Grading the 2009 Atlanta Braves
So as we sadly enter the final weekend of play in the 2009 season (god, April seems like only yesterday, doesn't it?), we won't have playoff baseball in Atlanta for the 3rd straight season. Despite not making the playoffs, I think this team has made HUGE improvements from last years joke-of-a-season. Since the wild card began, the average number of wins from the winning team was 90.5. The Braves, who better win the next 3 from the Natinals, will likely finish with a record of 89-73 or so. This team has definately seen it's shares of ups and downs, but all in all, I think it's been a really successful season for the Bravos and I feel confident for 2010 and beyond.
Here are my grades for the 2009 Braves:
Starting pitching: A+ -- We arguably had the best 5 man rotation in baseball and that's without Huddy's return in September. 3 pitchers with sub-3 ERAs is phenomenal (Javy, JJ and Hanson). DLowe, Huddy and KK all had their moments, but also struggled at times too. All-in-all, I think it was a fantastic season for our starting pitchers.
Bullpen: B -- Our bullpen was pretty solid this season. Despite his usual late season struggles, Raffy Soriano has been solid for us as a closer. Mike Gonzalez, who made me sweat more than any other player this season, did blow some leads, but had a solid year with a ton of strikeouts. The biggest surprise out of the bullpen was EOF, who filled in beautifully as a LOOGY (Will Ohman had a horrible season in LA, so that looks like a good non-signing). The true MVP of the bullpen (and maybe one of the MVPs for the entire team) was Peter Moylan. He had a helluva season and I'd like to see him as our closer in 2010.
Catcher: A -- Brian McCann had another fantastic season, but one of the most un-sung heros of 2009 was David Ross. He did a fantastic job in the 3 weeks BMac was out with his vision problems, and was a solid catcher whenever BMac needed the day off.
First Base: B+ -- When we all were glued to our computers on July 31st waiting for the Braves to make a move before the trade deadline, many of us were puzzled and confused by the Kotchman for LaRoche trade. Why trade 3 more seasons of Casey Kotchman for 1/2 a year of Adam LaRoche? Despite the criticism, Frank Wren got the last laugh. Roachy has been fantastic for us this season. Kotchman was decent at 1B in the 1st half and his stellar defense was big for us. It'll be interesting to see what FW does to solve our issue at 1B in the offseason.
Second Base: B+ -- Marteeeen Prado has been a fantastic 2B for us this season since he won the job in June. Kelly Johnson was absolutely horrible for us in the first 2 months. Our offense was horrible the first 2 months with the 3 black holes we had in our lineup (FYF, KJ and Schafer). I think Prado really helped break our offense out of it's early slumps.
Third Base: B- -- Chipper has his worst offensive and defensive season in his entire career. His horrible slump in August really cost the Braves, and we got absolutely NO production from our #3 hitter. Lets all hope for a rebound season from one of the greatest hitters off all time in 2010.
Shortstop: A- -- Yunel Escobar established himself as one of the best young SS in the league. He led all of MLB in hitting w/ RISP. He continued to play his fantastic defense. He also improved his K/BB ratio, his avg. and obp., and increased his power numbers. He did make a few boneheaded plays, but all in all, I think it was a great season from our young Shortstop.
LF: C+ -- GA, despite a slow start thanks to a lingering hamstring injury, came back to have a decent offensive season. His defense was definately sub-par, but I think he did his job perfectly this season, which was: Be a bridge player until Jason Heyward is ready.
CF: B- -- Jordan Schafer was supposed to be our CF of the future. After a very promising first month, Jordan suffered a serious wrist injury which led to a ton of problems. After being sent down to AAA after striking out a rediculous 52 times in May, Gregor Blanco manned CF for a whole 2 days before FW made his 1st big move of the season: Acquire Nate McLouth for 3 prospects. There have been mixed reviews on McLouth, but he's definately an improvement over Schafer and Blanco. It'll be interesting to see what FW does in the offseason with our abundance of OFs.
