on Dec 14, 2009 4:44 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

That would explain it. He had some good K #‘s though. I still think he’s someone to keep an eye on.

by blindsided789 on Dec 14, 2009 9:19 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Gondee, how does this compare to our mid-season list?

I think it would be interesting to see the two side by side, but I don’t think the mid-season list was ever published. I could be way off on that though…

"My team of nine guys who hit like Albert Pujols and never ever bunt just beat your team with one Shane Victorino 472 to 3."

by justincredubil02 on Dec 14, 2009 11:49 AM EST reply actions 0 recs

i could never find it.

Heyward,Hanson,and Shaffer r ready now!! Why do you think they havent signed the "right handed bat"?

by fatazfoot on Jan 7, 2009 8:59 PM EST

by Swo12bv on Dec 14, 2009 12:05 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Unshun?

"My team of nine guys who hit like Albert Pujols and never ever bunt just beat your team with one Shane Victorino 472 to 3."

by justincredubil02 on Dec 14, 2009 12:12 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

damnit

Heyward,Hanson,and Shaffer r ready now!! Why do you think they havent signed the "right handed bat"?

by fatazfoot on Jan 7, 2009 8:59 PM EST

by Swo12bv on Dec 14, 2009 2:03 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Yeah, the ball got dropped on that one. I never got around to the mid-season list. You’re welcome to go back and total it all up, though.

by gondeee on Dec 14, 2009 12:50 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Haha…no gracias!

"My team of nine guys who hit like Albert Pujols and never ever bunt just beat your team with one Shane Victorino 472 to 3."

by justincredubil02 on Dec 14, 2009 2:58 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

who is this Heyward guy?

when i searched him on Google, it said:

No results were found. Did you mean: Jesus Christ?

In Frank Wren I trust.

by mvhsbball on Dec 14, 2009 1:23 PM EST via mobile reply actions 0 recs

+1

by acie4mvp on Dec 14, 2009 4:34 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

woah! not cool. Someone’s going to have your head for blasphemy
Exhibit A:

(sorry if I took the picture w/o asking… i can’t stand for this blasphemy)

(Yunel is still the Queen of Hearts)

by GoBravesNY on Dec 14, 2009 11:32 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

that says Tommy Hanson...

and I use that google thing all the time.

im really, really, uber sorry to whoever made that picture. i hope I didnt upset you

In Frank Wren I trust.

by mvhsbball on Dec 14, 2009 11:56 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

you clearly don’t get what I mean…
Tommy’s going to have your head for blasphemy… lame attempt at a joke

I is for I can't wait for spring to get here- Matty D
(Yunel is still the Queen of Hearts)

by GoBravesNY on Dec 15, 2009 8:33 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

I wish I knew enough about the prospects to make my own list, but I would just be bullshittin’. Maybe next year.

by someguy917 on Dec 14, 2009 1:39 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

Haha, same here.

by Mark Lempke on Dec 14, 2009 2:55 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Stick around this website for awhile and you’ll be an expert. Maybe I shouldn’t go that far, but TC offers top notch year round prospect coverage.

"Hey Fat Kid...the monster is right behind you! RUNNNN!!" -The Host

by bwellnjonesco on Dec 14, 2009 2:56 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

I think our top 5 is very strong, BUT imo

there is a huge letdown afterwards when you consider the lack of quality depth we have in position players.

by SmithnCompany on Dec 14, 2009 2:40 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

ur absolutely right, but most teams would be happy to have our pitching depth and our top 5… this is clearly a top 10 system (with a rough guess, Id put us at about 5-6th

Heyward,Hanson,and Shaffer r ready now!! Why do you think they havent signed the "right handed bat"?

by fatazfoot on Jan 7, 2009 8:59 PM EST

by Swo12bv on Dec 14, 2009 3:00 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

It's kind of a staple of the Schuerholz farm system

Having a surplus of good pitching prospects gives you a lot of trade commodities. With the fact that pitchers are generally more injury prone than position players, the demand for pitching increases over the course of the season. And in terms of drafting, first round position players tend to be more sure things than first round pitchers. So when trading prospects at low levels, it’s generally nice to trade pitchers for position players just because pitchers have a lower chance of panning out as expected. It will be interesting to see how this bears out during the season, considering the extra pitching we have at the major league level-I’d like to see if some prospects get turned over in trades.

Also, in my opinion, it’s much more valuable to have cost controlled pitchers than hitters. When you’re making market value for pitchers, they carry a higher risk, and have a more marginal team impact. Hitters play every day, and starters every 5th day. I know someone has run the numbers before, but I’m too lazy to look it up right now. But when paying free agents, you often get more bang for your buck with hitters.

by Bronn on Dec 14, 2009 3:20 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

10-12

That’s where I am guessing we fall this year.

