Braves Winter League Update
by gondeee on Nov 9, 2008 12:08 PM EST
54 comments
It's been a while, but there's still a bunch of guys toiling away in winter baseball. First off, major league baseball is finally giving us fans who really want to keep up with our team's players in the winter leagues a great tool -- per organizational statistics. Check out the stats here. We'll take a glance through these stats and break them down into four categories.
The Great
Tommy Hanson, P (AFL) - He did give up a run on Thursday, but that just means his ERA is 0.48. In 5 games and 18.2 innings pitched he has 30 strikeouts, only 4 walks and 6 hits allowed. If we trade this kind of talent, there will be calls for Frank Wren's head by some fans.
Tyler Flowers, C (AFL) - Hitting .352 with 7 HR, a 1.324 OPS. He still needs to watch the strikeouts, 18 SO in 15 games.
Diory Hernandez, SS (DWL) - Yes, Diory Hernandez. He's reminding me of the breakout that Gregor Blanco had last winter. A .340 average, 5 HR, a 1.138 OPS in 16 games.
The Good
Matt Young, OF (AFL) - He's enjoying another stint in the AFL by hitting .346 with a .973 OPS. He plate discipline is also encouraging with 13 walks in 7 strikeouts in 22 games.
Johnny Venters, P (HWB) - He could be emerging as a pitching prospect on a clear path to Atlanta. He has a 3.12 ERA in 26 innings pitched, and 8 BB verses 22 SO.
Stephen Marek, P (AFL) - No earned runs allowed in 9 one-inning outings. Only 5 SO keeps him from the great category.
Kris Medlen, P (AFL) - A 3.00 ERA in 15 IP, and 17 SO verses 1 BB and 12 hits -- still showing the same stuff he flashed during the regular season.
The Bad
Van Pope, 3B (AFL) - Still showing nothing and no signs of turning it around. A .250 BA and a .639 OPS with no real power. Disappointing.
Jordan Schafer, CF (MWL) - It's tough to list him here, and even though the .281 BA is okay, he's not showing any power and he's striking out way too much (23 SO in 24 G). He is showing good speed with 7 SB in 8 attempts.
Jose Ortegano, P (VWL) - Coming back from injuries during the regular season, he's struggling against tough competition. 6.57 ERA in 12.1 IP, only 6 SO.
The Awful
Kala Ka'aihue, 1B (HWB) - He's only hitting .257, and he does have 4 HR, but 34 strikeouts in 22 games!
Michael Broadway, P (HWB) - A 10.39 ERA and a .370 BAA. The big indicator here is 16 BB verses 8 SO in 13 IP, not to mention 20 hits.
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Van Pope, Schafer and Ka’aihue are not surprising at all, if anyone’s surprised by this they didn’t pay attention this season.
by RainDelay on Nov 9, 2008 12:24 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
Are we talking about the same Schafer that tore up the Southern League?
by 17843 on Nov 9, 2008 10:24 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
He..
…rebounded during the second half to a point. But nothing that was “tearing up” the southern league. He barely cracked the Top 20 in wOBA in the Southern League. Maybe I’m just not see what others are, and honestly IMO is over hyped.
by RainDelay on Nov 9, 2008 10:33 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
He’s not overhyped. The kid is the real deal. He’s a pure athlete and a gamer.
by cbwilk on Nov 9, 2008 10:53 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
If he hits as an average major leaguer (he had a .263 EqA in AA this year) and plays 150 games, we’re looking at a ~1.5-2 win above average player based on defense alone. That’s if he doesn’t prove to be anything remotely special with the bat. Others may be overhyping him if they expect him to certainly be a star, but I’m not.
by 17843 on Nov 9, 2008 11:02 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Stats Do Not Tell the Story
In ‘07 Schafer led all the minors in base hits. His defense was talked about as being similar to Andruw with his ability to anticipate and his speed. He has a Frenchy arm. He was suspended 50 games and then moved up a level in competition to AA. As we know, AA is where the talent is usually seperated from the wantabes. He struggled the first month or so. The last month or so, he did “tear up the league.” I believe he had 6 HRs, hit well over .300, .400+ OBP and had double digit RBIs. He showed he could hit in ST last year and will get another chance this spring to see if he is for real. Nearly every scout who acutally sees him play raves about him. HIs most serious flaw is his lack of success against LHers. He barely hits his weight against them at AA. ML lefites will own him at this point. If you don’t see it, you are not looking.
by braves99 on Nov 10, 2008 8:31 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
his second to last month in the league, he was the drizzling shits.