RF: B -- After a promising 1st month, it looked like Jeff Francoeur was back. He was hitting w/ RISP. He wasn't striking out as much and was showing better plate discipline. Despite the early success, something went wrong and Jeff was back to his usual pathetic self. Another negative was his defense was rapidly declining. Optimism was abound after FW sent Frenchy to the Muts for Ryan Church, one of the best moves for the Braves organization in a long time. Although Churchy hasn't done much offensively for us, FYF's departure opened up a spot for Matt Diaz aka MattyD aka Captain Caveman. MattyD absolutely tore up pitchers this season, while stealing a few bases. He had a fantastic season for us.
Bench: D+ -- Lets be honest, we got absolutely NO production from our bench this season. Omar Infante had a few hits, but besides him, no one else made any big contributions to the team (besides David Ross, who I mentioned earlier in the Catcher section). Greg Norton was horrible. Brooks Conrad didn't have a hit since being called up. Kelly Johnson, in the few chances he had as a pinch-hitter, didn't deliever besides his huge HR in LA. Reid Gorecki didn't do anything besides play decent defense in LF as a sub for GA. It was just not a good season for our bench players.
So those are my grades for our team. I cant wait to see what Frank Wren has planned for the upcoming offseason. I feel extremely confident about our team in 2010 and beyond. How did you feel about this team?
0 recs |
67 comments
Comments
I never understood how anybody who had seen Kotchman play and seen LaRoche play could have been upset about that trade. Three more years of Kotchman sounds awful to me. That guy was Francoeurian.
"At least he didn’t nail the bitchy fat girl from Hell's Kitchen."
www.dropoutproductions.com
by cbwilk on Oct 2, 2009 4:52 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
we really need to stop this francouerian phrase now… or at least its rampant use for players who aren’t great. Kotchman wasn’t horrible. LaRoche was clearly better, by a long shot. But KOthcman played good defense, took walks and was able to hit for a decent avg. He had about as much power as a wet noodle, but he was still on base at a relatively effective rate.
Kotchman’s line in 09 w/ Braves was about league avg (certainly not avg for a 1B)…… 282/ 354/ 409
Francouer line in 09 w Braves was not league avg at all, for anyt position (outside P)….277/ 282/ 352
Kotchman’s OPS was 130 pts higher than Francouer’s… Kotchman wasn’t great, the trade was really a pretty solid deal (although remember LaRoche blows ass in the first half.. so temper those expectations for next season and remember he’ll probably kill us in the first half, assuming we resign him), but Kotchman is certainly not Francouerian… Francouerian is histroically bad, Kotchman is below avg (slightly, IMHO). And thats without factoring in defense.
Its a disservice to Kotchman to describe him as such. I don’t mean to rant on you CB, because you forever have my respect around here, but I’ve seen “Francouerian” elsewhere and it bothers me that people compare players to Francouer, when in reality Francouer has no comparison (he posts a 650 OPS at a premium offensive position, with league avg defesne backing him up… its quite tremendously bad)
Heyward,Hanson,and Shaffer r ready now!! Why do you think they havent signed the "right handed bat"?
by fatazfoot on Jan 7, 2009 8:59 PM EST
by Swo12bv on Oct 2, 2009 5:02 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
These are all very good points, but I will point out, Kotchman’s OPS during his tenure in Atlanta: .724, Francoeur’s: .732.
"At least he didn’t nail the bitchy fat girl from Hell's Kitchen."
www.dropoutproductions.com
by cbwilk on Oct 2, 2009 5:59 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
unfair comparison bc Francouer was clearly subject to what i would call flukiness or good luck in his first two years, as evidenced by what I would call his true talent level of the last two seasons. I would argue Kotchman’s true talent is a 724 (maybe even higher because i don’t think his play last year was true talent, but ill say it was), where at best Francouer’s is like 680.