Disclaimer: I have not actually looked at the other systems to know I would rank that many better than ours.

by parish on Dec 14, 2009 3:40 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

i havent look either so who knows

Heyward,Hanson,and Shaffer r ready now!! Why do you think they havent signed the "right handed bat"?

by fatazfoot on Jan 7, 2009 8:59 PM EST

by Swo12bv on Dec 14, 2009 4:42 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

I’d said late top 10 probably. I haven’t been blown away by most of the systems I have seen so far, but I FL and Phil will rank ahead of us along with Tex, Oakland (maybe they thinned out a bit), Washington and maybe Baltimore. Thats just off the top of my head.

by yondaime4 on Dec 14, 2009 6:22 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Washington’s system isn’t very good and if it’s ahead of the Braves it’s only because of Strasburg and after graduating so many guys this year Baltimore’s isn’t that great either.

I wrote a novel, it's about baseball, you should buy it: https://www.createspace.com/3407939
www.dropoutproductions.com

by cbwilk on Dec 14, 2009 6:33 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

You think Philly will still be up there after today?

"My team of nine guys who hit like Albert Pujols and never ever bunt just beat your team with one Shane Victorino 472 to 3."

by justincredubil02 on Dec 14, 2009 6:58 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

it's like their own...

Tex deal!

by Mr. Sanchez on Dec 14, 2009 7:11 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

depends on what they finally gave up.

by yondaime4 on Dec 14, 2009 11:02 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

I think the Pirates should be in the top 10 by now…

"My team of nine guys who hit like Albert Pujols and never ever bunt just beat your team with one Shane Victorino 472 to 3."

by justincredubil02 on Dec 14, 2009 6:58 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

they should be ya… but they arent

and fine ur unshunned

Heyward,Hanson,and Shaffer r ready now!! Why do you think they havent signed the "right handed bat"?

by fatazfoot on Jan 7, 2009 8:59 PM EST

by Swo12bv on Dec 14, 2009 8:00 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

You can’t quit me.

"My team of nine guys who hit like Albert Pujols and never ever bunt just beat your team with one Shane Victorino 472 to 3."

by justincredubil02 on Dec 14, 2009 8:54 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

interesting that Scott Diamond is #22 for 2d year in a row. didn’t have a great year, but no slipage.
IMO, could have an outside shot at an appearance in the Atlanta sometime in ’10.

by fandave on Dec 14, 2009 3:12 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

If the list was being updated now, where would Brent Clevlen be? Top 10?

by fandave on Dec 14, 2009 3:54 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

I don’t really know much about him, but he seems more in the mold of a Reid Gorecki kind of player with more upside. I think he’s a lot better than Gorecki, but I don’t think he’s better than anyone in the top 10. Except maybe Johnson.

by acie4mvp on Dec 14, 2009 4:38 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Bent Clevelen would be right where he is. Nowhere near the list. He’s a 26 year old who doesn’t have any projection left. He’s a nice minor league free agent signing but he’s not a prospect.

I wrote a novel, it's about baseball, you should buy it: https://www.createspace.com/3407939
www.dropoutproductions.com

by cbwilk on Dec 14, 2009 4:46 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

I guess I don’t understand the operative definition.

To me, a prospect is a minor league player who if in the major leagues, would be a rookie; and has potential to very likely contribute or have impact in the future, sooner or later.

So, projection aside, after 3 full years in AAA ball, Clevelan is a near ready player (or not) and if given the opportunity, could very likely contribute or have impact (or not) very soon (like as of game 1 of the ’10 season).

Now, if his power numbers were transferable to 25 HR power in 500 major league ABs and he could maintain a .270ish BA and give us plus defense, then that would seem to me damn worthy of the list.

by fandave on Dec 14, 2009 6:10 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

If Clevlen could do those kind of things he’d already have been given a chance in the Majors. In over 1400 AAA at bats he has a .259 average and has never hit 25 homers in a season, at any level. Nothing in his career to this point suggests he could produce at the levels you’re thinking he could.

Even several years ago at his peak he was a mid teens prospect for the Tigers, and their farm systems were worse than the Braves, both then and now.

What makes a prospect a prospect is the amount of projectability he has; can you see this guy being good over the long haul, moving up and having good value over a fair amount of time. 26 year olds who haven’t dominated AAA and haven’t fared very well in their 3 chances at AAA, who weren’t even considered worthy of a callup in their last season with their old team, who are allowed to become minor league free agents in the first place, aren’t prospects.

I wrote a novel, it's about baseball, you should buy it: https://www.createspace.com/3407939
www.dropoutproductions.com

by cbwilk on Dec 14, 2009 6:42 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

maybe, except in 955 AB the last 2 years at AAA, playing as a 24 & 25 year old, he put up an aggregate .272 batting average and .468 slugging percentage with an average of 24.5 2B, 6 3B and 19 HR per season, which compare very favorably with his earlier production. so, it looks like he is continuing to progress and could have more upside than you’re recognizing.

by fandave on Dec 14, 2009 8:03 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

It could. I think he’s a good ballplayer and I’m very happy that he’s a part of the organization. But still, not a prospect.