Following the Braves...one long hard drink at a time.
by bigjoe on Nov 10, 2008 9:49 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Tommy Hanson will not be traded. He is basically being billed as the next Smoltzie at this point, right? Speaking of Smoltzie, any news on him lately? I think I read a little while ago that he would not be updating anyone on anything until Spring Training.
Is that a SS I see in your great list? I haven’t the slightest who Hernandez is, guess I’ll have to head over to MiLB.com and do some research?
Is Schafer tanking to decrease his value so he doesn’t get traded? Yeah, I don’t think so either. Maybe he needs some more juice? Just more evidence that Schafer isn’t ready yet.
If only Marek and Medlen could merge their abilities to form a single complete pitcher. Any chance either of these guys help out the bully in 2009? A healthy Gonzo and Soriano would be huge, but also never going to happen?
by TheSportsIdiot on Nov 9, 2008 12:26 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
I’m not sure how 110 PAs can be indicative of anything especially when the only negative is a lack of power, which he showed plenty of the last two seasons. I’d be more worried if he was being touted as preforming highly based only on a .400 BABIP and weak peripherals.
by 17843 on Nov 9, 2008 10:33 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Hey, Diory Hernandez. I’ve been talking him up as a possible utility player for next season all year. Nice to see him putting some number behind my belief.
by cbwilk on Nov 9, 2008 12:30 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
I really like Hernandez...
…he tore it up at two different levels this season. And could be a valuable addition, he can play short and 2B. I hope he gets a long look this spring. I think he should be showing up in Top prospect lists.
by RainDelay on Nov 9, 2008 12:32 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Are you saying that you think he makes Escobar a little bit more expendable than people are claiming?
by TheSportsIdiot on Nov 9, 2008 12:33 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I'm not sure I'd go that far..
…but the kid’s got skills.
here’s his combined line from this year (AA/AAA)
.287/.320/.710 with a BABIP of .328
I’m not sure if he’s major league ready, but if he continues the success he had last season I see no reason why he doesn’t compete for a job. At one point, he was playing more at short in Richmond than Lillibridge.
by RainDelay on Nov 9, 2008 12:38 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Diory Hernandez walked only 26 times in 536 ABs last year in the minors. That’s horrible and even worse than Francoeur.
by BravesFan on Nov 9, 2008 2:10 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Let me think...
actually let me quote what I said…
I’m not sure if he’s major league ready
That’s what I said. Was I advocating him being a MLer in 2009? No, but I think he should at the least get a good look.
He posted a better wOBA in AA than in Triple A, but nothing that was overly horrible.
by RainDelay on Nov 9, 2008 2:14 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I don’t think Diory is in any way a starting shortstop in the major leagues. He just doesn’t have it at that position defensively. He’s much better at short where his slightly squat body doesn’t look as rough as it does at short. He’s a very good hitter, though the doesn’t really have that much power (really he’s like a slightly more athletic Martin Prado), and he’s versatile, playing short, second and third. He should get a shot to help off the bench, maybe take the place Ruben Gotay had for a good part of this season.
And those times Diory was playing more short than Lillly was cause Lilly had a ton of nagging injuries throughout the year, mostly in his hand and wrist. He probably wasn’t at 80% all year and it showed in his numbers.
by cbwilk on Nov 9, 2008 1:43 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Well there was the injury..
..and the fact it took him damn near all season to get his BA above .200.
by RainDelay on Nov 9, 2008 2:25 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
A huge part of hitting is in the hands and watching Lilly this year you could see his confidence was never there. He was wincing a lot, even on missed swings. He didn’t even look like the same player from when I’d seen him with Lynchburg two years ago and Richmond last year. I think the injury affected him a lot more than anybody let on and hopefully he’ll be healthy this season and show everyone what he can really do. When he’s on, to me he’s as impressive as anyone. In 2007 during the International League Playoffs he was a monster.
by cbwilk on Nov 9, 2008 3:30 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Agreed..
..you’ve obviously seen him a lot more than me (I am on the West Coast after all) so I’ll take your eyes word for it.
Never seen any IL game, though did see a lot of PCL games this summer working for BIS.
by RainDelay on Nov 9, 2008 3:32 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I’ve only ever seen two PCL games, one weekend in Nashville. But, I got to see Prince Fielder, Rickie Weeks, Brad Nelson, Buddy Carlyle, Willy Aybar, Connor Jackson, Carlos Quentin, Phil Stockman, and Rodger McDowell, so it wasn’t a bad couple of days.
by cbwilk on Nov 9, 2008 3:52 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Ka'aihue...
still has an .822 OPS. I understand the strikeouts are a big concern, but he’s still showed the plate discipline to post an isoOBP over .100, and an isolated power of exactly .200. Again, I’m not trying to downplay the K’s, but his secondary skills are really good.