Heyward,Hanson,and Shaffer r ready now!! Why do you think they havent signed the "right handed bat"?
by fatazfoot on Jan 7, 2009 8:59 PM EST
by Swo12bv on Oct 2, 2009 8:20 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
We could go for their careers then. Kotchman, 518 ML games, .743 OPS, Francoeur, 704 ML games, .742 OPS. And Kotchman is a year older. You can but whatever kind of spin or belief on it you want, but the fact remains, these guys are very comparable.
"At least he didn’t nail the bitchy fat girl from Hell's Kitchen."
www.dropoutproductions.com
by cbwilk on Oct 2, 2009 9:36 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Well yeah and no CB. Fact is Kotchman has a fantastic eye and doesn’t go up to the plate and just mash he doesn’t strike out much at all which Frenchy is the complete opposite. The eye between them is a HUGE difference and Kotchman plays one of the best defense at his position than Frenchy does at his position.
braves#1
by rockybull on Oct 2, 2009 10:42 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
But still, their results are the same. And despite his defense, which is outstanding, Kotchman plays an offense first position, and he fails woefully at that side of the game.
"At least he didn’t nail the bitchy fat girl from Hell's Kitchen."
www.dropoutproductions.com
by cbwilk on Oct 2, 2009 10:59 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
don’t you think that Francouer’s career numbers are inaccurate, because of his first two years, when people didn’t realize he would swing at anything and refuses to learn
Heyward,Hanson,and Shaffer r ready now!! Why do you think they havent signed the "right handed bat"?
by fatazfoot on Jan 7, 2009 8:59 PM EST
by Swo12bv on Oct 3, 2009 1:03 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
How is that a valid argument? The guy performed how he performed, regardless of your perception of it. Kotchman has seen a healthy decline in his OPS over the last three years, from .840 to .738 to .725, who’s to say the same thing didn’t happen to him. I doubt you were a big Angels fan and got to watch all of his at bats with them to make the same kind of subjective judgment that you’re making about Francoeur.
Over huge sample sizes, their entire careers, the guys have produced about the same. Arguing about why they’re the same, saying one guy’s is more genuine than the other is a little odd.
"At least he didn’t nail the bitchy fat girl from Hell's Kitchen."
www.dropoutproductions.com
by cbwilk on Oct 3, 2009 1:46 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
theres no use arguing this any more… u are using career statistics, which is fine and im using a projection of their recent history, which is also appropriate… we wont agree because the facts we are using are much different. I think Kotchman still is valuable (not incredibly valauble but he is an asset), whereas Francouer isn’t bc he provides nothing to a team (no defense or offense)… However, neither will likely have a job next year, bc their contract will be near $3M and both of these guys can be replaced by a guy who can do their job for a fraction of the cost.
So im done
Heyward,Hanson,and Shaffer r ready now!! Why do you think they havent signed the "right handed bat"?
by fatazfoot on Jan 7, 2009 8:59 PM EST
by Swo12bv on Oct 3, 2009 4:16 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Ok, recent history, the last 2 years, Francoeur’s OPS is .694 and Kotchman’s is .723. Clearly Kotchman has been better over the last 2 years.
But, withing those numbers, Kotchman has dropped his OPS by .013 points this year (after dropping by .102 points between 07 and 08)
Francoeur has seen his OPS raise by .082 points from last year (after dropping .129 points between 07 and 08).
If anything, recent history, combined with a look at their career numbers, suggests that Francoeur’s 09 OPS of .735 is a lot closer to his reality than a .680. Meanwhile, Kotchman’s 09 OPS of .725 is probably lower than his reality, which seems more in line with 08’s .738. That is, of course, if he doesn’t keep trending down.
Recent history shows one guy was in a severe downturn and seems to be coming back to a norm and one guy is making a gentle decline down to his norm.
"At least he didn’t nail the bitchy fat girl from Hell's Kitchen."
www.dropoutproductions.com
by cbwilk on Oct 3, 2009 5:22 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
So RF is not an offense-first position?
Or you think Jermaine Dye and Brad Hawpe and Bobby Abreu are in their for their glove skills?
Remember when the Panthers had a good offensive line? Yeah, me too.
--Darin Gantt
by MichaelProcton on Oct 7, 2009 3:58 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
When did I say it wasn’t? The basis of this argument is that Francoeur sucks and Kotchman sucks just as bad. They both suck, especially for their position. Are you just searching out an argument that doesn’t exist?
"At least he didn’t nail the bitchy fat girl from Hell's Kitchen."
www.dropoutproductions.com
by cbwilk on Oct 7, 2009 8:55 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
How is that an unfair comparison? Those were the results They look like pretty much the same player to me, and neither of them ever developed into part of our long terms plan.
Francoeur drove in runs, played above average defense, never got hurt and cost us relatively little money.
I’m not sorry he’s gone (even with his resurgence with the Mets) but some of you bashers need to ease off a little bit. For four years, we had a dependable glove and solid arm in RF, who never missed a game and drove in 95 RBIs from the bottom of the order and it only cost us a total of $5 million. Trust me there are worse things than that.
by DCP916 on Oct 2, 2009 9:46 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
The "bottom of the order?"
He played the majority of his games as the #5 or #6 hitter. That’s the definition of the heart of the order.
Remember when the Panthers had a good offensive line? Yeah, me too.
--Darin Gantt
by MichaelProcton on Oct 7, 2009 4:08 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Teixiera killed us in the first half...
But nobody seemed to mind.
Remember when the Panthers had a good offensive line? Yeah, me too.
--Darin Gantt
by MichaelProcton on Oct 2, 2009 8:37 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
he only killed us the first month and a half… and i minded… if we pay a guy 12.5M id like some consistency from him. and the difference is Teixiera’s upside is higher than LaRoche.
Heyward,Hanson,and Shaffer r ready now!! Why do you think they havent signed the "right handed bat"?
by fatazfoot on Jan 7, 2009 8:59 PM EST
by Swo12bv on Oct 2, 2009 9:43 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
That is why I worry about signing LaRoche...
he has generally had very poor first halves and done well in the second half for team’s that were out of contention. He did a great job helping us in the pennant race, but I’m not sure he’s worth that price for this club. We need someone who can produce in the middle of the other, and do it consistently. Is that LaRoche?
by Mr. Sanchez on Oct 3, 2009 9:22 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
we shouldnt resign him but we should trade for him at the deadline… next year
do it wren
Heyward,Hanson,and Shaffer r ready now!! Why do you think they havent signed the "right handed bat"?
by fatazfoot on Jan 7, 2009 8:59 PM EST
by Swo12bv on Oct 3, 2009 1:04 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Haha...
Or sign him to a minor league deal that paid him like $12 mil over the second half at the major league level?
Remember when the Panthers had a good offensive line? Yeah, me too.
--Darin Gantt
by MichaelProcton on Oct 7, 2009 4:14 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Which "teams that were out of contention" were those?
He raked in ’04, ’06, and ’09 for us. All of those teams were in it.
Remember when the Panthers had a good offensive line? Yeah, me too.
--Darin Gantt
by MichaelProcton on Oct 7, 2009 4:12 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
'04 he wasn't a full time starter...
and you see the gap in the years you listed—’05, ’07, ’08. Yeah, those count too.
by Mr. Sanchez on Oct 8, 2009 8:23 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I agree,
Krotchman should in no way be compared to Failcouer. The only thing I didn’t like about Krotchman was his power numbers (esp for 1B). With Frenchy, I didn’t like his swing, his low OBP, all the hype about how good he was going to be (I never saw it), his K/BB ratio, his average, his power, his Andruw-Jones-style whiff on the low and outside pitch, his BA with RISP, his RBI totals…you get the idea.
You say to-mah-to, I say you're retarded.
by alligatorimpersonator on Oct 2, 2009 5:50 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Francoeur is at .277 for his career with RISP.
Remember when the Panthers had a good offensive line? Yeah, me too.
--Darin Gantt
by MichaelProcton on Oct 2, 2009 8:38 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
true,
for his career it’s .277, but I was disregarding the first year or two when he was great with RISP.