I wrote a novel, it's about baseball, you should buy it: https://www.createspace.com/3407939
www.dropoutproductions.com

by cbwilk on Dec 14, 2009 8:15 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

cb--forget the linguistics....

…I agree with you here. He’s a nice piece, but not a prospect.

by cavebird on Dec 14, 2009 11:21 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

holy shit, batmen

the Red Sox signed Lackey to 5/85 million

the Phillies/Blue Jays/M’s seem to be having a deal that will send Halladay to Philly, Lee to Seattle and prospects to Toronto.

WOW.

I think Wren might need to push Liberty for a little more $ to sign a bit OF bat.

by apoxonbothyourhouses on Dec 14, 2009 4:08 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

wow

OF Michael Saunders, P Phillip Aumont and P Brandon Morrow to Toronto along with Philadelphia sending P J.A. Happ and OF Dominic Brown to Toronto.

now Toronto is going to be good for a VERY long time. i love this deal for them.

by apoxonbothyourhouses on Dec 14, 2009 4:10 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Holy shit...

…where did you find all that? That’s quite a haul.

"SIGN PUJOLS OR FIRE WREN" ~ Swo12bv

by Smoltz's Beard on Dec 14, 2009 4:17 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

so Philly traded Lee, Saunders, Happ, and Brown for Halladay?

"Hey Fat Kid...the monster is right behind you! RUNNNN!!" -The Host

by bwellnjonesco on Dec 14, 2009 4:39 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Sounds like an Omar Minaya move!

I love it!

"My team of nine guys who hit like Albert Pujols and never ever bunt just beat your team with one Shane Victorino 472 to 3."

by justincredubil02 on Dec 14, 2009 5:31 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Saunders

is from Seattle

by eaheckman10 on Dec 15, 2009 5:46 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

My bad…

"Hey Fat Kid...the monster is right behind you! RUNNNN!!" -The Host

by bwellnjonesco on Dec 15, 2009 8:30 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

That’s an amazing deal for them. Wonder if they could’ve gotten Drabek instead of Happ? I remember over the summer they wanted Happ over Drabek which was pretty dumb

by acie4mvp on Dec 14, 2009 4:39 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Good gracious! All for 1 year of Halladay?

If Albert played in the AFL, they’d have to rename it the AZ/NM Fall League, based on where his homers landed.

by Yakker on Dec 14, 2009 4:40 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

From SI.com:

The Phillies are giving up prospects to Toronto to get Halladay, but it isn’t known yet which players are in the deal. Philadelphia, which would also get prospects from Seattle, is trying to keep its payroll at around $140 million.

by acie4mvp on Dec 14, 2009 4:45 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Yes, please where did you hear that.

If the Blue Jays got all of that, absolutely incredible. Giving up Lee and Happ and Brown seems to make the Phillies the big loser here. I could see the Blue Jays getting some of that, but not all of that. That being said, I hope it is true. ;)

by cavebird on Dec 14, 2009 4:39 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

read at mlbtraderumors

so…take it for what it’s worth

by apoxonbothyourhouses on Dec 15, 2009 12:05 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

ok.

Rosenthal is saying:

Phillies get: $6 million from the Jays, Halladay, Phillippe Aumont, Tyson Gillies and a 3rd player from Seattle

Seattle gets: Lee from Phillies, and two other “pieces”

Toronto gets: Kyle Drabek, Michael Taylor, Travis D’Arnaud and another piece from Seattle.

still LOVE the deal for Toronto. except for the $6 million. Drabek is C+, Taylor and D’Arnaud are Bs who all will only improved and start in Toronto opening day 2011.

Seattle seems to have gotten screwed and the Phillies get their ace AND a couple of minor league players rated B (Aumont) and N/R (Gillies).

by apoxonbothyourhouses on Dec 15, 2009 1:41 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

If this is the deal, Seattle didn't get screwed...

…they made out like bandits. They get Cliff Lee at a reasonable price for a year in a year they are going for it. All they gave up are Aumont, who is already almost a bust, having been moved to the bullpen because his arm couldn’t handle starting (B- at best, more likely a C prospect by now), a nice, but not great piece in Gillies, and a C prospect arm in Juan Ramirez (the latest rumored to be included in the deal). Good drafting with the picks they’ll get when Lee leaves could easily net them guys better than those they are giving up and they get a year of Cliff Lee.

I just don’t understand how you rate Drabek at C+ and Aumont as a B—-I don’t think anyone rates Aumont higher than Drabek anymore. Aumont’s ceiling is already down to bullpen arm.

by cavebird on Dec 15, 2009 9:56 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs