Keith Law ranks the top-100 minor league players
by gondeee on Jan 22, 2009 3:27 PM EST
in Braves Prospect Reviews
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PrintESPN's Keith Law has his rankings for the top-100 minor league prospects out, and he lists several Braves pretty high.
#3 - Jason Heyward
#9 - Tommy Hanson
#65 - Freddie Freeman
#67 - Jordan Schafer
#88 - Gorkys Hernandez
#97 - Jeff Locke
It's great to see six Braves listed here. Keep in mind that our system is so deep, we can have six guys listed and still have these guys as ex-Braves prospects listed in the top-100:
#4 - Neftali Feliz
#39 - Elvis Andrus
#51 - Tyler Flowers
#77 - Max Ramirez
That's some crazy talent our system has produced. To have one-tenth of that list be current or former Braves is remarkable.
A quick programming note: I'll be doing a prospect Q&A with Keith Law in early February, so keep an eye out for that. Tomorrow, I'll be posting another prospect Q&A with John Sickels.
[UPDATE: 1/22/09 @ 9pm]
Keith Law also did a top-10 for several teams, including the Braves:
1. Jason Heyward, OF
2. Tommy Hanson, RHP
3. Freddie Freeman, OF
4. Jordan Schafer, CF
5. Gorkys Hernandez, CF
6. Jeff Locke, LHP
7. Julio Teheran, RHP
8. Cole Rohrbough, RHP
9. Brandon Hicks, SS
10. Kris Medlen, RHP
Nothing too surprising here. He's higher on Locke than some folks, and it's good to see Hicks and Medlen getting some love. He also ranked the top-ten players at each position, listing Jason Heyward as the top corner outfielder.
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I’ll wait until the guy actually does something before I start crying about it.
I guess I should be one to talk.
There's nights that I can't even walk.
There's days I couldn't give a fuck.
And in between is where I'm stuck.
by Smoltz's Beard on Jan 22, 2009 3:44 PM EST up reply actions
Not talking about you specifically, of course.
I guess I should be one to talk.
There's nights that I can't even walk.
There's days I couldn't give a fuck.
And in between is where I'm stuck.
by Smoltz's Beard on Jan 22, 2009 3:45 PM EST up reply actions
Teheran replaces Feliz, and already has his secondary pitches down…just chill out and wait, everything will be OK. Unless Teheran gets injured, then we cry…
…or if we trade him and three other really good prospects for half a season of two guys that don’t get us to the playoffs.
Great analysis.
I guess I should be one to talk.
There's nights that I can't even walk.
There's days I couldn't give a fuck.
And in between is where I'm stuck.
by Smoltz's Beard on Jan 22, 2009 3:51 PM EST up reply actions
Except that Feliz is much closer to the majors. You can’t even begin to compare the two. If you honestly think Teheran replaces Feliz in any sort of way, you’re delusional.
by drdonkeypunch on Jan 22, 2009 3:50 PM EST up reply actions
Chill the (sorryGONDEEE) out donkeypunch. Teheran is following in Feliz’s footsteps, and already past him in some ways. A season ago, Feliz wasn’t even ranked in the top 100, now hes number 4. So, don’t go crying about Teheran is soooo far behind Feliz. Our rotation is kinda crowded for the next few seasons anyway.
To answer your question, YES, I honestly think Teheran replaces Feliz, call me crazy! “Whoa, hold up” says donkeypunch, “Feliz’s fastball is usually 2MPH faster than Teheran’s”. Maybe Teheran might gain a few pounds living in America, hes at around 150 now. Some additional weight might allow him to put some extra heat on that fastball (hes not gonna stay at 150lbs forever). Teheran’s delivery isn’t as loose as Feliz’s, but not many pitchers throw it as easy as Teheran anyhow(Feliz is in his own class),,,
I kinda get where you say that you can’t compare the two…Teheran already has three pitches he is comfortable with (the heater, a potentially nasty change, and curve)…Feliz is three years older has the dominate fastball with an occasional change, and developing whatever else (hes not comfortable with either).
Even currently, I would say that Teheran is a better all around starting pitching prospect. Feliz is gonna be a dominate closer at the least, but he still has some major question marks as a starter. Not saying that Teheran doesn’t have question marks (mainly his mechanics), he just has a better groundwork to be a starter than Feliz. When Feliz was 17, he was workign on just getting his fastball over the plate…Teheran is the same age and hes already working on his fastball ALONG with a couple other pitches I mentioned earlier.
I’d say they both begin the MLB careers (barring injury) as bullpen hands (like the Twins handled Santana). Of course, Feliz is closer to MLB…but we don’t need Teheran to be ready anytime soon…we are going to be very patient with him (judging by the way the handled him at Danville) and let him become the best he can be. Just be patient, prospect ranking wise, if Teheran has a descent season next year, he will be ranked in the top 50 mlb prospects…if he dominates, he will be top 15…next season he will almost certainly (again barring injury) be one of our top 5 prospects.
When we traded Feliz, there were some people/anaylsts that said he would be a great MLB pitcher. However, theres alot more people talking about Teheran…and don’t worry about him being traded, Wren seems to be pretty adament about trading some guys…
by bwellnjonesco on Jan 22, 2009 4:53 PM EST up reply actions
Well put.
I guess I should be one to talk.
There's nights that I can't even walk.
There's days I couldn't give a fuck.
And in between is where I'm stuck.
by Smoltz's Beard on Jan 22, 2009 5:22 PM EST up reply actions
Two guys with ace potential is always greater than one guy with ace potential. I bet you couldn’t find a scout in baseball who would rather have Teheran than Feliz. Your vastly under-weighting the stage of development in considering who is the better prospect. Teheran is projected to POSSIBLY throw as hard as Feliz currently does and Feliz has a 70-80 fastball overall. Feliz presently has 3 plus pitches while Teheran has to tighten up his CB to have a third. The difference between dominating in AA and throwing 15 innings in Rookie Ball is miles in terms of development. Teheran is too far away to even be comparing him to a guy who has throw 45 innings in AA and likely to make his big league debut this year. Teheran has all the potential to be as good as Feliz but there is so so much that can go wrong between where Teheran is now and where Feliz is now that it isn’t really practical to say that Teheran is a better prospect than Feliz. I think in general, most Braves fans are failing to recognize the likelihood that an 18 year, even one as talented in Teheran is highly unlikely to pan out. If the Rangers call tomorrow and offer Feliz in exchange for Teheran, the Braves are making the exchange without hesitation.
"Fools rush in where fools have been before"
Feliz doesn’t PRESENTLY have three plus pitches…he has the potential to have three, he has the potential to have as many plus pitches as he wants (with his ability to throw out of the slot he uses…however he hasn’t developed any of them to plus pitches…if they were plus pitches he would have had more strike outs at AA then the 47 in 45 IP that he had…its harder to blow his fastball by AA hitters…
Teheran is more advanced than Feliz was at 17…The Braves didn’t even let Feliz professionally pitch when he was 17…
by bwellnjonesco on Jan 22, 2009 9:15 PM EST up reply actions
Feliz presently has 3 plus pitches with life. His ability to maintain his arm slot improved greatly throughout the year. His fastball grades out close to 80, that’s as plus as plus gets. His command isn’t plus but the life and velocity on the pitches are now that he has done a better job with his armslot. Teheran is certainly more advanced as a 17 year than was Feliz and I haven’t said he was isn’t. But are you failing to see how much Teheran must improve to get to the level that Feliz currently is at? The gap between their level of play is HUGE. Probability wise, Teheran wont even achieve the level of success Feliz has at AA. Feliz posted the same hit rate in AA that he did in A ball, so if he isn’t able to blow his FB by as easily, it means he must be getting batters out with his secondary stuff as well in order to maintain the hit rate.
"Fools rush in where fools have been before"
Is there a website that lists the scouts rating of players in the various categories?
I guess I should be one to talk.
There's nights that I can't even walk.
There's days I couldn't give a fuck.
And in between is where I'm stuck.
by Smoltz's Beard on Jan 23, 2009 9:03 AM EST up reply actions
I wish. If there is, I haven’t found it.
by mattdiaz4life on Jan 23, 2009 3:07 PM EST up reply actions
Reason I ask is because I’ve seen posters like Jeg make mention of it, and wanted to do some research on it myself. Oh well.
I guess I should be one to talk.
There's nights that I can't even walk.
There's days I couldn't give a fuck.
And in between is where I'm stuck.
by Smoltz's Beard on Jan 23, 2009 3:16 PM EST up reply actions
Feliz’s FB grade came from BA. I don’t know anywhere that has specific ratings for all players but most of the stuff I’ve seen with grades comes from BA, BP, and the ESPN crew and their chats.
This link,
http://redlegsbaseball.blogspot.com/2008/12/word-about-20-80-scouting-scale.html
has a detailed explanation of the system if anyone is interested but doesn’t contain any actual scouting reports
"Fools rush in where fools have been before"
Everyone gets upset
about Feliz and Andrus getting traded to the Rangers in the Tex trade but I try to forget we traded Max Ramirez for Bob Wickman. Granted, Wickman was a good closer for a short time period but Ramirez seems to be valued pretty highly. Of course he is also a catcher and we have one of those already.
I am not too worried about Feliz putting up great numbers until he actually does it. I think it is a testament to our farm system that we have so many players and ex-players in the top 100 as well.
When we made the trade with the Rangers did anyone honestly think that none of the players we gave up were ever going to be any good. We made a trade for a very good player and we gave up some guys who might be good or might never do anything. Harrison is the only guy from that trade that has even pitched in the major leagues and he wasn’t that good. I will be pissed if the rest of the guys become all stars to, but there’s no sense in whining about it now you can’t get them back.
2 things...
1 is that i noticed jason heyward is the youngest player in the top 10 and beyond. He is all upside and i cant wait too see what he does with it.
2 is that there is a fairly large drop off of prospects from 9 to 65. Not a huge deal because a lot of our prospects are under AA but next year’s ranking will say a lot about the progress these upside prospects have made.
Also, because I’m an absolute tool, I skimmed the KLAW Spanish chat and picked up a couple of Braves related questions. Sorry about the horrible translation…its the best you can get for FREE.
Edwin (Bogota, Colombia) : Keith: between Ernesto Frieri and July Teheran (Pitchers Colombian), who you believe that have but possibilities to arrive at the older leagues?
SportsNation Keith Law: Teheran is one of the better launchers in the smaller leagues but its season was finished early because had a pain in the shoulder. The Braves decided that Teheran should rest the arm because they did not want that suffer a lesion large. When the arm is healthy, Teheran throws a good straight line from 94 to 97 milas for hour with an excellent change.
Ignacio Heron (Monterrey N.L.) : Hello Keith a greeting, mji asks is that aspirations you can give to the brave of atlanta the following season, the credits of pitcheo seems that to take form but to the offensive I believe that someone lacks him explosive jonronero, a fourth one bat, they had it with mark texeira that I did not know because left brave.
SportsNation Keith Law: Exact, the offensive lacks one or two batters. It needs a left or right gardener that provides to be able and patience. The average to be reach base is the most important statistics of all, and Jeff Francouer had the lower average to be reach base of all the batters in MLB in last season.
“left or right gardener”. Awesome. And the English…
Cameron (Atlanta): I was a little suprised to see that you ranked Jeff Locke ahead of Julio Teheran(RHP) and Cole Rohrbough(LHP). Do the other two have a higher ceiling?
SportsNation Keith Law: Teheran missed most of the season after tweaking his shoulder. Rohrbough was also hurt and lost some key development time. Locke was healthy, effective, and clearly projects as a starter.
Kevin (GA): I have NINE current and former Braves prospects. FIVE of them are in the Top 50. Simply incredible that they are still as deep as they are.
SportsNation Keith Law: It really is. They’re a scouting machine.
HIP HIP HOORAY
James (LA): I really believe that Jason Heyward is a better hitter than Jeff Francoeur, like, right now this instant.
SportsNation Keith Law: This is not a stretch.
I laughed. OK, I’m done now.
BIG JOE SUCK ONE
i wonder if Jeff reads the blogs with CHipper
"We win today, that's two in a row... if we win tomorrow, that's called a winning streak. It has happened before..."
If by “work” you mean “ground into” and if by “computer” you mean "double plays.
Then yes. Quite Well.
by Euruproktos on Jan 23, 2009 12:21 AM EST up reply actions
+1
"…aren’t worthy enough to hold his (Pujols) ass cheeks apart while Playboy models wipe him with thousand dollar bills after he craps out the cure to whatever previously-incurable disease." by royhobbs 1/7/09
I’m still laughing at this.
I guess I should be one to talk.
There's nights that I can't even walk.
There's days I couldn't give a fuck.
And in between is where I'm stuck.
by Smoltz's Beard on Jan 23, 2009 6:56 PM EST up reply actions
Watch this video of Hanson and forget about Feliz
http://www.drivelinemechanics.com/2008/12/12/690731/pitching-mechanics-tommy-h
I can’t wait to watch this guy throw. I assume they’ll at least wait a month to delay the arbitration clock.
It's ok but...
I really really don’t like Cole Rohrbough behind Jeff Locke.
"The only time the Mets win is in the offseason"
Fun reads.
It’s too bad ESPN has that insider garbage.
Of the Braves top 20 prospects, I’d say Cody Johnson has the best ooportunity to improve his stock. After last years K fest, he seems to be a forgotten player. He definately has talent and room to grow. Hopefully he improves to the point that he moves himself into several top 100 lists next season. At present he still has youth on his side. However, he needs to show better plate discipline now. Last years k totals were brutal.
I still see star potential in him.
I don’t think it’s ever gonna be anything but a K-fest for Cody, but he’s gonna crush enough that it won’t matter. With his insane power he’s gonna get enough walks to turn into an Adam Dunn like guy that makes up for the hits he doesn’t get. And his swing has improved dramatically from when he was drafted; it used to have an enormous hole and now it has a decent sized one. But the kid is good and he’s still really young, so I agree with you that he could rocket up. If he still hits a bunch of dingers with Myrtle Beach you know he’s legit cause that place is a cavern.
www.dropoutproductions.com
I really don’t like the Dunn comp because their performance relative to their level of play is different. Dunn hit well in the minors, .300 career average and struck out 101 times in his worst season. Cody struck out 177 times last season. Statistically, Ryan Howard compares a little better to Cody than Dunn. He has to make much more contact to be equivalent to Dunn. Cody is still young and really improved later in the year but at this point, he really needs to continue to turn the corner to become a real prospect. If he doesn’t improve his ability to make consistent contact and cut down on the K’s, he will be Russell Branyan.
"Fools rush in where fools have been before"
I didn’t mean to specifically say he compared well to Dunn (in fact in a very old post I pointed out the discrepancies you just pointed out), but to say that he could become one of those three product hitters like Dunn, and certainly like Howard.
You’re definitely right in that he has a long way to go. But, he’s young and has three more levels of the minors to tackle and hone his game. And, to me, there’s nothing wrong with being Russell Branyan, the dude keeps popping up on somebody’s bench. Most years I wish the Braves had a guy with his kind of pop on the bench.
www.dropoutproductions.com
One more from KLAW for the road.
Atlanta Braves
Julio Teheran (Rookie) is a right-handed pitcher from Colombia who probably would have made the list this year if he’d stayed healthy, but he had a slightly sore shoulder and Atlanta shut him down right away as a precautionary measure. Teheran, who earns a lot of comps to Felix Hernandez, sits at 94-97 mph with life on his fastball, shows a good changeup, and has very good feel for someone who will turn 18 next week. And look for left-hander Cole Rohrbough (A+) to return to the top 100 next year if he stays healthy all season.
SWAGGA LIKE BJONES, SWAGGA LIKE BJONES
JOE-BO FOR THE BENCH IN 09
Gondeee
Or anybody else for that matter, is there another way I can get this complete list without paying for Insider. I’m actually doing a Fantasy Draft and the MLB portion is over and we are in the middle of the MiLB part. I would love something else to look at because I am struggling late in the draft.
"The only time the Mets win is in the offseason"
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