You say to-mah-to, I say you're retarded.
by alligatorimpersonator on Oct 4, 2009 10:47 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Hard to do that when he DID do so well, though.
Remember when the Panthers had a good offensive line? Yeah, me too.
--Darin Gantt
by MichaelProcton on Oct 7, 2009 4:15 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
u didnt like his RBI totals… why they were pretty solid… thats the one thing he did well (although u can always make the argument anyone woul dhave done that when the OBP is so high in front of you and ur in a run producing spot int he order ( Ryan Howard
Heyward,Hanson,and Shaffer r ready now!! Why do you think they havent signed the "right handed bat"?
by fatazfoot on Jan 7, 2009 8:59 PM EST
by Swo12bv on Oct 2, 2009 9:45 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I'd personally give Chipper a higher grade
His defense was terrible, but he still got on-base at over a .400 clip. That alone is worth a B+ or A-, but that’s justme
by eaheckman10 on Oct 2, 2009 6:41 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
agreed
like you said he still got on at a great clip. He did his job gettin on for McCann to drive him in. I would take that from him any time, hopefully his D gets better next year, but at his age and his injuries chances are his defense only deteriates more instead of gettin better.
braves#1
by rockybull on Oct 2, 2009 6:47 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
+10
this being his worst offensive season EVER is arguable. Check out his 2004 stats:
2004: .248BA .362OBP .485SLG .847OPS
2009: .267BA .390OBP .436SLG .826OPS
I think the differences are nearly negligible, making this a debatable topic. Regardless, it wasn’t one of his better seasons, but he was all right. Certainly not Chipper-esque. At least he’s played more games, which is encouraging. Anyway, I can’t bring myself to bash my favorite player too much. His defense will be better next year, I think. He’s got a new Mizuno glove.
Tigers love pepper; they hate cinnamon.
by Jareth Cutestory on Oct 2, 2009 9:43 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Why?
The Braves are dead last in offensive production from the #3 spot and dead last in defense at 3rd base. Hell, a C- would have been generous.
The dirty little secret about this Braves team is that Chipper killed us this year. He never came through when we needed him. Back in 2004, IIRC, Chipper started off in a terrible slump, but then Larry Wayne Sr flew into town and fixed the mechanics of his swing and he rebounded and had a big second half, won us a lot of games with his bat down the stretch and nearly got 100 RBIs. This year, nobody expected him to improve. He just looked old out there and it got to the point, by his own admission, that he was just hoping to draw a walk.
Trust me, all this retirement talk didn’t come out of the blue. He knows he has become a liability to the team.
by DCP916 on Oct 2, 2009 10:12 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
what metric are you using to determine we were dead last in offensive production from the #3 spot
Heyward,Hanson,and Shaffer r ready now!! Why do you think they havent signed the "right handed bat"?
by fatazfoot on Jan 7, 2009 8:59 PM EST
by Swo12bv on Oct 3, 2009 1:05 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
mvhsbball ,
Your report card was pretty much dead on, imo
Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter, and those who matter don't mind.
by HEYJUDE on Oct 2, 2009 7:41 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Thank you ma’am!
Frank Wren for GM of the Year.
"Wait, bait and bash." - Jason Heyward's personal philosophy.
by mvhsbball on Oct 3, 2009 1:29 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions 0 recs
That's like a B+ average.
B+ teams don’t make the playoffs.
Remember when the Panthers had a good offensive line? Yeah, me too.
--Darin Gantt
by MichaelProcton on Oct 2, 2009 8:32 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
* miss, whoops.
Remember when the Panthers had a good offensive line? Yeah, me too.
--Darin Gantt
by MichaelProcton on Oct 7, 2009 4:16 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Cool Write up
Btw, did u see the new flashforward!? It was sweeeeeet. I can’t wait till next week!
MATT DIAZ IS THE F**K*NG MAN.
They made me change my signature...
by nick9314 on Oct 2, 2009 9:48 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
I still haven’t gotten around to watching the pilot! Both eps are sitting on the DVR. I may get to them tomorrow
Tigers love pepper; they hate cinnamon.
by Jareth Cutestory on Oct 2, 2009 9:49 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
love that show. i can’t wait to see how things play out. my dvr is a workin fool on thursday nights with flashforward, CSI and the office.
Frank Wren for GM of the Year.
"Wait, bait and bash." - Jason Heyward's personal philosophy.
by mvhsbball on Oct 2, 2009 10:04 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions 0 recs
There have been mixed reviews on McLouth, but he’s definately an improvement over Schafer and McLouth.
Did I read that right?
by Rich Town on Oct 3, 2009 1:31 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Frenchy’s going to end the year with a higher avg. than Chipper, kind of irritates me. last I looked it was .278 or as a Met it’s .308, but that OBP never gets much higher than .030 over his avg. Kind of pisses me off he couldn’t hit .300 here, Hell, he hit a homerun tonight and the Braves lost again to the Nats! (friday night) I’m grading the Braves a B- this year only because of the pitching, the offense has been “don’t know what your gonna get” and defence has been below avg as well. I also am not happy that Bobby’s coming back next year. I never thought he was that great,he just had great players. He has cost this team several games this year and it’s going to be another year of leaving pitchers in too long, playing failing players when someone else would be better, and wearing out the same guys in the bullpen etc. Sorry that’s how I feel after watching the Braves lose 4 in a row.
Senator, we have another old saying,"Don't piss down my back and tell me it's raining." Fletcher
by jimmontg on Oct 3, 2009 4:12 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
...GA finished the year with a better BA than both of them.
BA can be very decieving.
Remember when the Panthers had a good offensive line? Yeah, me too.
--Darin Gantt
by MichaelProcton on Oct 7, 2009 4:19 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Kelly Johnson had a .925 OPS as a sub this year and 1.000 OPS as a PH, for the record. I also think you overrated first base and right field.
Mat Gamel is way too cool for double consonants.
by VivaLosBravos on Oct 3, 2009 11:42 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
I agree with most of the grading, but if you really think GA “did his job perfectly this season,” C+ seems a little harsh compared to the grades you gave Chipper, for example.
"When life gives you lemons, just say 'F*ck the lemons,' and bail."
by Bravely going forward on Oct 3, 2009 11:46 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Bullpen was solid but I’m not sold on Moylan as closer. Not that he couldn’t handle it, I just think he has more value as a ground ball / double play type pitcher.
by beeswax on Oct 3, 2009 1:39 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
On Nate McLouth...
I used to be a die-hard pirates fan, still live in Pittsburgh today and just laugh every time i hear the pirates mentioned. I honestly think you stole Nate, i know that he has under performed this year but that is sort of expected coming off an all-star year that he had. I don’t think the prospects that the braves traded were terrible but i have serious doubts that any of them will make an impact at the major league level. Not doubts about their abilities but doubts that the pirates organization will be able to make a product of these kids. If you look at the top prospects that have been in the pirates organization you will be amazed at how many of these guys were just straight duds, John W Van Benschoten, Bryan P Bullington, Neil M Walker, Daniel R Moskos, Sean Burnett, Yoslan Herrera, Steven Pearce, all of these guys were at one point in the past eight years in the top five prospect list for the pirates. Honestly i don’t like charlie morton, i saw him pitch once unfortunately and wanted to leave the game in the third inning. He is 5-9 this year with a 4.55 era and there is talk that next year he won’t have a spot in the dismal pirates rotation. Jeff Locke hasn’t even been productive at high A, going 4-4 with an ERA of 4.08, which at first that isn’t terrible but he will be 22 next month and he won’t be promoted this winter to AA. Gorky Hernandez did look like a great prospect but has done absolutely nothing since he got to their AA team. He only has 3 homers in 86 games while batting at a .261 average and next season will start at AA altoona. I have really watched the braves since the middle of july and i love this team, i know they fumbled in late september with marlins but it is just good to watch a team that has playoff hopes and just doesn’t trade all of their good players away in july. If you think being a braves fan is tough and not making the playoffs is a season failure, have a baseball team that the past 17 seasons have been loosing seasons. But back on Nate, i would love to watch a braves team that the outfield would be McLouth, Schafer, and Heyward. And that team would be a winning baseball team
by heffyac on Oct 3, 2009 4:23 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Maybe,
but for next year, leave out Schafer and keep Diaz out there. He’s a hitting fool.
Tigers love pepper; they hate cinnamon.
by Jareth Cutestory on Oct 3, 2009 8:40 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Grade adjustments
I’d rate 2B higher. Prado is so undervalued it’s not even funny. He almost single-handedly kept the Braves’ hope alive with his clutch hitting, IMHO.
I think the bullpen is overvalued. Acosta, Gonzalez, EOF, and early in the season, even Moylan, ALL gave up way too many runs. Soriano did an excellent job, but seems to have a chip on his shoulder (remarks to the media about lack of attention come to mind).
I’ve also noticed that when the Braves play at home, if the stadium has low attendance (as it often did this season), the Braves play half-ass baseball, especially Chipper.
Speaking of Chipper. Please retire. You are a liability. Deserving to go to the Hall of Fame? Absolutely. But haggard and hurt at 3B isn’t do the team any good. And the bat just doesn’t have it any more. Time to hang ’em up, Larry.
Diaz may have finished the season with the highest batting average, but I’m not sure that’s saying a whole lot, looking at this year’s averages. He just swings wildly at just about anything…strikes out a lot. I’m curious how many walks he took this year. Can anyone pull that up?
McClouth was my biggest disappointment this year. I really hope that he gets moved out of the lead-off spot if he’s not comfortable with it. I think he’s a great CFer, and adds some much-needed speed to this team.
by Audi on Oct 3, 2009 11:39 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Diaz
According to Yahoo, Diaz has 35 walks this season, in 371 ABs.
by Audi on Oct 4, 2009 12:37 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Compared to others
Prado has 34 walks in 440 ABs.
McClouth has 67 walks in 497 ABs.
Escobar has 57 walks in 518 ABs.
by Audi on Oct 4, 2009 12:40 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
yeah but
probably 30 of those were hbp
not knocking diaz though, i think hes great, i hope he can play left when heyward comes up
by Don Draper on Oct 4, 2009 9:26 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
35 walks, 13 hbp. They’re different stats that aren’t counted together.
"At least he didn’t nail the bitchy fat girl from Hell's Kitchen."
www.dropoutproductions.com
by cbwilk on Oct 4, 2009 11:29 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
...because some walks are HBP?
Uhh, nope.
Remember when the Panthers had a good offensive line? Yeah, me too.
--Darin Gantt
by MichaelProcton on Oct 7, 2009 5:22 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Salary
Oh, one more factoid:
Prado made made $415,000 this year. Greg Norton made $800,000. Ouch.
Who earned their check?
by Audi on Oct 4, 2009 12:56 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Right.
Both were pretty much paid the minimum for their service time. What’s your point?
Remember when the Panthers had a good offensive line? Yeah, me too.
--Darin Gantt
by MichaelProcton on Oct 7, 2009 5:56 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
To say Diaz strikes out a lot might be fair...
But his BB rate and BB:K ratio were as good this season as they have been at any point in his career.
Remember when the Panthers had a good offensive line? Yeah, me too.
--Darin Gantt
by MichaelProcton on Oct 7, 2009 5:55 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Those might have been optimistic reviews....
If we had A+ starting pitching and an overall grade of a B for the offense then we would have been in a better position then we ended the year.
The reality is that if you are going to grade the team you have to grade the team relative to other teams and their success at the position. Obviously the teams don’t play in a vacuum but in comparison to each other.
That being said..yes the starting pitching was great. The bullpen was at least OK, if not very good, all things considered.
However, I think that the best case scenario for the Braves Offense would be a C in any of the three positions. GA’s defense was horrendous and while he put up almost decent numbers at the end of the season…they are not very good numbers compared to other league LFers. I would say he is a C..at best.