by tgthree on Nov 9, 2008 3:18 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
Small sample size caveat, but Ka’aihue should really be destroying the HWL. The prospects are largely several years and several levels behind him developmentally. That he is still showing contact issues against such pitching is worrisome.
by 17843 on Nov 9, 2008 10:35 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Great point about the level of play in Hawaii. KK really seems to have trouble early in the season, regardless of the season. I like him, but I just don’t see him developing into an everyday, consistent major leaguer.
by cbwilk on Nov 9, 2008 10:56 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
i was looking forward to a heyward, schafer, gorkys outfield in a couple years but now i kind of would like to see schafer go in a peavy trade
by #1bravesfan on Nov 9, 2008 4:48 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
Actually, it’s sounding like Gorkys Hernandez will be the one to go in the Peavy trade. Scott Miller of CBS Sports broke the rumor a couple days ago; it has since been confirmed by David O’Brien of the AJC and Buster Olney of ESPN.
Gorkys’ inclusion makes a ton of sense in my opinion, since he’s effectively blocked and we have a more immediate need for Schafer. Also, I see a great deal of risk for Hernandez, since he really needs to develop some patience to truly become an elite leadoff hitter. It’s been done before, but patience can prove to be a very hard skill to develop. When you read about failed prospects, one of the common themes is that they couldn’t develop the plate discipline that they needed. Gorkys could still be very good one day, but I think the risk makes sense from the Braves’ end, given Schafer’s presence and the obvious need for Peavy.
by tgthree on Nov 9, 2008 5:19 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
As much as I hate him, one leadoff hitter in particular that was able to accomplish just what you said was Jose Reyes. Almost like the kid learned how to take a walk overnight.
I guess I should be one to talk.
There's nights that I can't even walk.
There's days I couldn't give a fuck.
And in between is where I'm stuck.
by Smoltz's Beard on Nov 10, 2008 11:44 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
idk in a couple years i want
1, hernandez
2. Brandon Hicks
3. Chipper Jones (if hes still here)
4. Heyward
5. McCann
6. Freeman
7 Schafer
8. Prado
1. Peavy
2 Burnette
3 Jurjiens
4 Campillo
5 Hason
by #1bravesfan on Nov 9, 2008 5:30 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
where are the positions for these guys
"We win today, that's two in a row... if we win tomorrow, that's called a winning streak. It has happened before..."
by Swo12bv on Nov 9, 2008 10:45 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
you honestly don’t know where all those guys play?
Following the Braves...one long hard drink at a time.
by bigjoe on Nov 10, 2008 9:50 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
any thought?
what would you do differently
by #1bravesfan on Nov 9, 2008 5:46 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
The probability of having five hitters currently in the minors in the everyday lineup in a few years is pretty much next to nothing. Especially since two of them, Heyward and Freeman, have only played at Low A (excluding a week and the playoffs for Heyward).
There’s also a pretty low probability that Jorge Campillo will actually be in the major leagues by the time that could happen, much less be starting for the Braves.
by cbwilk on Nov 9, 2008 6:24 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
and who is burnette?
im assuming Hanson is slotted at 5, simple typing error, and maybe ur just posting it as the 5 guys in our rotation, not actually slotting them at their location as a ace or nbr 2 or what have u.. but i dont see Hanson as a nbr 5 starter, he is clearly a nbr 3 starter at the worst, IMHO.
and i have to agree that Campillo is relatively old and will no longer be with the braves, or at least will be moved to long relief.
Also i want to clarify is the Hernandez the GOrkys or Diory, i assume Goryks, but seeign as a part of this thread was designated to the mystery that is diory i just wanted to make sure. I also think its interesting Yunel and KJ are no where to be found.
on a ntoher note i find it hard to beleive (as much as it pains me to say) that by the time freeman/ heyward make it to the majors (if they do in fact make it)… that Chipper will still be here. And that he is still playing 3B, as that is apparently where u haev slotted him.
"We win today, that's two in a row... if we win tomorrow, that's called a winning streak. It has happened before..."
by Swo12bv on Nov 9, 2008 10:50 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Good point on Chipper. There’s a chance he won’t be there in 2012.
by cbwilk on Nov 9, 2008 10:55 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I’ve got a hard on for Hanson. There, I said it.
I guess I should be one to talk.
There's nights that I can't even walk.
There's days I couldn't give a fuck.
And in between is where I'm stuck.
by Smoltz's Beard on Nov 10, 2008 11:37 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
You could start a little club when he makes it to the show, “Hanson’s Hard Ons”. Show up to the games that he pitches in giant penis costumes.
by cbwilk on Nov 10, 2008 12:31 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
+1
I’m remembering this.