CF wasn’t much better in actual production. I think McClouth is ok in CF and if healthy and there all year I think he would be a solid B/B+. However, he wasn’t here all year…and when he was here he spent a good chunk of time on the DL and wasn’t the same when he got back. So while a healthy Nate may score ok….his production…combined with the other guys in CF was no better then a C/C+.
Yes Matt Diaz has a great year. His lines look great. However, to say that his numbers were enough to rate RF as a B might be a little much. He only had something like 320 ABs for the year and probably only 200-250 in RF. The other 250-300 ABs for the Braves RF were awful. So maybe a C+/B-…but would probably be more like a C.
Chipper probably produced more like a C this year. Largely due to injuries and his late season slide.
Escobar…Ok…I could argue an A….maybe B…but ok.
Prado at a B+? Did he have a good year? Yes. Did he have a year that would put him in the top 15% of MLB 2B? Better then Utley? Better then Cano? Better then Pedroia? Better then Uggla? Better then Hill? Better then Ellis? What about Sanchez? Or a healthy Weeks? Or what about Caberra of Cleveland? I haven’t run the numbers so I am just running off good 2B off the top of my head to make the point. that Prado is probably not a B+ player. Probably more like a solid B.
1B: It was great the last couple months of the season and a disaster the first 5 months. I think it would be hard to call it a B+…again compared to the rest of the league’s production. We probably ended at a C+ after spending the first part of the year at a D or D+.
Much of these numbers could get better but for 2009 they were not good…hence the reason our season is now over.
by calbers on Oct 4, 2009 11:11 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
agreed 100%
great job…BMac and Escobar were our ONLY consistent defensive and offensive players…Prado, compared to other 2B gets a B and im not sold it’ll be that way next year…a full year from LaRoche at first would have a been a B+ IMO. and a full year of Nate woulda been a B…Escobar, and MAYBE Mac were the only one’s who deserved A’s in our starting lineup…and that doesn’t win championships…so obviously we need some help this offseason, to say the least
by Hcgadawgs on Oct 5, 2009 12:52 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
"A full year of LaRoche"....
would include his general crap first half.
by Mr. Sanchez on Oct 5, 2009 1:58 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
he still put up some decent power numbers, which woulda helped..seems like he helps the team chemistry alot too
by Hcgadawgs on Oct 5, 2009 2:51 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
if we dont resign LaRoche
you know Chipper is gonna start bitchin about how the organization doesn’t value their players, dont show loyalty to guys here in the past, etc..
Frank Wren for GM of the Year.
"Wait, bait and bash." - Jason Heyward's personal philosophy.
by mvhsbball on Oct 5, 2009 7:04 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
You do?
Remember when the Panthers had a good offensive line? Yeah, me too.
--Darin Gantt
by MichaelProcton on Oct 7, 2009 5:58 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
His first half numbers are still better than what we got from Kotchman this year in the first half and from Thorman in the first half of 07.
"At least he didn’t nail the bitchy fat girl from Hell's Kitchen."
www.dropoutproductions.com
by cbwilk on Oct 5, 2009 4:30 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
This.
Remember when the Panthers had a good offensive line? Yeah, me too.
--Darin Gantt
by MichaelProcton on Oct 7, 2009 5:58 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
ReSigning LaRoche
I think you can make an argument for signing him..and you can make an arguement against signing him. I personally don’t think there are any real other options out there. If he were to sign quickly for a reasonable 2 year deal….done. If he wants 3-4 years and plays the weak market I think you have to let him go to the higher bidder and try to trade for someone or use a less attractive internal option while signing offense for one of the OF corner. Lets be honest about the Braves. They only have 2 positions that need to be addressed right now (assuming Diaz/Church is accetable for a whole year) LF and 1B. If you sign LaRoche you can go for more of a band aid for LF (ie Nady or Byrd or Crisp). If you don’t sign LaRoche you need a legit bat in LF or RF.
by calbers on Oct 5, 2009 10:33 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

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