I guess I should be one to talk.
There's nights that I can't even walk.
There's days I couldn't give a fuck.
And in between is where I'm stuck.
by Smoltz's Beard on Nov 10, 2008 12:58 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Wow
All the horrible ways this could go, without even using the terms, “standing ovation,” “quality start,” “good outing,” “wind-up,” “stretch,” or any other common baseball vernacular.
No wonder nobody likes you, Tuttle... everything's a (Pujols) damn debate.
by royhobbs on Nov 10, 2008 1:32 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
You forgot “passed ball”.
I guess I should be one to talk.
There's nights that I can't even walk.
There's days I couldn't give a fuck.
And in between is where I'm stuck.
by Smoltz's Beard on Nov 10, 2008 3:39 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I sure as hell wouldn’t try this in Atlanta, but I’m up for some good old fashioned away-team jackassery at like, say, Nationals Park.
“Hanson’s Hard Ons leads rookie right-hander to brilliant finish” Every bit of that sounds absolutely awful.
No wonder nobody likes you, Tuttle... everything's a (Pujols) damn debate.
by royhobbs on Nov 10, 2008 3:48 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
“Hanson almost gives way to a reliever, but he seals the deal in the longest outing of his career”.
This might be getting out of hand…
I guess I should be one to talk.
There's nights that I can't even walk.
There's days I couldn't give a fuck.
And in between is where I'm stuck.
by Smoltz's Beard on Nov 10, 2008 3:57 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
ah um…“this might be getting out of hand..”
thats what she said…………im sorry
"We win today, that's two in a row... if we win tomorrow, that's called a winning streak. It has happened before..."
by Swo12bv on Nov 10, 2008 4:01 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
so when we hit up baltimore next season…are we renting, or buying the costumes?
Following the Braves...one long hard drink at a time.
by bigjoe on Nov 10, 2008 9:51 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
You gotta buy. A giant penis suit pays for itself after the third time you wear it.
by cbwilk on Nov 10, 2008 10:43 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
seconded. there’s a really good gentlemen’s club not far from Camden Yards we could cash in on with those things afterwards too.
No wonder nobody likes you, Tuttle... everything's a (Pujols) damn debate.
by royhobbs on Nov 11, 2008 8:48 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Last time I went to Camden Yards I drove by that place on the way out. Sketch-ball central.
I guess I should be one to talk.
There's nights that I can't even walk.
There's days I couldn't give a fuck.
And in between is where I'm stuck.
by Smoltz's Beard on Nov 11, 2008 11:16 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
You don’t even know where I’m talking about.
No wonder nobody likes you, Tuttle... everything's a (Pujols) damn debate.
by royhobbs on Nov 11, 2008 12:13 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Name?
I guess I should be one to talk.
There's nights that I can't even walk.
There's days I couldn't give a fuck.
And in between is where I'm stuck.
by Smoltz's Beard on Nov 11, 2008 12:17 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Night Shift
No wonder nobody likes you, Tuttle... everything's a (Pujols) damn debate.
by royhobbs on Nov 11, 2008 12:21 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Yup, that’s the one.
Haha, just kidding. Can’t remember the name of the one we drove by but it was extremely close to the stadium and quite sleazy.
I guess I should be one to talk.
There's nights that I can't even walk.
There's days I couldn't give a fuck.
And in between is where I'm stuck.
by Smoltz's Beard on Nov 11, 2008 12:31 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
You should come too
A picture of Hanson’s Hard Ons in front of the 2,632 Warehouse would be priceless.
No wonder nobody likes you, Tuttle... everything's a (Pujols) damn debate.
by royhobbs on Nov 11, 2008 12:34 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
holding chicken from boog’s. hell yeah!
Following the Braves...one long hard drink at a time.
by bigjoe on Nov 11, 2008 3:20 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Haha, classic.
I guess I should be one to talk.
There's nights that I can't even walk.
There's days I couldn't give a fuck.
And in between is where I'm stuck.
by Smoltz's Beard on Nov 11, 2008 11:15 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Young in the AFL
Inre: “Matt Young, OF (AFL) – He’s enjoying another stint in the AFL ….”
???
This is Young’s first season of fall ball.
Also, looking at his stats indicates he’s a top producer. He went 3-5 in the leadoff position with 2 doubles and a walk two days ago, and yesterday he went 2-4 with a homer and a 2-out RBI batting 2nd. He’s hitting .363 with 23 RBIs and plays every day in the AFL.
This in characteristic of his season at Pearl, where he was a fan favorite. Why aren’t the Braves higher on this guy?
by BraveTexan on Nov 14, 2008 9:35 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
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